Interesting Developments

Travis Stone · #1 04-11-2009, 07:04 PM

The Derby Trail is fun because you can over-analyze stuff and have an excuse for doing so. After today's results, there are some fairly interesting considerations:

* Papa Clem, who had a pretty good trip in the La. Derby, was man-handled by Friesan Fire. Papa Clem comes back to win today, what does that say about Friesan Fire?

* General Quarters beat Musket Man, Musket Man comes back to win the Illinois Derby, while General Quarters beats synthetic horses on their own turf. Is the West Florida contingent this good?

* Papa Clem is an okay horse on both surfaces, yet he lost to Pioneerof The Nile. Love POTN or hate him, you have to have a few ounces of respect for him.

* Terrain will likely finish 3rd or 4th in the Kentucky Derby, because it's what he does.

* Who is the pace in the Kentucky Derby now?

Hoist Her Flag · #2 04-11-2009, 07:07 PM

If Old Fashioned goes he's the pace. How about Regal Ransom? Was on the pace in all 3 races in the desert. Alan Garcia up and by Distorted Humor?

King Glorious · #3 04-11-2009, 07:11 PM

Pioneer was the big winner of the day. Horses that can't beat him in Cali are leaving and running huge and winning big races on dirt.

Friesan Fire is as good as I thought. Jones seemed to think all along that Old Fashioned was better but the horse that FF beat just beat Old Fashioned. I think Jones was wrong.

I think Musket Man is that good. I still don't think General Quarters is.

Payson Dave · #4 04-11-2009, 07:17 PM

A couple of months back, I seem to remember hearing Jones suggest that FF might be as good or even better than OF

jwkniska · #5 04-11-2009, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Payson Dave

A couple of months back, I seem to remember hearing Jones suggest that FF might be as good or even better than OF

You're absolutely correct. He did say that, and so far was a great assessment.

DaTruth · #6 04-11-2009, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Payson Dave

A couple of months back, I seem to remember hearing Jones suggest that FF might be as good or even better than OF

Jones said last year that FF was the most talented 2yo he had ever trained. It was just a matter of FF getting his mind into the game.

Bobby Fischer · #7 04-11-2009, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaTruth

Jones said last year that FF was the most talented 2yo he had ever trained. It was just a matter of FF getting his mind into the game.

I just had the best egg noodles I've ever made.

on an unrelated note, what has Pioneerof ever done to suggest he might belong in the Kentucky Derby ?

Betsy · #8 04-11-2009, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Pioneer was the big winner of the day. Horses that can't beat him in Cali are leaving and running huge and winning big races on dirt.

Friesan Fire is as good as I thought. Jones seemed to think all along that Old Fashioned was better but the horse that FF beat just beat Old Fashioned. I think Jones was wrong.

I think Musket Man is that good. I still don't think General Quarters is.

But POTN still hasn't run on dirt - maybe he beat those horses because he's better on the synthetics than they are. We still have no idea if POTN will take to the dirt.

jwkniska · #9 04-11-2009, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Pioneer was the big winner of the day.

I disagree. The big winner of the day was Dunkirk, as the usuals came in 1-2 in Ark... so nobody passed him in graded earnings from the race.

randallscott35 · #10 04-11-2009, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwkniska

I disagree. The big winner of the day was Dunkirk, as the usuals came in 1-2 in Ark... so nobody passed him in graded earnings from the race.

Good point.

CSC · #11 04-11-2009, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Pioneer was the big winner of the day. Horses that can't beat him in Cali are leaving and running huge and winning big races on dirt.

Friesan Fire is as good as I thought. Jones seemed to think all along that Old Fashioned was better but the horse that FF beat just beat Old Fashioned. I think Jones was wrong.

I think Musket Man is that good. I still don't think General Quarters is.

I already pointed out last week that POTN was a real value pick in the futures at 11-1, though it is fair to ask the question how will he fare on traditional dirt, it doesn't hurt that horses he has beaten are coming back to win big derby preps. To add another spin, I would say Baffert is a better dirt trainer than on syth tracks. He will be very interesting.

Bobby Fischer · #12 04-11-2009, 07:34 PM

Not sure whether or not the Arkansas Derby was any good, after only a couple brief viewings.

hockey2315 · #13 04-11-2009, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Pioneer was the big winner of the day. Horses that can't beat him in Cali are leaving and running huge and winning big races on dirt.

Exactly

sdjcom · #14 04-11-2009, 07:50 PM

I would not be surprised to see a west coast trifecta in derby, i believe John white just might be correct in his thinking syn-tracks to dirt building horses up for dirt.

Travis Stone · #15 04-11-2009, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoist Her Flag

If Old Fashioned goes he's the pace. How about Regal Ransom? Was on the pace in all 3 races in the desert. Alan Garcia up and by Distorted Humor?

I read somewhere that Regal Ransom is somewhat iffy?

Travis Stone · #16 04-11-2009, 07:52 PM

I'll also add that in terms of Old Fashioned, I would probably go. Not only is there little pace, and maybe you can get lucky, but you'll help setup the pace for your stablemate.

blackthroatedwind · #17 04-11-2009, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

I read somewhere that Regal Ransom is somewhat iffy?

He makes a great rabbit for Desert Party.

Scurlogue Champ · #18 04-11-2009, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

He makes a great rabbit for Desert Party.

He surely does.

cowgirlintexas · #19 04-11-2009, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

The Derby Trail is fun because you can over-analyze stuff and have an excuse for doing so. After today's results, there are some fairly interesting considerations:

* Papa Clem, who had a pretty good trip in the La. Derby, was man-handled by Friesan Fire. Papa Clem comes back to win today, what does that say about Friesan Fire?

* General Quarters beat Musket Man, Musket Man comes back to win the Illinois Derby, while General Quarters beats synthetic horses on their own turf. Is the West Florida contingent this good?

* Papa Clem is an okay horse on both surfaces, yet he lost to Pioneerof The Nile. Love POTN or hate him, you have to have a few ounces of respect for him.

* Terrain will likely finish 3rd or 4th in the Kentucky Derby, because it's what he does.

* Who is the pace in the Kentucky Derby now?

Definitely some food for thought... Going to be a great betting race for sure and some juices prices. Hard to come out with a clear cut choice this year.

South Beach Luv · #20 04-11-2009, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

The Derby Trail is fun because you can over-analyze stuff and have an excuse for doing so. After today's results, there are some fairly interesting considerations:

* Papa Clem, who had a pretty good trip in the La. Derby, was man-handled by Friesan Fire. Papa Clem comes back to win today, what does that say about Friesan Fire?

* General Quarters beat Musket Man, Musket Man comes back to win the Illinois Derby, while General Quarters beats synthetic horses on their own turf. Is the West Florida contingent this good?

* Papa Clem is an okay horse on both surfaces, yet he lost to Pioneerof The Nile. Love POTN or hate him, you have to have a few ounces of respect for him.

* Terrain will likely finish 3rd or 4th in the Kentucky Derby, because it's what he does.

* Who is the pace in the Kentucky Derby now?

It makes me wonder what would of happened if the track would of been fast that day