CRIST: Changes dilute Cup's appeal

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

for bc day for how many years now, they had some other races on the card before the bc races started. they should have just made a big day of it, and left it at that. if they wanted to add a race or two, and fill a ten race card, fine. but this two day, segregated by sex deal, is not going to help anything. where else does anything like this two day event happen? and work?

Golf

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Are you going to stop watching the Saturday races because they have some races on Friday? Do you know anyone that stopped watching the Saturday races because they added new races and a new day? Not asking if you watched the Friday races but did you stop watching the Saturday ones?

i had them on, yes. but i would prefer that i could see them all that day. how would you like it if the first half of the super bowl was on a friday during working hours?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Golf

Tennis. The women's NCAA basketball tournament.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Golf

but do they have half the players play on friday, and then tiger and a few come out on sunday and show off?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i had them on, yes. but i would prefer that i could see them all that day. how would you like it if the first half of the super bowl was on a friday during working hours?

Yes, I see how this analogy is the same.

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i had them on, yes. but i would prefer that i could see them all that day. how would you like it if the first half of the super bowl was on a friday during working hours?

the NCAA has managed to string out what used to be one day's worth of games over 9 days. It could be worse

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Tennis. The women's NCAA basketball tournament.

tennis finals generally fall on saturday and then sunday, i know as i used to watch.
as for the ncaa women, haven't a clue. i don't even watch mens b'ball....

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GBBob

the NCAA has managed to string out what used to be one day's worth of games over 9 days. It could be worse

but it could be better.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GBBob

the NCAA has managed to string out what used to be one day's worth of games over 9 days. It could be worse

but by the same token, those games are usually played during prime time, aren't they? not 1-5 on a weekday afternoon...at least once you get down to the sweet 16, right?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Tennis. The women's NCAA basketball tournament.

and besides, i'd hate to see the distaff division end up as ignored as womens basketball!!

[XIIPointStables]

How can anyone really defend this obscene move by the powers that be at the BC?

The word that keeps coming to mind is deflating - It's deflating to me as a race fan that the people that run what was one of the great days in the sport think this is a smart move.

[Cannon Shell]

Personally I have no problem with Friday races though i do understand the people that disagree. I have seen Oaks day turn from a big day to a huge event so Friday events are not impossible. i dont like the shuffling of the races though. I was in favor of adding races but I think they should remain secondary until they have a little history behind them and 'earn' thier way onto the big day. You cant possibly hope to make Friday as big as Sat and as such the traditional races should have been kept intact with Friday being a preview of sorts, especially since many people who travel are already in town. The truth I'm afraid is that this will give them an excuse to raise prices on friday to the level of the Saturday prices which cuts into many peoples budgets. One tip off that the powers that be in racing dont care about current customers is the absense of effort to repeal the unfair withholding rules. Until recently I had never heard a racetrack exec even acknowledge this and it hurts their bottomline too.

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by Danzig

but by the same token, those games are usually played during prime time, aren't they? not 1-5 on a weekday afternoon...at least once you get down to the sweet 16, right?

I was thinking about New Year's Day Bowl games

but i agree with your other post

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Personally I have no problem with Friday races though i do understand the people that disagree. I have seen Oaks day turn from a big day to a huge event so Friday events are not impossible. i dont like the shuffling of the races though. I was in favor of adding races but I think they should remain secondary until they have a little history behind them and 'earn' thier way onto the big day. You cant possibly hope to make Friday as big as Sat and as such the traditional races should have been kept intact with Friday being a preview of sorts, especially since many people who travel are already in town. The truth I'm afraid is that this will give them an excuse to raise prices on friday to the level of the Saturday prices which cuts into many peoples budgets. One tip off that the powers that be in racing dont care about current customers is the absense of effort to repeal the unfair withholding rules. Until recently I had never heard a racetrack exec even acknowledge this and it hurts their bottomline too.

