Cold/Wind KO's Aqueduct again Wednesday

[Kasept]

No racing at the Big A. Miserable here with wind brutal.. Knocks out really good card.

[dellinger63]

That's too bad. I thought there was a good chance Sciacca was going to break out of containment today.

But cheer up New Yorkers with the news it's minus 4 here with wind chills 30-40 below. Most all, including Chicago schools closed.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

That's too bad. I thought there was a good chance Sciacca was going to break out of containment today.

But cheer up New Yorkers with the news it's minus 4 here with wind chills 30-40 below. Most all, including Chicago schools closed.

Because of the cold? We are raising a generation of Veal

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by jms62

Because of the cold? We are raising a generation of Veal

Won't matter anyway as according to climate experts we passed the line of no return for a Global Warming ending.

Anytime now we'll be underwater, only not today as we'd be under ice.

[freddymo]

Assuming tomorrow will be SCUTTLED as well

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Assuming tomorrow will be SCUTTLED as well

I doubt it. It'll be cold but not nearly as windy, plus Friday/Saturday weather is iffy so I think they'll try their best to get tomorrow's card in.

[ateamstupid]

Canceled two races in today after Italian Rules and Apex both break down in the 2nd. Brutal.

[Pants II]

I feel bad for David Jacobson. Where else is he gonna get free money today?

[herkhorse]

scuttled again today

[geeker2]

Jan. 9, 2015



STATEMENT FROM NYTHA PRESIDENT RICK VIOLETTE JR. ON THE INCREASE OF EQUINE FATALITIES AT AQUEDUCT RACETRACK:

“The horsemen are obviously deeply concerned about the significant increase in equine fatalities at Aqueduct this winter. Tomorrow morning, a group of trainers, including myself and NYTHA Board members Linda Rice and Rick Schosberg, will meet with a NYRA management team including Senior Vice President of Racing Operations Martin Panza, Vice President of Facilities and Racing Surfaces Glen Kozak and Chief Examing Veterinarian Dr. Anthony Verderosa. There may not be one right answer, but we will use every avenue possible and examine every angle to address this situation. Everything will be on the table, from finding an independent track surface expert to come in and examine the inner track to a thorough reexamination of every procedure and protocol in place before a horse leaves the starting gate.”

[ScottJ]

Originally Posted by geeker2

Jan. 9, 2015
h
STATEMENT FROM NYTHA PRESIDENT RICK VIOLETTE JR. ON THE INCREASE OF EQUINE FATALITIES AT AQUEDUCT RACETRACK:

“The horsemen are obviously deeply concerned about the significant increase in equine fatalities at Aqueduct this winter. Tomorrow morning, a group of trainers, including myself and NYTHA Board members Linda Rice and Rick Schosberg, will meet with a NYRA management team including Senior Vice President of Racing Operations Martin Panza, Vice President of Facilities and Racing Surfaces Glen Kozak and Chief Examing Veterinarian Dr. Anthony Verderosa. There may not be one right answer, but we will use every avenue possible and examine every angle to address this situation. Everything will be on the table, from finding an independent track surface expert to come in and examine the inner track to a thorough reexamination of every procedure and protocol in place before a horse leaves the starting gate.”

The NYRA should discontinue racing between the first weekend of December and the first weekend of April. Return the racing calendar to years back when the circuit consisted of eight months of racing.

This would :

[1] eliminate the Aqueduct Inner Track debate all together,
[2] eliminate the need for lower level horses racing on the circuit leading to the higher breakdown rates,
[3] increase the horse population available to second tier circuits, and
[4] allow NYRA to save money from what has largely been quoted as a money losing part of the season.

It becomes increasingly tiresome reading that the horsemen believe that the problem is always in the surface. While it is positive that all parties are talking (which could be viewed as the end-goal of the entire meeting), re-evaluating the need for winter racing should be the first order of business.

[ScottJ]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Canceled two races in today after Italian Rules and Apex both break down in the 2nd. Brutal.

Does everyone remember when Bob Baffert was dragged through the media based on his California break-down rates? No one came to his defense as he was a big gun in the industry.

While allowing the trainers to challenge the racing surface, aren't the prerace protocols involved in preparing a horse the ultimate responsibility of the trainer? I would argue that they are.

If that were the case, why does NYRA and the audience not hear from Steve Klesaris and Naipaul Chatterpaul as to what was wrong with their horses prior to saddling them leading to their breakdowns? Having public trainer statements on why their horses are not returning from the track would be a first step in placing responsibility where it belongs.

Every winter, we seem to get involved in this same debate onto which the media (and organizations like PETA) latches come the spring season. Eventually, the inputs need to change in order to change the outcomes.

[Kasept]

Why don't you pull yourself up and stop with the blather? I don't have time to go point by point through the hysterical, scattershot suggestions/recriminations, but the right answer to scenarios like this are horses go wrong for countless reasons and instantaneous conclusions/demands/calls to action are utterly pointless and 100% useless.

Extended periods of racing without incident and spikes in breakdowns happen. The long term oversight put in place by NYRA after the Injury Task Force considered the 2012 incident spate have been recognized as very effective. If you want to stop breakdowns, end the sport. Otherwise, be prepared for these Edvard Munch moments of feigned outrage and horror to continue.

[Kasept]

Here's the Task Force Report from 2012 if truly interested in understanding all the working parts of circumstances involving safety cautions: http://www.governor.ny.gov/sites/gov...nts/Report.pdf

[ScottJ]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Why don't you pull yourself up and stop with the blather? I don't have time to go point by point through the hysterical, scattershot suggestions/recriminations, but the right answer to scenarios like this are horses go wrong for countless reasons and instantaneous conclusions/demands/calls to action are utterly pointless and 100% useless.

