So..no more free speech?

[Danzig]

no biggie.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i may be incorrect, or oversimplifying, but isn't what makes a person jewish their religious belief? i don't see how you can say that hitlers annihilation of so many jews had nothing to do with their religion. doesn't it have everything to do with it? down thru the centuries, many countries at one point or another expelled their jewish citizens, or encouraged much worse. the group as a whole always seemed an easy target, a scapegoat for whatever ailed the populace as a whole.

It is simplistic, and incorrect! The Jews,downtrodden and besmirched as they are, have a knack for being shrewd business people. It brings them much harrassment and the vitrol spewed at their race has nothing to do with their religion. For example..they don't recruit....Christians,Mormon,JW's,Islam all do. Their religion, and their culture is almost inclusive(like Amish) but they will always have a tourist shop.

Originally Posted by dalakhani

LOL. Poor Pgardn. Are you trying to change the argument? 7th grade debate rears its ugly head.

You already lost pal. Come up with something new.

Ok.
I see you in a whole new light.

You refuse to answer the question.

I will lay it out clearly:

1. The Jews were not persecuted because of their religious beliefs.
2. They were persecuted due to numerous social factors one of the major being that they were actually living fairly well in a severely depressed Germany. They were easy targets as they did not resist. And they could be used as scapegoats because "they had all the money" while Germans lived poorly. A mostly innaccurate assessment. The Germans rid the Jews of their business and money as retribution. They did not nail them to crosses. They stole their gold teeth.

What the hell is a religious belief Dalkani? What dont you get?


You are just wrong.
I dont know what more to say.
Go read some history.
At first I thought it was mere semantics but its not.

I know you are understanding what I am trying to say
because you are not dumb. But you are very, very disingenuious.

[Danzig]

their 'knack' as you call it for business....i would call that a bit of a stereotype. for years and years-centuries really, back to the middle ages, they had no venue opened to them for business, with many turning to money- lending as most other trades were illegal for jews. so, along with getting harrassed for their religion, they were attacked for usury, and by those who owed them money-or by those who knew they had money, else how could they lend it?
but what it all boils down to, all these centuries, is their religious beliefs. it's because of their faith that they were confined to ghettoes, banned from most trades, attacked, beaten, killed, charged with witchcraft, killing and eating good little christian children, etc, etc.

Originally Posted by Mortimer

Not to pretend to be smarter than The Teacher and the Doorknob ( make a great book title)..but you are quite wrong, Dala.



The Jewish people were put into horrifying conditions because they all had ,as very bad luck would have , a common flaw in Hitlers eyes.The odds on this are tremendous..ie...that millions of people who were of one religion and way of life would all display the same Hitlerthink flaw.



But it had absolutely nothing to do with religious belief.

Holy sht.
An honest person.

Originally Posted by Danzig

their 'knack' as you call it for business....i would call that a bit of a stereotype. for years and years-centuries really, back to the middle ages, they had no venue opened to them for business, with many turning to money- lending as most other trades were illegal for jews. so, along with getting harrassed for their religion, they were attacked for usury, and by those who owed them money-or by those who knew they had money, else how could they lend it?
but what it all boils down to, all these centuries, is their religious beliefs. it's because of their faith that they were confined to ghettoes, banned from most trades, attacked, beaten, killed, charged with witchcraft, killing and eating good little christian children, etc, etc.

I would also.

Not true in Germany in the late 30's and 40's.
They were very active in Germany in trade and as merchant's but when
WWI ended and the depression came on, they became targets largely because of economic misperceptions. Easy targets.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Holy sht.
An honest person.

i guess someone is honest if they agree with your flip flopped discussion changing point of view? LOL

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Holy sht.
An honest person.

It had very, very little to do with RELIGIOUS beliefs-pgardn

Which one is it Pgardn? Are you flipping back to it had "nothing" to do with religiuos beliefs or are we still at very, very little?

Or are you going to deny you posted this?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by pgardn

I would also.

