Flag Burning

Good to see the Congress has taken time to debate such a far reaching immediate problem that is so clearly a ticking time bomb.

What a flippin joke waste of time...
Frikkin political garbage. Orin Hatch, whos intellect I respect, has just fallen about 30 rungs on my ladder.

Serve the people not your reelections... pieces of refuse, honest to God.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Good to see the Congress has taken time to debate such a far reaching immediate problem that is so clearly a ticking time bomb.

What a flippin joke waste of time...
Frikkin political garbage. Orin Hatch, whos intellect I respect, has just fallen about 30 rungs on my ladder.

Serve the people not your reelections... pieces of refuse, honest to God.

Honestly, Pat, no one wants to see "Old Glory" go up in smoke and flames.
So isn't it safe to run on a record of support for the flag than discuss the real failures that might need to be addressed?
Or...is this a "smoke screen"?

[irishtrekker]

Man, I'm glad I'm not the only one who rolled my eyes when this came up...In Seattle we have a great liberal cartoonist named David Horsey, and he came up with a doozy the other day:

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/horsey...te.asp?id=1407

Why is it that this administration and Congress are completely opposed to government intervention *unless* it involves your private lives and personal morals? Shouldn't they care about bigger things, like maybe our skyrocketing debt? (Yes, that goes for liberal roll-over legislators, too.)

[Downthestretch55]

Irish,
That's one of the best cartoons I've seen in a while. LOL!
DTS

Bush is naked in a cartoon.

Clinton actually masturbated in nearly every room of the White House.

Take your pick.

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

Bush is naked in a cartoon.

Clinton actually masturbated in nearly every room of the White House.

Take your pick.

While I was openly critical of Clinton's morals (or lack thereof), I'd rather have his leadership right now! I voted for Bush...and I was wrong! He's shown that he has no comprehension of the real world and is just another supporter of the rich and powerful...I was an idiot...but I'm better now!

[Exceller]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

While I was openly critical of Clinton's morals (or lack thereof), I'd rather have his leadership right now! I voted for Bush...and I was wrong! He's shown that he has no comprehension of the real world and is just another supporter of the rich and powerful...I was an idiot...but I'm better now!

Both families are awful. I wish they would both go away. 20 years of idiots and liars. Any idiot that would vote Hillary Clinton and 4 more years of these terrible families should lose their right to vote. Can you imagine a quarter of a century with two families running things. Disgusting.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by Bold Brooklynite

Bush is naked in a cartoon.

Clinton actually masturbated in nearly every room of the White House.

Take your pick.

Very funny...Bush isn't running the show. Cheney is.
Bush is just a "mouth piece".
Now that the NY times has revealed another disregard for the Constitution,
remember "free press"?...it's time to accuse this new paper of "treason".
What a joke.
DNS ignoring laws on orders...outing Valerie Plame...who else to blame?
Gays and flag burners....time to divert attention folks.
Let's just talk about something else besides the dismal failures and corruption.

[Exceller]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Very funny...Bush isn't running the show. Cheney is.
Bush is just a "mouth piece".
Now that the NY times has revealed another disregard for the Constitution,
remember "free press"?...it's time to accuse this new paper of "treason".
What a joke.
DNS ignoring laws on orders...outing Valerie Plame...who else to blame?
Gays and flag burners....time to divert attention folks.
Let's just talk about something else besides the dismal failures and corruption.

Let me guess, typical NY liberal. You people have destroyed the Democratic party with your "we are smarter than everybody" attitude. Dick Cheney doesn't run things, corporate america runs things. The morons like Clinton and Bush have let corporate america take over everything. As for flag burning, I served and I think people should be allowed to burn it, but only a mentally ill person would do it. The flag stands for the values of america, not the people running it. However, the bill is the house should pass. It would bar condominium and homeowner associations from restricting how the flag can be displayed. People should be able to put the flag wherever they want. It is the liberal elitist hypocrisy at work once again. Free speech as long as they agree with it. The NY Times is trash too. Lets have a paper that claims to care about the poor and working class, but make sure we take the advertising money from Tiffany so we can tell everyone they are nothing without the latest $25,000 watch for Tiffany. Liberals are killing the democratic party from their million dollar homes in Nantucket.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by Exceller

Let me guess, typical NY liberal. You people have destroyed the Democratic party with your "we are smarter than everybody" attitude. Dick Cheney doesn't run things, corporate america runs things. The morons like Clinton and Bush have let corporate america take over everything. As for flag burning, I served and I think people should be allowed to burn it, but only a mentally ill person would do it. The flag stands for the values of america, not the people running it. However, the bill is the house should pass. It would bar condominium and homeowner associations from restricting how the flag can be displayed. People should be able to put the flag wherever they want. It is the liberal elitist hypocrisy at work once again. Free speech as long as they agree with it. The NY Times is trash too. Lets have a paper that claims to care about the poor and working class, but make sure we take the advertising money from Tiffany so we can tell everyone they are nothing without the latest $25,000 watch for Tiffany. Liberals are killing the democratic party from their million dollar homes in Nantucket.