Steve, we have spoken several times over the air and disappointed that you would refer to the discussion as blather. In fact, I was responding to the press release issued by Rick Violette, Jr.

My suggestion was to have public statements from trainers offering an explanation to the public as to what happened on the track. That does not feel utterly pointless, reactionary, or hysterical to me. All too often, the track and surface are cited as the core issue as opposed to looking at overall horse health as the first issue which is of course a more difficult issue and leads to accountability which is ultimately what we want in the game.

Originally Posted by Kasept

Extended periods of racing without incident and spikes in breakdowns happen. The long term oversight put in place by NYRA after the Injury Task Force considered the 2012 incident spate have been recognized as very effective. If you want to stop breakdowns, end the sport. Otherwise, be prepared for these Edvard Munch moments of feigned outrage and horror to continue.

I agree completely with your points here which is why the call for immediate press-release meetings between the horsemen's group and the NYRA management team seems hollow.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by ScottJ

Steve, we have spoken several times over the air and disappointed that you would refer to the discussion as blather. In fact, I was responding to the press release issued by Rick Violette, Jr.

My suggestion was to have public statements from trainers offering an explanation to the public as to what happened on the track. That does not feel utterly pointless, reactionary, or hysterical to me. All too often, the track and surface are cited as the core issue as opposed to looking at overall horse health as the first issue which is of course a more difficult issue and leads to accountability which is ultimately what we want in the game.

I agree completely with your points here which is why the call for immediate press-release meetings between the horsemen's group and the NYRA management team seems hollow.

Scott..

No offense re: blather but it's just what came out in response to the posts and in association with the assorted social media suggestions/imperatives I'm seeing.

Specific to the NYTHA statement, you seemed particularly aghast at what was hardly a deferral to the track surface given this perfectly equitable Violette quote: "There may not be one right answer, but we will use every avenue possible and examine every angle to address this situation. Everything will be on the table, from finding an independent track surface expert to come in and examine the inner track to a thorough reexamination of every procedure and protocol in place before a horse leaves the starting gate"

That could hardly be characterized as a response limited to possible track surface issues. It covers everything that can be involved from entry box to starting gate to the running of a race. Basically, everything the task force covered in 2012.

As to "public statements" from trainers, what exactly do you think they will have to say minutes after losing a client's or their own horse? Do you think that any trainer in NY or anywhere else sends out horses they deem iffy to get around that day? Until a necropsy reveals the specifics of a fatality, the trainer may very well be as in the dark as the track/state vet that watched it jog earlier in the day and gave it the OK to run. So it is absolutely pointless, reactionary and hysterical to call for trainer press conferences to 'explain' a breakdown.

You say the statements from horseman and NYRA ring hollow, but what are they supposed to say other than 'we'll keep examining every aspect of operations and try to limit possible at-risk horses from running'? They're already doing that.

Everyone needs to be as vigilant as possible from horsemen/owners, to state regulatory vets, to track surface management.. But here's the rub. No matter how well all do their jobs, horses are going to break down and die. We want as few to die as possible, but it's still going to happen. Accept it as a basic tenant of the sport, or don't. But to rashly point fingers and call for sky-is-falling emergency measures solves nothing and only adds to an atmosphere of ignorance and derision.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Why don't you pull yourself up and stop with the blather? I don't have time to go point by point through the hysterical, scattershot suggestions/recriminations, but the right answer to scenarios like this are horses go wrong for countless reasons and instantaneous conclusions/demands/calls to action are utterly pointless and 100% useless.

Extended periods of racing without incident and spikes in breakdowns happen. The long term oversight put in place by NYRA after the Injury Task Force considered the 2012 incident spate have been recognized as very effective. If you want to stop breakdowns, end the sport. Otherwise, be prepared for these Edvard Munch moments of feigned outrage and horror to continue.

[OTM Al]

Hasn't Durso tweeted the same thing each day this week?

@JohnDursoJr: Due to severe cold, high winds & out of abundance of caution for safety of jockeys/horses, @TheNYRA has cancelled racing at Aqueduct today.

Except it isn't severly cold or windy today. Makes you wonder if he is even here.

[ateamstupid]

Canceled again today due to frozen patches on the track.

[ScottJ]

Originally Posted by Steve Byk Twitter Publication

This NEVER used to happen in New York.. Got it? EVER. Well.. Except for 1994 when 14 of the first 51 days cancelled.. But otherwise, NEVER!

Completely agreed. Coming back to our discussion from earlier this week, the inner track racing surface will remain a point of very close scrutiny, particularly after the horsemen's statement and the subsequent meetings.

Hopefully, we will not get rain with the temporary warming expected this weekend - if the surface has frozen spots, you can be sure that the surface will get really loose with thawing and we will have problems with unsafe conditions involving the base.

I acknowledge that my views were clearly in the minority regarding trainer statements earlier this week. Yet despite being in the minority, the number of posters who have cited tremendous claiming dropdowns as an indication that something must be amiss with the horse should be noted. Wait, something amiss with the horse? Certainly, I do not have the experience to differentiate an "ouchy" animal from one who will be a danger to others on the far turn, but there seems to be a tacit acceptance that horses are wildly dropped for a reason. To me, that is a trainer and owner flag. This has been a well-known handicapping "angle", but it points to, well, something potentially wrong.

While the claiming game can be a wide open free-for-all, since the 2012 Report called for a upper clamp placed on claiming purses tied to claiming price, should we implement a downward limit on the amount of a dropdown on the claiming ladder? Perhaps a limit of a 50% claiming price slash? No more than two claiming classes at the home track?