If you trained Lava Man.....

[FGFan]

Originally Posted by CSC

I agree with you partly GR, if the horse is still willing...Yes, however I don't think a horse of Lava Man's stature should be running at Mountaineer against 5k claimers just because he wants to run. That would be sort of like when Ali fought against Holmes and being beat to a pulp when he was clearly over the hill. It wasn't too pleasant to watch. I do understand your post from a humane point of view. It is a nice thought but like all of us with age we start to lose our faculties.

I agree with GR, particularly as to the humans egos and what they want to do, it's really about what he wants to do.
Even though he lost yesterday, he still is game to run.
As to 5k at Mountaineer I don't think that would happen.
There are certainly viable, competitve races in CA that he could run in, even if it's a 100k optional claiming, just don't put him in for the tag, even just some stake races doesn't have to be graded.
Still competitive, he would remain in training, be at the track and be happy.
I for one would like to see him keep running, the Kentucky horse park can come later in his life.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Excellent post.

yeah, but did you say earlier in the thread that you thought he should be served as meat at a fast food restaurant?

[geeker2]

Originally Posted by FGFan

I agree with GR, particularly as to the humans egos and what they want to do, it's really about what he wants to do.
Even though he lost yesterday, he still is game to run.
As to 5k at Mountaineer I don't think that would happen.
There are certainly viable, competitve races in CA that he could run in, even if it's a 100k optional claiming, just don't put him in for the tag, even just some stake races doesn't have to be graded.
Still competitive, he would remain in training, be at the track and be happy.
I for one would like to see him keep running, the Kentucky horse park can come later in his life.

I agree with FG who agrees with KG who agrees with GR if think..unless KG does think LM belongs in KFC...

[FGFan]

Originally Posted by geeker2

I agree with FG who agrees with KG who agrees with GR if think..unless KG does think LM belongs in KFC...

But I did miss where KG said he belongs in JIB, but MMSC said she'd smack KG for that one!!!
But I agree with G2 and GR and, and, and ........

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

yeah, but did you say earlier in the thread that you thought he should be served as meat at a fast food restaurant?

That was a joke. Kind of. If the owners can't see the obvious and that he no longer is a grade one level horse, then yes, retiring him would be better than continuing to send him out there with no chance to win. If they can open their eyes and see there are other levels and tracks that he can be competitive and earn decent money, then they absolutely should keep him running.

Besides, I'd hate to be eating Lava Man. Can you imagine how drugged up that horse has been?

[my miss storm cat]

http://www.drf.com/news/article/96553.html


Lava Man's career likely over
By STEVE ANDERSEN
DEL MAR, Calif. - Lava Man, the $50,000 claimer who went on to win seven Grade 1 races and earn more than $5 million, has probably run his last race.

Monday, a day after Lava Man finished last of six in the Grade 1 Eddie Read Handicap at Del Mar, owners Steve Kenly and Jason Wood and trainer Doug O’Neill had several conversations regarding the future of the 7-year-old gelding. Most centered around ending Lava Man’s racing career, although Kenly stopped short of actually saying it.

"The R word is a tough thing to say," Kenly said. He said it was "pretty slim" that Lava Man would start again.

O’Neill, who has trained Lava Man since he was claimed for $50,000 on Aug. 13, 2004, was advising Wood and Kenly to end the gelding’s career.

"We’re definitely kicking him out and retirement is the right word," he said. "The thing that makes it tough is that he looks so well. I think it's time to hang up the glue-on shoes."

Kenly was at O’Neill stable at Del Mar, and spoke frequently on Monday with Wood, who lives in nearby Orange County. Kenly co-owns Lava Man with his father and sister, Dave and Tracy.

Lava Man has lost his last six career races. In Sunday’s Eddie Read, he stalked pacesetter Storm Military to the eighth pole and faded to finish 2 1/2 lengths behind the winner, Monzante. Lava Man has lost three races this year, including the Grade 1 Charles Whittingham Handicap at Hollywood Park on June 7, where he finished third, by a neck.

His most recent win came in the Grade 1 Hollywood Gold Cup in June 2007, his third consecutive win in that race. The victory gave Lava Man a record-equaling third Gold Cup win, joining Native Diver (1965-67) as the only horse to reach that milestone. Lava Man’s other Grade 1 wins were consecutive runnings of the Santa Anita Handicap in 2006-07, the 2006 Pacific Classic, and the 2006 Whittingham.

A California-bred, Lava Man earned $5,268,706 in his 46-race career, which included 17 wins. He earned $5,170,103 after he was claimed.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

That was a joke. Kind of. If the owners can't see the obvious and that he no longer is a grade one level horse, then yes, retiring him would be better than continuing to send him out there with no chance to win. If they can open their eyes and see there are other levels and tracks that he can be competitive and earn decent money, then they absolutely should keep him running.

Besides, I'd hate to be eating Lava Man. Can you imagine how drugged up that horse has been?

The problem is that he doesnt like to ship and the times that they have tried that route have proven to be disastrous.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

The problem is that he doesnt like to ship and the times that they have tried that route have proven to be disastrous.

