Wayne Catalano-Frank Calebrese

Originally Posted by Scav

You beat Illinois as an owner in the high level races, this group doesn't usually go above 25k

Excluding Churchill and Keeneland it's far more bleak here. We'll have 16k allowance races at Ellis this summer.

We'll have Ralph Martinez hitting at a 50% clip with $2500 Fairmount claimers.

Originally Posted by GBBob

I was going to say this earlier, but it is very hard to be "defending" Cat/Cal on any level. They aren't easy to stomach whether you are a bettor, handicapper, trainer or owner. But the only smoking gun we have here is that they have started the first 7 racing days with a crazy win % that I really think has some logical reasons behind it. If that is "sticking my head in the sand", then so be it, although I think that accusation is flat wrong. No one has come out and said they aren't cheating and I doubt anyone disagrees with your points on cheating and how it should be handled. But if a career .200 hitter hits .500 for April and jacks 12 homers, I'm going to be waiting for a little more of the season to play out before insisting he's on steroids. And Cat/Cal aren't .200 hitters.

It's very rare to have a streak like the one they're having. I don't think in my 15+ years of gambling on this sport that I can recall where an owner/trainer has won at this strong of a clip over a two week span.

It very well could be that all they've done is drop horses in class and had some extreme racing luck. Even so, it's far from sporting and it's borderline confrontational to other owners and trainers. It's like they're flaunting their success and wealth at everyone. And really it makes me wish bad things would happen to them.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

Excluding Churchill and Keeneland it's far more bleak here. We'll have 16k allowance races at Ellis this summer.

We'll have Ralph Martinez hitting at a 50% clip with $2500 Fairmount claimers.

By group I meant 25k claimers. They don't have many allowance horses except DOA and Lewis Michael, both homebreds, and they don't buy many at the sales, if any now that I think about it. I actually think you will see Frank chill out soon and focus on breeding, especially if he holds onto DOA/DOL...He has a decent broodmare band producing, he should have never sold DOA's mom....

Originally Posted by Scav

By group I meant 25k claimers. They don't have many allowance horses except DOA and Lewis Michael, both homebreds, and they don't buy many at the sales, if any now that I think about it. I actually think you will see Frank chill out soon and focus on breeding, especially if he holds onto DOA/DOL...He has a decent broodmare band producing, he should have never sold DOA's mom....

Yeah he's got probably 50 mil plus in the bank and sold her for 600k. DOH

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

Yeah he's got probably 50 mil plus in the bank and sold her for 600k. DOH

I don't think they knew what they had in DOA, I think she sprung up on them a little.

No idea what she went for, but it was right when Kitten's Joy was winning all those races....

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

Yeah he's got probably 50 mil plus in the bank and sold her for 600k. DOH

As an aside, I don't care how deep my pockets were, it would drive me crazy to do what they do with claimers. I've been at AP 6 of the 7 racing days this year and have watched Calabrese every time heading for the picture. I don't think he could name half the horses he was standing next to. They are just a commodity to him
EDIT: As I'm sure they are a commodity to many other outfits...that was a melodramatic piece of drivel on my part

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

rene got off that gravy train last year....bet hed like those mounts back.......frank has the cash to play around in the claiming game in the highest level..yet his bread and butter is lower class claiming..why is that..turn em and burn um . get one for 25 drop em win and betem too....over and over.......you dont see him banging out 100k ocs

[Scav]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

rene got off that gravy train last year....bet hed like those mounts back.......frank has the cash to play around in the claiming game in the highest level..yet his bread and butter is lower class claiming..why is that..turn em and burn um . get one for 25 drop em win and betem too....over and over.......you dont see him banging out 100k ocs

Rene is back now once they get Fires his wins....They are going to use Meier's kid also....

He seems like a pretty sharp guy. Probably knows his limits and is satisfied with what they're doing and doesn't want to risk screwing it up. Hell if he's gambling on his horses you'd figure he'd want to play some games with them to get the odds halfway decent though.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

He seems like a pretty sharp guy. Probably knows his limits and is satisfied with what they're doing and doesn't want to risk screwing it up. Hell if he's gambling on his horses you'd figure he'd want to play some games with them to get the odds halfway decent though.

Coach, you don't understand the ego on this guy. he walks around Arlington like he owns the place, stands in the corner of the paddock to the tunnel and looks at all the jocks to find out information, knowing that they will do anything to get on his horses....

Originally Posted by Scav

Coach, you don't understand the ego on this guy. he walks around Arlington like he owns the place, stands in the corner of the paddock to the tunnel and looks at all the jocks to find out information, knowing that they will do anything to get on his horses....

What's it like when he goes to the windows? Does he have a group of stragglers trying to find out what he's betting?

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by Scav

Rene is back now once they get Fires his wins....They are going to use Meier's kid also....

i saw they gave em a monkey win ...

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

What's it like when he goes to the windows? Does he have a group of stragglers trying to find out what he's betting?

you need to meet Nick the Kid to understand the situation..

and there is much, much more to Calabrese than meets the eye

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

What's it like when he goes to the windows? Does he have a group of stragglers trying to find out what he's betting?

Yes, I accidently got behind him the other day and their was about 15 people within 5 feet trying to get a sniff of what he is playing...I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he sweeps cards at AP on a regular basis.....

I'll never forget, last year I am chillin in the paddock, Hobby has two horses in the race, horses are gone and he comes up to Calabrese and shooting the ****, about 8mtp. I hear Hobby go, "The public is nuts for betting my one horse, and the other horse is 10/1 and is better". Calabrese goes right to the windows (There are windows within 10 feet in the paddock, one live teller and 3 machines)

I go up to the window and put 200wp and $100 exacta box with Bird Charm, Hobby's horse and another. Hobby's 3/1 ran last, while his 10/1 ran 2nd with Bird Charm winning, for a $100 exacta and I think a $10 place price.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

[quote=GBBob]you need to meet Nick the Kid to understand the situation..
OH MY GOD!!!!

[Scav]

Originally Posted by GBBob

you need to meet Nick the Kid to understand the situation..

and there is much, much more to Calabrese than meets the eye

Nick the Kid has been allowed back into Arlington now, I saw him in the Gold Room and wandering around the paddock rocking the cowboy hat and tie.

He is also a DT member

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Scav

By group I meant 25k claimers. They don't have many allowance horses except DOA and Lewis Michael, both homebreds, and they don't buy many at the sales, if any now that I think about it. I actually think you will see Frank chill out soon and focus on breeding, especially if he holds onto DOA/DOL...He has a decent broodmare band producing, he should have never sold DOA's mom....

Isnt he like 100 years old?

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Isnt he like 100 years old?

I have no idea, my guess would be late 60's early 70's

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by Scav

Nick the Kid has been allowed back into Arlington now, I saw him in the Gold Room and wandering around the paddock rocking the cowboy hat and tie.

He is also a DT member

whatever...the whole thing is bizarre

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Isnt he like 100 years old?

your getting there too big guy.....