Colonel John

[jcs11204]

Does anyone want to talk about him ?
I just read he's going to saratoga for the summer, i looked at his pp's very talented horse... i think he can make some big noise in the division this summer, and he has handled all synthetic tracks.... that is a obvious plus, with the breeders cup in cali this year and next.
pedigree says he will get better with age, i really do see a big second half of the seasson for him

[NTamm1215]

There was a great amount of discussion about him prior to the Derby and I know DrugS made it clear on this site that Tiznow's progeny are doing extraordinarily well on synthetic surfaces. Thus, Colonel John's ability to win a race like the Travers is completely unknown until he tries conventional dirt again.

I can tell you this much, if he comes into the Travers off of a good race in the Swaps but with no dirt race since the Derby, I'll bet against him with both fists.

NT

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

There was a great amount of discussion about him prior to the Derby and I know DrugS made it clear on this site that Tiznow's progeny are doing extraordinarily well on synthetic surfaces. Thus, Colonel John's ability to win a race like the Travers is completely unknown until he tries conventional dirt again.

I can tell you this much, if he comes into the Travers off of a good race in the Swaps but with no dirt race since the Derby, I'll bet against him with both fists.

NT

swaps ? i read today hes already at saratoga.

[texarkana]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

swaps ? i read today hes already at saratoga.

Huh? As of last week he was still at Hollywood Park and they were talking Swaps...

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by texarkana

Huh? As of last week he was still at Hollywood Park and they were talking Swaps...

my local paper says that he is going to saratoga.... hold on im going to check it

[jcs11204]

ok i read it wrong, i guess he could be going swaps then to saratoga... here is the paragraph...

One-time top Derby candidate Pyro, who recently won the Northern Dancer at Churchill Downs for trainer Steve Asmussen, is another candidate. Trainers Todd Pletcher of Ready’s Echo and Behindatthebar, Dallas Stewart of Macho Again and Eoin Harty of Colonel John will also be on the grounds this summer, and none of their horses have been ruled out.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

There was a great amount of discussion about him prior to the Derby and I know DrugS made it clear on this site that Tiznow's progeny are doing extraordinarily well on synthetic surfaces. Thus, Colonel John's ability to win a race like the Travers is completely unknown until he tries conventional dirt again.

I can tell you this much, if he comes into the Travers off of a good race in the Swaps but with no dirt race since the Derby, I'll bet against him with both fists.

NT

at this point, if your looking at the big picture he has to be a very legit horse, just because of his success on synthetics and the fact that the breeders cup is run over it.
i still think his run in the santa anita derby was very explosive.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

There was a great amount of discussion about him prior to the Derby and I know DrugS made it clear on this site that Tiznow's progeny are doing extraordinarily well on synthetic surfaces. Thus, Colonel John's ability to win a race like the Travers is completely unknown until he tries conventional dirt again.

I can tell you this much, if he comes into the Travers off of a good race in the Swaps but with no dirt race since the Derby, I'll bet against him with both fists.

NT

I was disappointed Colonel John didn't contest either of the remain TC races. He showed in his CD workout, which may have been a bit too fast in retrospect (sub-58 for 5f) that he could handle the dirt. In the Derby, as is typical of Corey Nakatani in that race (see Halory Hunter, AP Valentine, Alyrob, etc), he was placed way too far back in the field to make an impact. Whereas he was typically no more than 5 or 6 off the pace (and even sometimes right on top of it) in his previous starts, having him nearly 20 lengths arrears early certainly didn't put him in position to win, particularly when he's displayed more of a "grinder"-type finish in his off-the-pace efforts. Regardless, he did make a big middle move to at least reach the second flight of horse before failing to sustain his bid, none which suggests that the surface was much of a problem.

I suppose he skipped the last two classics to prepare for this second half. Unfortunately, now, he faces what may be a much tougher Swaps then previously anticipated. Two Step Salsa (who at this stage is still on the fence) has been monstrous on the lead in his last pair going 7f and 8.5f. The Swaps figures to come up light in field size and pace, putting this colt in prime position to derail Colonel John's summer, right off the bat.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I was disappointed Colonel John didn't contest either of the remain TC races. He showed in his CD workout, which may have been a bit too fast in retrospect (sub-58 for 5f) that he could handle the dirt. In the Derby, as is typical of Corey Nakatani in that race (see Halory Hunter, AP Valentine, Alyrob, etc), he was placed way too far back in the field to make an impact. Whereas he was typically no more than 5 or 6 off the pace (and even sometimes right on top of it) in his previous starts, having him nearly 20 lengths arrears early certainly didn't put him in position to win, particularly when he's displayed more of a "grinder"-type finish in his off-the-pace efforts. Regardless, he did make a big middle move to at least reach the second flight of horse before failing to sustain his bid, none which suggests that the surface was much of a problem.

