Best 2 year old ever POLL!!!

[smartyalex]

On the closing of the "derby futures" pool one, I thought this would be of interest. My vote would have to be Devil's Bag or Ruffian.

[Linny]

Go back in time and look up Tremont. Citation was a good 2yo as well.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Linny

Citation was a good 2yo as well.

Where does that put stablemate Bewitch?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I really hope no one says Favorite Trick..... Or Vindication

[saucon17]

Capote was a pretty damn good 2 year old

[JJP]

Originally Posted by saucon17

Capote was a pretty damn good 2 year old

His win in the BC Juvenile was more a function of a strong rail bias. His true abilities were shown in his 3YO season.

As for the best, I'd go with Devils Bag.

[smartyalex]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I really hope no one says Favorite Trick........

we need to put an asterisk next to his HOY! Are you kidding me???

[Thunder Gulch]

Bid or Ruffian...stack of track records all over the place. Raise a Native would have to be in the discussion.

[Ironhorse]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I really hope no one says Favorite Trick..... Or Vindication

Why would anyone bring up Favorite Trick? He didn't do much. Let me list a few of his accomplishments. Lots of two year olds have had similar success.

1. Undefeated in eight starts, including seven straight stakes.

2. Earned $1,231,998.

3. Won Grade 1 stakes in New York and California.

4. Won the Breeders Cup Juvenile, G1, in the fastest time in the history of the race.

5. Co-leader in total number of 1997 North American graded stakes wins through Breeders Cup XIV.

6. Won at 4 1/2, 5, 5 1/2, 6, 6 1/2, 7, and twice at 8 1/2 furlongs.

7. Won by an average of 3 1/2 lengths per race.

8. Won at four racetracks, on both coasts and in the mid-west.

9. Won on tracks labeled fast, good and muddy.

10. Defeated the winners of the Futurity Stakes G1, Champagne Stakes G1, Norfolk Stakes G2, Cowdin Stakes G2, Arlington-Washington Futurity G2, Hollywood Juvenile Championship G3, Del Mar Futurity G2, Sapling Stakes G3, Nashua Stakes G3 and the Kentucky Cup Juvenile G3, and everyone by at least three lengths.

11. Gave weight winning both the Bashford Manor Stakes G3 and the Saratoga Special G2.

12.Was favored in seven of his eight starts at odds no higher than 7 to 5.

13. Was "clear or "ridden out" in each of his last six starts.

14. Ran a sub-45 half-mile fraction in the Saratoga Special G2 on a muddy track assigned a variant of 19 by Daily Racing Form.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I've seen that all before.........

http://www.chef-de-race.com/articles...ck_for_hoy.htm

Favorite Trick being named Horse of the Year as a 2-year-old, over the strongest group of older males to race in the decade of the 90's, was pure lunacy.

He wasn't 1/10th the horse that the letter made him out to be.

He beat some terrible horses in his many 2yo stake wins--the 2nd place finisher to him in the Breeders Cup Juvenile was a Canadian turf horse named Dawson's Legacy...that wasn't much at all. The horse who finished 3rd in the Breeders Cup Juvenile, behind Favorite Trick, was a horse named Nationalore. He ran 26 times in his career, and never even broke his maiden!

[Phalaris1913]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Where does that put stablemate Bewitch?

Citation won 28 of his first 30 starts, all but one of which took place during his 2- and 3YO seasons. One of those defeats came in the Chesapeake Trial, a six-furlong prep that was run five days before the Chesapeake in mid-April 1948. It was Arcaro's first ride on the horse and, so goes the story, he did not want to beat the heck out of the horse to win a six-furlong prep race. History tends to treat this as an astonishing upset, forgetting that the winner of the race had a demonstrated affinity for this track, having set a world record winning a stakes race there at 2. The other time Citation was defeated in this span of time came in the 1947 Washington Futurity, a race won by stablemate Bewitch.

It was a blanket 1-2-3 Calumet finish and Bewitch, who was undefeated and winning her eighth straight (and sixth stakes), was considered the stable star 2YO. Citation, at that point, had run in only one stakes event.

Jimmy Jones is supposed to said (years after the fact), "We kind of figured our horses could take the first three places, so we told the riders before the race we'd split the fees three ways between them and whoever was in front should be allowed to win it without anybody whipping anybody to death."

Naturally, all three riders said that their horse could've won easily.

[POINTGIVEN1985]

favorite tricks record as a 2 yr old will never be matched... this post says best 2 yr old. so if its best 2 yr old it has to be him, 2 yr olds these days see the track 5 times tops, thats the good 2 yr olds, most trainers point to the derby, if you see a real good 2 yr old run more then 5 times as a juvenile its rare.

[Phalaris1913]

Originally Posted by POINTGIVEN1985

favorite tricks record as a 2 yr old will never be matched... this post says best 2 yr old. so if its best 2 yr old it has to be him, 2 yr olds these days see the track 5 times tops, thats the good 2 yr olds, most trainers point to the derby, if you see a real good 2 yr old run more then 5 times as a juvenile its rare.

There are any number of horses who won more races, and beat demonstrably better horses in the process, as 2YOs. If you have only been in the sport for a few years, Favorite Trick's campaign stands out - rather like a dim star against a black sky. If you had ever seen a starry night, you'd know that Favorite Trick's accomplishments appear more ordinary in comparison.

The trends you're talking about are not very old and there are plenty of us on this board (who are not fossils) who remember when it was perfectly ordinary for high-class stakes 2YOs to run much more than they do in the 21st century. There are other 2YO champions of the 1990s who ran seven or eight times; that was common in the 1980s and par for the course (or even considered a light campaign) for many decades before that. The pendulum could swing again.

[KirisClown]

I know she's not the best but...

The one that excited me most was... Flanders...

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by KirisClown

The one that excited me most was... Flanders...

OR

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Kasept

OR

option #2 for sure

[Phalaris1913]

That 1994 Juvey Fillies margin may not be quite as visually exciting as the 21-length victory in the Frizette (against, admittedly, the sort of horses that a really good horse should be beating by a city block), but given the four-length margin back to third and the caliber of the horse in such hot pursuit, it impresses me more in retrospect. Serena's Song was already a G1-caliber winner and after this race, she won nine of her next 11 starts (nine of nine at less than 10 furlongs), including the Jim Beam and and Haskell. There's a hidden accomplishment in there that usually isn't recognized: after finishing 16th in the Derby after setting the pace (stablemates Thunder Gulch and Timber Country finished first and third), she was back 13 days later, demolishing ordinary 3YO fillies in the Black-Eyed Susan by nine lengths. It's been my general observation that a lot of good, speedy fillies seem to lose something mentally and/or physically after a thumping defeat, but Serena's Song, at her best, was like a tank.

[KirisClown]

Originally Posted by Kasept

OR

This Flanders....

Maiden:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOvHU_XXdzA

Matron: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBLTrlHKlfg

Bc Juv Fillies: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MlRMUAmxmU

[somerfrost]

Of course Kincsem was 10-10 running in ten different cities in three different countries...on my list she would be second to Secretariat with Colin third.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

Of course Kincsem was 10-10 running in ten different cities in three different countries...on my list she would be second to Secretariat with Colin third.

well, i'd always praise perfection over almost perfect, so secretariat would be third of the three.