Liberal NYer? Nice try!
I'm an independent, and believe more with libertarian philosophy...
I guess you missed my point.
I don't like burning the flag...makes me sick to my stomach.
As does the present administration, with their attempt to divert attention from their failed policies.

[paisjpq]

Originally Posted by irishtrekker

Man, I'm glad I'm not the only one who rolled my eyes when this came up...In Seattle we have a great liberal cartoonist named David Horsey, and he came up with a doozy the other day:

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/horsey...te.asp?id=1407

Why is it that this administration and Congress are completely opposed to government intervention *unless* it involves your private lives and personal morals? Shouldn't they care about bigger things, like maybe our skyrocketing debt? (Yes, that goes for liberal roll-over legislators, too.)

that cartoon is fantastic!! And I'll say it for you guys--i'm a liberal.
But come on how can you not see a new flag burning debate as just deflection from all of the current administration's failures? And for the record this liberal is totally against flag burning.

[Exceller]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Liberal NYer? Nice try!
I'm an independent, and believe more with libertarian philosophy...
I guess you missed my point.
I don't like burning the flag...makes me sick to my stomach.
As does the present administration, with their atemt to divert attention from their failed policies.

If you are siding with the NYT on this one you are a liberal. That is garbage what they did. This administration is corrupt to the core, but what the NYT did was take out their personal dislike on the president by writing an article that should not have been run. Take off the tarian and add al and that is what you really are.

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by Exceller

Let me guess, typical NY liberal. You people have destroyed the Democratic party with your "we are smarter than everybody" attitude. Dick Cheney doesn't run things, corporate america runs things. The morons like Clinton and Bush have let corporate america take over everything. As for flag burning, I served and I think people should be allowed to burn it, but only a mentally ill person would do it. The flag stands for the values of america, not the people running it. However, the bill is the house should pass. It would bar condominium and homeowner associations from restricting how the flag can be displayed. People should be able to put the flag wherever they want. It is the liberal elitist hypocrisy at work once again. Free speech as long as they agree with it. The NY Times is trash too. Lets have a paper that claims to care about the poor and working class, but make sure we take the advertising money from Tiffany so we can tell everyone they are nothing without the latest $25,000 watch for Tiffany. Liberals are killing the democratic party from their million dollar homes in Nantucket.

I have no love for liberals either (Phil Ochs' song, "Love Me I'm A Liberal" said it best!), all for equality and social justice till it comes to their neighborhood! Corporate America has ruled this land for far too long...perhaps the founding fathers were right and we need an actual revolution (hopefully bloodless). I still think Plato had it right with his idea of "Philosopher Kings"....power must somehow be connected to compassion instead of greed and instead of the next Political Bozo, we need an intellectual who believes in fairness, equality and human dignity....

[Exceller]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

that cartoon is fantastic!! And I'll say it for you guys--i'm a liberal.
But come on how can you not see a new flag burning debate as just deflection from all of the current administration's failures? And for the record this liberal is totally against flag burning.

The flag burning has little to do with the administration, it is more the congress. The administration uses their wacko religious/idiotic views on things like gay marriage when they want to get people distracted. The flag burning issue has been around forever and July 4 is always a good time to bring it up. The fact is it probably would be nice to see it hit the states to see if they can get the 2/3 vote. Americans might actually wake up and pay attention to an issue.

[Downthestretch55]

Well, exceller, you can label me what ever you want.
I didn't attempt to label you for your views.
I believe that the Constitution is a very important document...disagree if you want, you're entitled.
But when Bush put his hand on a Bible and swore he's uphold it, and then attacks a newspaper for excersing "freedom of the press"...seems a bit "problematic" to me.
Talk about the issue....not me.

DTS

[Exceller]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

I have no love for liberals either (Phil Ochs' song, "Love Me I'm A Liberal" said it best!), all for equality and social justice till it comes to their neighborhood! Corporate America has ruled this land for far too long...perhaps the founding fathers were right and we need an actual revolution (hopefully bloodless). I still think Plato had it right with his idea of "Philosopher Kings"....power must somehow be connected to compassion instead of greed and instead of the next Political Bozo, we need an intellectual who believes in fairness, equality and human dignity....

The worse thing about liberals is they actually pretend to look out for the little guy but they are led mostly by elitist NYers and SFers that fly around in private jets telling americans to conserve oil. They have killed the working class part of the democratic party. They benefit from fiscal policies like this administration, although they complain every single one takes the tax cut. The worse thing about them though is that they allow people in this administration to run circles around them and then they say how stupid bush is. Gees, the guy has been crushing the democratic party for years now. Nancy Pelosi doesn't represent average people, she is an elitist. Lets get some new leadership in there.