Well it seems to be a moot point now but I think there's a difference between shipping to Dubai or Japan or to the BC Classic than there is in shipping to Northern California for the Berkeley Hcp.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Well it seems to be a moot point now but I think there's a difference between shipping to Dubai or Japan or to the BC Classic than there is in shipping to Northern California for the Berkeley Hcp.

yes true, although its now a moot point, I never believed the part about him not shipping well, because they shipped him out to face the wolves. they put him in spots way over his head compared to what he faced on the west coast.

[lemoncrush]

I can't think of another horse that takes more dumb money over and over again. I could not believe he was 5/2 with 2 minutes to post.

I would love to him to keep racing because there are way too many Californians and race fans in general that throw dumb sentimental money on that horse.

[migreen]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

I think legacies are for the owners, not the horses. If the horse still wants to run, they should keep running him, even if it means going to lower levels where he can compete. They owe him the best possible life they can offer, and if for him, it still includes running, then let him do it. If he makes it clear he doesn't want to run anymore, then they should retire him. And then, I would hope, look for something else for him to do. I thought Barclay Tagg was right on the money when he said he made Funny Cide a track pony because he said didn't want him spending his day standing in a field, bored out of his noggin. These horses are not elderly- they're still in the prime of their lives and need something to do. Retiring because he can't compete at Grade 1s anymore is for a human's ego, not a horse's emotional health.

I work at a zoo and see how much time and money and effort goes into trying to keep the animals there mentally active, because boredom is incredibly stressful. Retirement to a nice quiet place to live sounds great, but for animals it can mean a whole lot of long days with nothing to fill them.

Excellent post.

Lets not forget that there are many careers for a Tbred outside racing . . some involve other forms of competition, and some do not. There are many ways for a loved horse to be useful. It takes some doing to retrain an off-the-track horse, but having said that, its done every day. Remember, 7 is old for a racehorse, but young in every other equine discipline. Even a 10 YO like Evening Attire is just approaching middle age in most equine pursuits.

So . . Lava Man, and horses like him, can retire from the track, and do a lot more than graze all day.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

yes true, although its now a moot point, I never believed the part about him not shipping well, because they shipped him out to face the wolves. they put him in spots way over his head compared to what he faced on the west coast.

Didn't he always have to run out of the detention barn? And didn't he have to run out of the detention barn yesterday? The thing that was strange about all those races was that he quit at pretty much the exact same time in every one. Right around when the lactic acid starts to build up.

[letswastemoney]

I don't like Lava Man, but he didn't lose by that much. He could still win optional claimers or go north and win a stake at Golden Gate or something.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by letswastemoney

I don't like Lava Man, but he didn't lose by that much. He could still win optional claimers or go north and win a stake at Golden Gate or something.

optional claimers? what are they going to card...non winners of 16 other than?

[CSC]

Originally Posted by FGFan

I agree with GR, particularly as to the humans egos and what they want to do, it's really about what he wants to do.
Even though he lost yesterday, he still is game to run.
As to 5k at Mountaineer I don't think that would happen.
There are certainly viable, competitve races in CA that he could run in, even if it's a 100k optional claiming, just don't put him in for the tag, even just some stake races doesn't have to be graded.
Still competitive, he would remain in training, be at the track and be happy.
I for one would like to see him keep running, the Kentucky horse park can come later in his life.

There aren't as many choices for geldings as there are for colts and fillies. If there is a horse heaven, the geldings got stiffed.

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

optional claimers? what are they going to card...non winners of 16 other than?

You're kidding, right?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by SentToStud

You're kidding, right?

Im kidding about the non winners of 16 of course.

Do they card Optional/claiming races in So Cal where horses can run WITHOUT a tag with no conditions? I really dont know. I wouldnt think so (hence my post) but i really dont know and havent seen one. Have you?

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by SentToStud

And really, everyone knows Jim wears his bathrobe and not a trenchcoat to the track.

i'm trying to decide what to wear for million day. as of now i'm leaning towards a hospital gown and slippers.

[GenuineRisk]

Speaking of second careers, this thread made me remember the one about Ashkal Way when he was retired from racing and given to Jeannine Edwards- I googled and found an update from November and a video from this past April of her riding him:

http://www.eventingca.com/content/view/48/36/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/97305011@N00/2517701810/

He looks pretty darn good, I think- she's doing right by him.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jms62

Don't expect too many thought provoking responses from the juveniles that frequent the paddock. If I were Lava Man's trainer my next move would be get him out of California and run him on dirt. If he doesn't have a competitive effort than I would retire him. He was a very good horse and I don't think many fans want to see him embarrassed.

why would you remove him from california when his best races were there?

as for competitive effort-he may not have the right stuff for gr 1's, but he can still be competitive. why would anyone be embarrassed if he goes to a lower level? no one is saying drop him into the claiming ranks.
keep him where he's comfortable, and keep him happy. if he's happy at the track, keep him there. or find him a career for after racing like they have with With Anticipation.