unions killing jobs...

[Cannon Shell]

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/23/op...ml?ref=opinion

[Clip-Clop]

These people are out of their fricking minds. Period.

[joeydb]

I didn't think this was news.

I accept "unions killing jobs" as an axiom, much in the same way that light has a constant speed and gravity causes the same acceleration regardless of object mass.

It's just how it works. The unions, and the Democrats, can't help themselves.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by joeydb

I accept "unions killing jobs" as an axiom, much in the same way that light has a constant speed and gravity causes the same acceleration regardless of object mass.

Except "unions killing jobs" as an absolute axiom doesn't stand up to routine scientific proofs. Just sayin', you know, if you are going to form your opinions via truth and objectivity <g>

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

Except "unions killing jobs" as an absolute axiom doesn't stand up to routine scientific proofs. Just sayin', you know, if you are going to form your opinions via truth and objectivity <g>

Ok unions killing non-union jobs? I guess since you cant knock the source of this piece you are going to try to confuse people with...science? How anyone can claim that they were once a card carrying member of the GOP and yet rush to the defense of unions on every occasion is puzzling because unlike religious beliefs or social issues on which the GOP may have shifted to the right in recent years, they have long been in opposition (for the most part correctly) of the politicalization and destructive power of unions.

Do you support the Boeing employees union position in this case?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Ok unions killing non-union jobs? I guess since you cant knock the source of this piece you are going to try to confuse people with...science?

It's an opinion piece. I disagree with much of it. Various unions have done great things for workers over the years.

Joey brought up science, not me. Thus he's outlined the parameters of his argument. Not me.

How anyone can claim that they were once a card carrying member of the GOP and yet rush to the defense of unions on every occasion is puzzling because unlike religious beliefs or social issues on which the GOP may have shifted to the right in recent years, they have long been in opposition (for the most part correctly) of the politicalization and destructive power of unions.

Some people constantly reflect, learn and change their minds over time based upon new information.

And I do not "rush to the defense of unions", I rush to the defense of the right to unionize. I will always fight against union-busting.

A rather significant nuance. I have personal experience with seeing union members make less money and gain less benefits, from an employer, than non-union members. It's not always best to be in a union. But it's not always terrible, for either the union or the employer. Unions have given us weekends, 8 hour days, and minimum wage and job safety protections, and child labor laws. All great things. Unions have helped make this country great.

The current overt demonization of unions, in an attempt for financial gain for another party, is disgusting, in my view, a terrible treatment of those that worked their lives for this country. A terrible treatment of steelworkers, airline pilots (Reagan started this "demonize unions" ****), schoolteachers, firefighters, policement, electricians, carpenters ....

Do you support the Boeing employees union position in this case?

No I do not. And it's a little more complicated than the singular view presented in this opinion piece.