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#101
02-07-2008, 11:38 PM
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#102
02-07-2008, 11:40 PM
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#103
02-07-2008, 11:42 PM
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Their lives would be made more of a hell through universal health care as well! They work hard enough as it is...
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#104
02-07-2008, 11:43 PM
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i don't think it's the governments job to provide health care. i don't think it's the govts job to provide many of the things it provides already. but states have turned over much of what they used to, or should provide now, to the feds as they don't want to foot the bill. so then the federal govt gets far more bloated then it should be. it's not a federal issue. but then, social security, medicare, medicaid, etc shouldn't be either. people want to keep talking about the health ins problem when in fact those who can't afford coverage are already eligible for medicare or medicaid. the trick is that many who CAN afford coverage, don't want to afford it. they want the 'govt' to foot the bill. but the 'govt' doesn't foot the bill, we do. i pay for my own yet still pay for so many others...now my bill should get that much bigger? i don't believe it is the govts job to take care of us. i don't want the govt in my life to that extent. i want them involved in my life, and my pocketbook, as little as possible.
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#105
02-07-2008, 11:48 PM
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#106
02-07-2008, 11:49 PM
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#107
02-07-2008, 11:52 PM
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#108
02-07-2008, 11:53 PM
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And I think the selfish thing is the other way around. I think it is selfish to ask hard working American people to pay more in taxes so those who haven't worked enough in life or made poor decisions can have universal health care. How would Universal Health Care have helped them rebuild their homes? That has got to be one of the dumbest things I have ever heard. Again, you didn't do any volunteer work for the Katrina victims I take it. I not only gave my money, but I gave my time as well.
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#109
02-07-2008, 11:56 PM
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Last edited by SCUDSBROTHER : 02-08-2008 at 12:09 AM.
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#110
02-07-2008, 11:58 PM
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#111
02-08-2008, 12:06 AM
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#112
02-08-2008, 12:22 AM
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A lot of you consider yourself Christians (even if you don't attend church regularly.)I just want to say that Christ said it's pretty important how you treat the least among you.The least wasteful way to do that is National Healthcare.Nobody is gunna buy crack with it.Nobody is gunna be acting lazy while doing it(they have to get up and go to the doctor.)Nobody is gunna want to use it.They will use it when they have to.It's a lot better than giving checks out to be used in any way they want.There are only 2 reasons to be against it:
1)selfishnous 2)dislike of the poor Like I said,it's a predominantly Christian country,.So,it would appear people simply ignore their own religion.
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#113
02-08-2008, 07:01 AM
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my point is that the FEDERAL govt does not exist for much of what it has been forced to take on-the states should be providing their citizens for much of what the feds provide. the reason there is so much fraud and waste in many of these federal programs is that too much of the country is too far from d.c., and the further from that seat you are, the more problems you encounter with these programs. each state should bear the burden for any of these programs. that way you don't have the issues you have right now with homeland security for instance. federal dollars were released to help states with security issues. we all should acknowledge that some areas would be considered more of a target then others. yet small states want the money divided evenly. how does that make sense? the Feds should protect our borders with mexico and canada, and our ports. other than that, it should be a state by state issue issue. but again, state govts push much of their responsibility onto the feds, bloating our federal govt, and taking more of our taxes for them-then the states can't help if they want. arkansas has arkids first, and it's a pretty good program. but it also explains why our tax burden is so high here in arkansas. we're still paying for fed programs as well. over ten cents on the dollar sales tax here, with state income tax--and there had been a surplus tax tacked onto that for years (thanks to 'lower tax' huckabee  ) and also a personal property tax. and the sales tax is applied even to food and medicine. it's ridiculous. don't you feel that much of what the feds attempt to do would work much better, if done state by state? less red tape, less administration, as those offices would be local, with no regional and national offices necessary?
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#114
02-08-2008, 07:04 AM
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like i said, posts ago, no doubt improvements could be made. i just don't think a national healthcare system as proposed by hillary would be a solution. i would rather see a solution to the problem, then a program along the lines of social security.
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#115
02-08-2008, 07:37 AM
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actually, health care probably could be paid for with what we already pay to the govt. other programs would have to be cut. IF they did come up with a viable health care plan, medicaid/medicare would no longer be necessary (i'd assume)...and it would be nice if pols would put the necessities of life first, and maybe cut the foreign aid budget, or bs pork barrely spending for their home states. once upon a time, afghanistan got more of our money than any other foreign country--an attempt by us to buy favor. that worked well..... i read an article the other day that talked about our military budget. it's astronomical. of course i always knew it was fairly high...but it compared what we spent to our next closest 'competitor', china. the gap between us and them is beyond huge. and a lot of that is wasteful--look at the v-2 osprey program. no telling how much that has cost over the years, and the damned thing still doesn't work right. but it's a pipe dream to think that taxes wouldn't go up tremendously to fund national healthcare. and who will get stuck holding the tab yet again? those of us in the middle class, as always. and then the middle class gets accused of being selfish, while footing the majority of every bill the 'govt' pays.
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#116
02-08-2008, 07:53 AM
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you hear a lot of talk about those withou coverage--but how many of the people without coverage truly have no alternative? how many without private insurance are covered thru the medical plans already in place?
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#118
02-08-2008, 03:11 PM
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#119
02-08-2008, 03:38 PM
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The AMA limits med school entrants, then encourages people to quit during residency. Choke down the supply of doctors, and ensure that their costs remain high. They limit the number of jobs (even routine work) that can be done by non-doctors. Most important, the AMA insists on self-policing, and has a code of silence, even for incompetents. Guaranteed jobs for doctors, and screw the public good. A book I have, written by a guy named Coddington called The Crisis in Health Care: Costs, Choices, and Strategies, predicted these outcomes under our market-based system: More than 40 million uninsured Continued gaps in safety net coverage Double-digit health plan rate increases Smaller employers cutting coverage or even dropping health plans Increased co-payments and deductibles for employees Large rate increases for private insurers in shrinking markets Numerous failures of HMOs and withdrawal from the market by larger insurance companies Continued cost shifting in an increasingly fragmented market Continued inflation of health care costs This book was written in the late 70's. There is only one way to move toward universal HC and that is to open Medicaid/Medicare to buy-ins. But the stakeholders, especially the AMA are not going to let this happen until their last ounce of blood gets spilled. They have too much at stake. Why would they give it up willingly? Of course they won't. The insurance companies are not the true bad guy here. The AMA is. You won't see univ HC until these two things happen: 1. The US public becomes far less tolerant of the uninsured issue than it is now. 2. You bust the AMA. F'k all the doctors and med students who moan about working 60 hour weeks to support their family and because their job demands it. Bullshit. Lots of people work big hours. You do what you need to do to be successful. And double F'k the ones who cry about their student loans. good luck.
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#120
02-08-2008, 10:22 PM
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I think the whole thing about a shortage of doctors is total bullshit.If you get the AMA to stop artificially limiting the number of doctors,then there would never be a shortage.They've worked so hard to make it a glamour job that it would take generations before people stopped wanting to be doctors.Look at these other European Countries(with national care.)They have the same (or more) # of doctors/1000 people.She is full of ****,and lies.Other than in the E.R.,and Surgery,we don't need all these doctors.You probably get touched more in a 1 night stand than you do by all the doctors you've ever seen in examining rooms.Give nurses specialized training,and let these greedy people go into designing video games.Start with these Psychiatrists that are bolted to these chairs behind the desk.Any nurse (with a Psychiatrist in charge of them) could do what these "doctors" do.
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