Not true in Germany in the late 30's and 40's.They were very active in Germany in trade and as merchant's but when
WWI ended and the depression came on, they became targets largely because of economic misperceptions. Easy targets.

i'm talking about further back then the last century...altho in rome, they were still kept in a 'ghetto' where the germans marched most of the inhabitants out of rome right under the pope's nose, nary a word of protest from that fellow.

[Mortimer]

The Egyptians drove out the Jewish people only because they could not field a good softball team.

[Mortimer]

Perhaps that is what Hitler saw.

[geeker2]

The Jewish girls I knew really put out

Originally Posted by dalakhani

It had very, very little to do with RELIGIOUS beliefs-pgardn

Which one is it Pgardn? Are you flipping back to it had "nothing" to do with religiuos beliefs or are we still at very, very little?

Or are you going to deny you posted this?

There are isolated cases of terror that some Christian Germans felt the Jews betrayed Jesus. This aint new. And never will be in some Christians minds.

But this is not the systematic thrust of Hitler's crystal nacht, and then the subsequent move to ghettos followed by Concentration camps, which led to the final solution.

Man you are stubborn as hell.
And very disingenuious. Very.
You know I know exactly what you are attempting.

You lost and all that crap... like this is some damn game.
It was an attempt at some insight and you trashed it.

Originally Posted by Danzig

i'm talking about further back then the last century...altho in rome, they were still kept in a 'ghetto' where the germans marched most of the inhabitants out of rome right under the pope's nose, nary a word of protest from that fellow.

Causing John Paul to issue a formal apology.
Something that might not come from the current Pope.

Galileo is off the hook also.
Im sure he is happy about that.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by Danzig

their 'knack' as you call it for business....i would call that a bit of a stereotype. for years and years-centuries really, back to the middle ages, they had no venue opened to them for business, with many turning to money- lending as most other trades were illegal for jews. so, along with getting harrassed for their religion, they were attacked for usury, and by those who owed them money-or by those who knew they had money, else how could they lend it?
but what it all boils down to, all these centuries, is their religious beliefs. it's because of their faith that they were confined to ghettoes, banned from most trades, attacked, beaten, killed, charged with witchcraft, killing and eating good little christian children, etc, etc.

I resisted expanding on that stereotype,but nevertheless you explained it. 2 things,though....what is it about their religion is so offensive(like I said..they don't infringe on others beliefs) and secondly...what makes you think they were burned as witches and that stuff?

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by geeker2

The Jewish girls I knew really put out

When you only have 2 weeks out of the month to have fun...I guess so!

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Causing John Paul to issue a formal apology.
Something that might not come from the current Pope.

Galileo is off the hook also.
Im sure he is happy about that.

I was raised in Catholic schools and they truly blamed the Jews for "killing Christ" Don't know what the new Pope thinks about it.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I think through all of this we forgot how we got here. Dimmy made and continues to make dumb comments. I have yet to see one person disagree with this. Anyone?

Sit down,fool,your time is over!

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Still waiting....

yeah...waiting for the short bus, or is it a little horse?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by pgardn

There are isolated cases of terror that some Christian Germans felt the Jews betrayed Jesus. This aint new. And never will be in some Christians minds.
But this is not the systematic thrust of Hitler's crystal nacht, and then the subsequent move to ghettos followed by Concentration camps, which led to the final solution.

Man you are stubborn as hell.
And very disingenuious. Very.
You know I know exactly what you are attempting.

You lost and all that crap... like this is some damn game.
It was an attempt at some insight and you trashed it.

So why don't you just say that the original contention was wrong? you keep flip flopping. See...I know what YOU are trying to do.

you want to talk about disingenuous you phony flopper? Thats laughable. You came on this thread to be the big bad defender of dimmigirvan and now you are playing the whole intellectual card. Spare me.

Do you want me to pull up all of the posts that you directed at me and dahoss? There was one post where you told dahoss that he was aiming to beat up on dimmigirvan except that he messed up because you, the big bad intellectual, stepped in and put us in our place.

Now, after all of that, you want to act like you were trying to enlighten us with insight from some book you read? Get over yourself. Please, get over yourself.