i think it's the shuffling of the races, far more than just having added races, that has me the most aggravated. like you said, no history behind some of the races. and why should races that have achieved and DESERVE gr 1 status and have much to do (altho sometimes too much) with the awarding of year-end honors be relegated to being nothing more than a life preserver for races that really have nothing to do with any type of division??
they're trying to surround pseudo championship races with races with history behind them, to somehow grant those newbies some type of legitimacy.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Personally I have no problem with Friday races though i do understand the people that disagree. I have seen Oaks day turn from a big day to a huge event so Friday events are not impossible. i dont like the shuffling of the races though. I was in favor of adding races but I think they should remain secondary until they have a little history behind them and 'earn' thier way onto the big day. You cant possibly hope to make Friday as big as Sat and as such the traditional races should have been kept intact with Friday being a preview of sorts, especially since many people who travel are already in town. The truth I'm afraid is that this will give them an excuse to raise prices on friday to the level of the Saturday prices which cuts into many peoples budgets. One tip off that the powers that be in racing dont care about current customers is the absense of effort to repeal the unfair withholding rules. Until recently I had never heard a racetrack exec even acknowledge this and it hurts their bottomline too.

I can understand that. I would think that the feeling behind this is maybe the same as when networks put new shows on the air right after some established hits, in hopes that the audience that watched the hit might stick around and watch the new show. For that reason, I don't think it's that bad an idea. Speaking only for myself, I can tell you that if there was a day with the Dirt Marathon, the F/M Sprint, the Juvenile Turf Fillies and the other new races only, I'd be less likely tune in and watch them alone than I would be if they were on the same card with the Distaff and the F/M Turf.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I can understand that. I would think that the feeling behind this is maybe the same as when networks put new shows on the air right after some established hits, in hopes that the audience that watched the hit might stick around and watch the new show. For that reason, I don't think it's that bad an idea. Speaking only for myself, I can tell you that if there was a day with the Dirt Marathon, the F/M Sprint, the Juvenile Turf Fillies and the other new races only, I'd be less likely tune in and watch them alone than I would be if they were on the same card with the Distaff and the F/M Turf.

Hey we watch the garbage that some tracks put out everyday so it is not like we wont watch them anyway. But in keeping friday as a BC expansion day with prices half price with some huge pool pick 6 or some way that bettors are rewarded for playing or going may be easier for people that care to swallow.

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

then they will disrupt it with a curling match....or god forbid - arena football

Hey, curling is a great sport. Lots of finesse and mind games involved. And good players can come in all shapes and sizes. Like snooker (which gets wall-to-wall afternoon coverage on the BBC). Moreover, like horse racing, it is rooted in history, unlike the bastardization of a great outdoor game like football. (Okay, I am from Minnesota so sports on ice have a special appeal. AND we spent a sabbatical year in Canada where curling is second only to ice hockey among winter sports. For myself, they could lose boxing forever off TV and I would be happy. It is a disgusting excuse for a sport, IMHO. But my dad likes it!)

[Kasept]

Have to admit that the 10 years living in Canada made me a Curling fan as well..

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Linny

If Rags had gone from the Oaks to the Ma Goose to the Coaching Club to the Alabama to the Beldame and the Distaff and won them all no one but us racing freaks would know her. She's famous for beating the boys. If she stays in the distaff, oops, Ladies division this season she'll be anonymous by October.

Very true.....but I would add that racing her on the " real " BC card would keep her in the headlines, so to speak.

The other problem, that I'm not sure has been mentioned so far, is that instead of the Saturday races being a complete " championship day ", they will be watered down to include the, perhaps fun, but irrelevent BC Turf Sprint, BC Juvenile Turf and BC Marathon. These races were conceived as, essentially, lead-ins to the big day, and now they are part of the main event at the exclusion of others.

As has been well stated here by Chuck, the BC is furthering a mistake that racetracks in general make, in a misguided attempt to attract a new audience that may or may not truly exist, they have spurned the needs and desires of their core and dedicated customers. We need to take care of these people a whole lot better before we should be worried about adding to their numbers.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

As has been well stated here by Chuck, the BC is furthering a mistake that racetracks in general make, in a misguided attempt to attract a new audience that may or may not truly exist, they have spurned the needs and desires of their core and dedicated customers. We need to take care of these people a whole lot better before we should be worried about adding to their numbers.

You can literally hear the conversation in the BCL meeting when, OR EVEN IF, the question came up...

"The existing fans? Are you kidding? They'll watch and bet whenever and wherever we put it and whatever we call it..."