Belmont the Fall Championship Meet

[Seattleallstar]

the track where champions are crowned

Wrong as usual my boy. That nickname is left over from the days before the Breeders Cup, when you were still wearing diapers and watching the Smurfs on tv.
In the old days the grade ones run at Belmont were the key decisive races that decided championships. Those days are gone. Champs are decided in most part on the basis of BC day. Doesnt really matter if you win the Champagne or JCGC or Turf Classic if you don't run well on Cup day.
They still call it that because it was called that for years. But the majority of champs will be crowned at CD on BC day. Thats just the way it is in this era of the BC.

Originally Posted by oracle80

Wrong as usual my boy. That nickname is left over from the days before the Breeders Cup, when you were still wearing diapers and watching the Smurfs on tv.
In the old days the grade ones run at Belmont were the key decisive races that decided championships. Those days are gone. Champs are decided in most part on the basis of BC day. Doesnt really matter if you win the Champagne or JCGC or Turf Classic if you don't run well on Cup day.
They still call it that because it was called that for years. But the majority of champs will be crowned at CD on BC day. Thats just the way it is in this era of the BC.

You are so correct and this is one reason why I hate the Breeders Cup. Granted I get to see great racing, but I think there is too much emphasis on racing on that day.

Originally Posted by eurobounce

You are so correct and this is one reason why I hate the Breeders Cup. Granted I get to see great racing, but I think there is too much emphasis on racing on that day.

I completely agree and I think its a real negative. People wonder why we see 4 and 5 horse grade one fields these days and this is why. In the old days championships were truly won based on a years performances. Voters weighed the ENTIRE campaigns of the horses. This is no longer so and its wrong. The whole thing is havily weighed on BC performances as if the other races didn't count. You now actually have guys using 500 grand or 750 grand grade one races as PREPS!! LOL!!! And of course now we never get those great rivalry matchups we used to get. Nor will we ever again. Guys just play keep away all year because its the only smart thing to do. Why rough up your horse in July or August when noone is gonna vote you anything unless you win the Cup. The whole year is just plotted for that one day, and its done racing far more harm than good. We basically traded great races and matchups all year long for one orgy or greatness on one day. Yeah, that day is great, but what about the rest of the year when the grade ones are no longer what they used to be?

[JJP]

I agree with most of what Oracle says although the problem isn't in the Breeders Cup races themselves; its in the perception of those who vote for the Eclipse Awards. While the BC races should be a factor, they should not be the end-all for year end voting, IMO.

Originally Posted by JJP

I agree with most of what Oracle says although the problem isn't in the Breeders Cup races themselves; its in the perception of those who vote for the Eclipse Awards. While the BC races should be a factor, they should not be the end-all for year end voting, IMO.

Amen brother.

[boswd]

Originally Posted by JJP

I agree with most of what Oracle says although the problem isn't in the Breeders Cup races themselves; its in the perception of those who vote for the Eclipse Awards. While the BC races should be a factor, they should not be the end-all for year end voting, IMO.

I also think it is the timing. Early Fall. I know they keep it that way so they can get as many tracks in the North in the rotation but if it we held in December I think you would see some of the big Grade I'ls get better fields. Although this year it seemed pretty decent. Whitney had 9 Pac classic had 8 Stephen Foster had 9 and I think the Pim Special had 8 or so. Not bad considering the past few years we were looking at 5 and 6 horse fields.

Originally Posted by oracle80

I completely agree and I think its a real negative. People wonder why we see 4 and 5 horse grade one fields these days and this is why. In the old days championships were truly won based on a years performances. Voters weighed the ENTIRE campaigns of the horses. This is no longer so and its wrong. The whole thing is havily weighed on BC performances as if the other races didn't count. You now actually have guys using 500 grand or 750 grand grade one races as PREPS!! LOL!!! And of course now we never get those great rivalry matchups we used to get. Nor will we ever again. Guys just play keep away all year because its the only smart thing to do. Why rough up your horse in July or August when noone is gonna vote you anything unless you win the Cup. The whole year is just plotted for that one day, and its done racing far more harm than good. We basically traded great races and matchups all year long for one orgy or greatness on one day. Yeah, that day is great, but what about the rest of the year when the grade ones are no longer what they used to be?