[Exceller]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Well, exceller, you can label me what ever you want.
I didn't attempt to label you for your views.
I believe that the Constitution is a very important document...disagree if you want, you're entitled.
But when Bush put his hand on a Bible and swore he's uphold it, and then attacks a newspaper for excersing "freedom of the press"...seems a bit "problematic" to me.
Talk about the issue....not me.

DTS

Fine, you are a libertarian. The NY Times has acted like the mouthpiece of the Democratic Party for too long. It is your typical elitist liberal paper. Rich people who think the average american is too stupid to think for themself. Where is Truman when we need him.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by Exceller

Fine, you are a libertarian. The NY Times has acted like the mouthpiece of the Democratic Party for too long. It is your typical elitist liberal paper. Rich people who think the average american is too stupid to think for themself. Where is Truman when we need him.

Exceller,
Now you're putting words in my mouth.
The average American can certainly think (and vote accordingly) for themselves. I NEVER said they couldn't.
I DO think that any newspaper, ANY, has a responsiblity to excersise their right to inform the public they sell papers to. That right is constitutionally protected.
I AM stating that the Repubs, because they control both houses, set the agenda...what is to be discussed.
Pgardn said so much when he started this thread. Go back and reread it.
The present administration is "shooting the messenger" for providing the message...yet ANOTHER diversion from their failures.
Now, should we talk about gay marriage, flag burning, school prayer, "illegal aliens"???????
In my humble view, many see right through these vain attempts to divert attention. Just like I saw through your valiant attempt to label my views.
Stick to the issue (no "name calling"). Doing otherwise denies the wisdom of my words and evidences your lack thereof.
DTS

[Exceller]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Exceller,
Now you're putting words in my mouth.
The average American can certainly think (and vote accordingly) for themselves. I NEVER said they couldn't.
I DO think that any newspaper, ANY, has a responsiblity to excersise their right to inform the public they sell papers to. That right is constitutionally protected.
I AM stating that the Repubs, because they control both houses, set the agenda...what is to be discussed.
Pgardn said so much when he started this thread. Go back and reread it.
The present administration is "shooting the messenger" for providing the message...yet ANOTHER diversion from their failures.
Now, should we talk about gay marriage, flag burning, school prayer, "illegal aliens"???????
In my humble view, many see right through these vain attempts to divert attention. Just like I saw through your valiant attempt to label my views.
Stick to the issue (no "name calling"). Doing otherwise denies the wisdom of my words and evidences your lack thereof.
DTS

Very little wisdom in your words. Sounds like you are one of those that kneel at the altar of Maureen Dowd and Tom Friedman.

[irishtrekker]

DTS, agree with everything you say, although I am a liberal (although I refuse to join the Democratic party, so there ya go).

BB, we will obviously never agree on anything political, but I really don't care about Clinton and his private sex life. I do care about wiretapping, climate change and the deficit. I'd vote for *any* politician who actually did something for the voters instead of for a select group of donors.

Exceller, to quote:
"The worse thing about liberals is they actually pretend to look out for the little guy but they are led mostly by elitist NYers and SFers that fly around in private jets telling americans to conserve oil. They have killed the working class part of the democratic party."

I could rewrite that and swap "liberals" for conservatives and "democratic" for Republican, and we'd have the same thing...except I suppose Republicans tell us to burn oil instead of conserve it. Neither party is sacrosanct, and both have abandoned most of their constituents, if you ask me...but most of my friends are liberal, and we are anything but rich or from NY or SF (although what exactly is wrong with being from a big city?? Cities are part of this country, too). I get a little tired of the liberal elitist stereotype. Yes, I'm educated. So are a lot of your conservative pundits -- they're Ivy Leaguers, for Pete's sake! They have private jets, too! They aren't exactly helping the working class in New Orleans, or anywhere else. Are you telling me that Tom DeLay and co are any less elitist/wealthy/powerful than the Democratic leaders? Neither side is comprised of "average" Americans, the last time I checked.

I think the NYT was spot-on. We have a right to know what's being done in our name, particularly when you can't actually jeopardize the operation because the banks are under subpoena and have to comply anyway. I think terrorists are smart enough to know we're probably monitoring international financial and communications channels anyway, and I'll take freedom of the press over communist-style suppression in the name of state security any day (I've been to Cuba, and we don't want to go that way).

I *love* my country. I'm away now and miss it like I never imagined I would. I just don't like the way it's headed, and last time I checked I still had the right to say so (although 'Pent would probably come to get me if he were around here...lol).