I suppose he skipped the last two classics to prepare for this second half. Unfortunately, now, he faces what may be a much tougher Swaps then previously anticipated. Two Step Salsa (who at this stage is still on the fence) has been monstrous on the lead in his last pair going 7f and 8.5f. The Swaps figures to come up light in field size and pace, putting this colt in prime position to derail Colonel John's summer, right off the bat.

grinder ? i saw a explosive turn of foot in the santa anita derby

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by jcs11204

grinder ? i saw a explosive turn of foot in the santa anita derby

He was under heavy pressure to get going from behind at the 1/4 pole and a lot of his dramatic rush to the wire was probably aided by sprinter Bob Black Jack yielding late. His Hollywood Futurity run suggests the same.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I was disappointed Colonel John didn't contest either of the remain TC races. He showed in his CD workout, which may have been a bit too fast in retrospect (sub-58 for 5f) that he could handle the dirt. In the Derby, as is typical of Corey Nakatani in that race (see Halory Hunter, AP Valentine, Alyrob, etc), he was placed way too far back in the field to make an impact. Whereas he was typically no more than 5 or 6 off the pace (and even sometimes right on top of it) in his previous starts, having him nearly 20 lengths arrears early certainly didn't put him in position to win, particularly when he's displayed more of a "grinder"-type finish in his off-the-pace efforts. Regardless, he did make a big middle move to at least reach the second flight of horse before failing to sustain his bid, none which suggests that the surface was much of a problem.

I suppose he skipped the last two classics to prepare for this second half. Unfortunately, now, he faces what may be a much tougher Swaps then previously anticipated. Two Step Salsa (who at this stage is still on the fence) has been monstrous on the lead in his last pair going 7f and 8.5f. The Swaps figures to come up light in field size and pace, putting this colt in prime position to derail Colonel John's summer, right off the bat.

also the swaps is just a comeback race, a prep for bigger things. if he runs a good second to a very sharp horse like TSS, im sure the connections will be happy, and ready to move forward to saratoga.

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Two Step Salsa (who at this stage is still on the fence) has been monstrous on the lead in his last pair going 7f and 8.5f. The Swaps figures to come up light in field size and pace, putting this colt in prime position to derail Colonel John's summer, right off the bat.

Holy cow.

Just watched those replays. Horse runs very hard early and still has gas in the tank.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Holy cow.

Just watched those replays. Horse runs very hard early and still has gas in the tank.

Not that they are particularly top class monsters, but when good horses like Salute The Sarge and Dixie Chatter come at you at the 3/8s pole with threatening runs and you rip their heads off down the lane, you've got to be considered one very promising race horse.

Let's see what how he finishes when he actually has a worthy pace rival early, however.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Not that they are particularly top class monsters, but when good horses like Salute The Sarge and Dixie Chatter come at you at the 3/8s pole with threatening runs and you rip their heads off down the lane, you've got to be considered one very promising race horse.

Let's see what how he finishes when he actually has a worthy pace rival early, however.

i might be wrong, but wasen't he on easy leads all alone in his last 2 ?
pace is the key to every race....

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

There was a great amount of discussion about him prior to the Derby and I know DrugS made it clear on this site that Tiznow's progeny are doing extraordinarily well on synthetic surfaces....,

NT

.. and on dirt and on turf (Da' Tara and Tizdejavu). Tiznow, a dirt horse with natural stamina, sires horses who run well on all surfaces. Polytrack, one among the many types of AW (all-weather) surfaces, generally demands more stamina and/or fitness than average, and the Tiznows have the stamina part.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann

.. and on dirt and on turf (Da' Tara and Tizdejavu). Tiznow, a dirt horse with natural stamina, sires horses who run well on all surfaces. Polytrack, one among the many types of AW (all-weather) surfaces, generally demands more stamina and/or fitness than average, and the Tiznows have the stamina part.

Perhaps it's bold of me to challenge the opinion of someone who calls themself "Pedigree" Ann but Tizdejavu seems to be the exception to the rule when it comes to Tiznow's progeny trying the turf. He has had numerous stakes winners and stakes-placed runners, however, they were primarily on dirt/synthetics.

Tough Tiz's Sis, Bear Now, Well Armed, and Colonel John all come to mind as Tiznow's biggest names (in addition to Da'Tara) and they are all stakes winners- on synthetics.

NT

Folklore pops out. 2 year old champion filly. She ran on dirt and broke her knee as a 3 yr old forcing her retirement. No Tiznow turf runners come right to mind.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Anyone else think this is Sumitas?

Hmmmmmmmmmm......Let's see.

[3kings]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Anyone else think this is Sumitas?

Yes, the same new poster appeared in another thread and then Golden Missile's voyeur suddenly appeared later in the thread. Nice work Hoss.

[jcs11204]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Perhaps it's bold of me to challenge the opinion of someone who calls themself "Pedigree" Ann but Tizdejavu seems to be the exception to the rule when it comes to Tiznow's progeny trying the turf. He has had numerous stakes winners and stakes-placed runners, however, they were primarily on dirt/synthetics.

Tough Tiz's Sis, Bear Now, Well Armed, and Colonel John all come to mind as Tiznow's biggest names (in addition to Da'Tara) and they are all stakes winners- on synthetics.

NT

tiznow is a all around great sire... i dont see why it matters, he can produce on any surface.