We basically traded great races and matchups all year long for one orgy or greatness on one day. This is the funniest thing I have ever read. I remember when the Donn was a major race trainers pointed to. Now we dont even get to see the older horses until May/June. And like you said, they use a Grade I race as a prep for the Breeders Cup. It is ridiculous if you ask me. I cant blame the trainers at all, but it doesnt make me happy.

[boswd]

Originally Posted by oracle80

I completely agree and I think its a real negative. People wonder why we see 4 and 5 horse grade one fields these days and this is why. In the old days championships were truly won based on a years performances. Voters weighed the ENTIRE campaigns of the horses. This is no longer so and its wrong. The whole thing is havily weighed on BC performances as if the other races didn't count. You now actually have guys using 500 grand or 750 grand grade one races as PREPS!! LOL!!! And of course now we never get those great rivalry matchups we used to get. Nor will we ever again. Guys just play keep away all year because its the only smart thing to do. Why rough up your horse in July or August when noone is gonna vote you anything unless you win the Cup. The whole year is just plotted for that one day, and its done racing far more harm than good. We basically traded great races and matchups all year long for one orgy or greatness on one day. Yeah, that day is great, but what about the rest of the year when the grade ones are no longer what they used to be?

I could not have said it better myself. I have thought that way for a long time. As much as I love Breeders Cup Day and as much as this sport deserves a "Super BowL" or "All Star Day" It has come at the expense of the great races that built this sport. And it is only going to get worse. More spacing seems to be the way every year. It's sad.

[Gander]

Then I guess the only thing to do is boycott the BC, not bet a single dime on any of the races. Dont tune in, dont go out and watch.

Then maybe they will abolish the BC and go back to the way it was when horse racing was grand.

[Seattleallstar]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Wrong as usual my boy. That nickname is left over from the days before the Breeders Cup, when you were still wearing diapers and watching the Smurfs on tv.
In the old days the grade ones run at Belmont were the key decisive races that decided championships. Those days are gone. Champs are decided in most part on the basis of BC day. Doesnt really matter if you win the Champagne or JCGC or Turf Classic if you don't run well on Cup day.
They still call it that because it was called that for years. But the majority of champs will be crowned at CD on BC day. Thats just the way it is in this era of the BC.

i know its an inside joke stupid, we talked about this like 3-4 years ago

[Siena 16]

Right again Oracle, for those of us who follow this great game 365 days a year. the Fall meet at Belmont is a 33 day extension of all the hard work we did at Saratoga. who cares what they call it, lets just continue to cash tickets, But what's really great about Fall Belmont is racing five days a week.

[Assttodixie]

Originally Posted by Dixie Porter

Said this 10 years ago, "you can put a fork in; the game's done".

It has gotten progressively worse evey year for too many reasons for me to list.

I wonder who on here besides me and "the grand master" were around for the "glory days".

The USA's two best tracks are gone (Jamaica/Hialeah).

For that matter, what now stands as Saratoga is a f**kin joke.

It makes me sad as well Boss. It reminds me of the old commercial where there is the Native American guy and he sees people littering and he starts to cry. We are the Native American Boss!

Please Boss, regale them with tales of yesteryear. Give them a small glimmer of what it was like when it was still a game.

[Assttodixie]

Originally Posted by Dixie Porter

Get back in the office with Bruce and finish the football for this weekend. Don't forget to be polite to Eugene's wife at dinner.

Boss-

I am BRUCE. Speaking of which, I need your expertise. I am taking you up on your all expenses paid trip to Las Vegas tomorrow and am in desperate need of some plays both pro and college. Will you post some for us morons?

Glad you are doing well boss.

[Bogey]

In '04 Afleet Alex was robbed when they gave Declan's Moon the 2yr colt award. One of the biggest screw ups in system to date.