mccain's vp

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

You dont know his plan.

Factcheck.org

i know i read that during an interview just the other day that he said he was keeping bushes tax cuts. i don't need to go to factcheck, unless you're suggesting barack doesn't know what he's saying?

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i know i read that during an interview just the other day that he said he was keeping bushes tax cuts. i don't need to go to factcheck, unless you're suggesting barack doesn't know what he's saying?

I think the incorrect part was about the middle class having to pay for new social programs.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

So basically greed is counteracted by heavy taxation? This is a global ecomomy now. The more you tax big business, the less incentive there is to keep jobs here. The middle class is pandered to and told how bad they have it yet the middle class lives far greater than it did 40 years ago.

very true. capital gains taxes, which obama wants to raise ( the EVIL rich are such easy targets) and any other tax that impedes investment here, and business growth here, is not good in the long run for anyone here. but at least obama and his ilk would feel better about how they robbed from the rich to give to the poor.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

I think the incorrect part was about the middle class having to pay for new social programs.

who will pay if not the middle class? don't we pay the lions' share of most taxes as it is? the poor don't. hell, i know a gal who doesn't pay a penny in federal income tax because she's single with a couple kids. but come spring, she gets a huge 'rebate' check from the govt-earned income tax credit. yeah, we pay for that. i just want to know how you can get federal tax dollars returned that you never sent in. wish i knew that trick.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

nothing wrong with Reaganomics or greed, the only problem was that spending was supposed to be controlled, and that never happened.

you mean like when you get a raise, which means more money-so you go buy something else that you can suddenly afford? never get ahead that way.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

This is why these programs had to be started in the 1st place(human nature tends toward greed, and without this evil gov't intrusion, you would just have the rich and the poor.) That is exactly what you would see(very rich n' very poor.)

exactly what programs are these that you're speaking of? i want to know who to thank for me being neither rich nor poor. hell, i thought it was my, and my husbands, blood sweat and tears that kept me afloat.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

the middle class lives far greater than it did 40 years ago.

For a m.c. family to live at the same level, the wife has to work. Every day they stop in front of my house, and take the kids into the house of some lady across the street(I doubt that loudmouth is even licensed.)

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i know i read that during an interview just the other day that he said he was keeping bushes tax cuts. i don't need to go to factcheck, unless you're suggesting barack doesn't know what he's saying?

He is keeping tax cuts for the middle class but on top of that adding tax credits for families. The big difference is that he is rolling them back for families making over 250k and some for corporations. He also plans to increase Capital gains taxes and keep AMT in place.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

exactly what programs are these that you're speaking of? i want to know who to thank for me being neither rich nor poor. hell, i thought it was my, and my husbands, blood sweat and tears that kept me afloat.

Start with Social Security. I'm guessing here, but without that, your mother in law (you so enjoy) may of had to live with you.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Danzig

very true. capital gains taxes, which obama wants to raise ( the EVIL rich are such easy targets) and any other tax that impedes investment here, and business growth here, is not good in the long run for anyone here. but at least obama and his ilk would feel better about how they robbed from the rich to give to the poor.

The notion that a five percent hike is going to impede investment is beyond laughable. For the record, Obama's plan on long term capital gains is for between 20-28%. The 20% is exactly where Reagan had them.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

who will pay if not the middle class? don't we pay the lions' share of most taxes as it is? the poor don't. hell, i know a gal who doesn't pay a penny in federal income tax because she's single with a couple kids. but come spring, she gets a huge 'rebate' check from the govt-earned income tax credit. yeah, we pay for that. i just want to know how you can get federal tax dollars returned that you never sent in. wish i knew that trick.

OBAMA has made it pretty clear who is gunna pay more for it(the ones who can most afford to do so.) No, the middle class doesn't pay the lion's share(because they don't make the lion's share of the money.) I don't think you realize just how rich the top level is.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

The top 5 percent of taxpayers pay more than one-half of all individual income taxes, and report roughly one-third of all the income in the country.The top 1 percent of taxpayers pay about one third of all individual income taxes. You don't realize just how rich they are. They have to tax them, because that's where the most money is.

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

I don't know why being homogenous would make the difference you seem to think it does. They've made a stronger middle class through government, and they are doing fine. Maybe what you should be saying is we need to get some of our social problems taken care of(be more responsible parents, and stop breeding criminals.) Probably no economic plan is gunna work when you have men letting women raise kids alone. BTW, if Conservatives had it their way, you wouldn't be Middle Class(as a teacher.) You wouldn't have a good retirement system either. What kind of retirement system do teachers have in these private schools (the schools Conservatives got such a hard on for.) Seems government has enabled you to be middle class. So, don't tell me you can't strengthen the middle class through government. You're a perfect example of it. You'd be struggling to make it with just private school pay.

I would not teach if I had to live a destitute life style instead of just a paltry one. I would have probably fit nicely into my father's law firm and hated every moment of it. I would probably be building strip centers with some friends of mine and hated every moment of it. I would probably have gone to medical school instead of graduate school and hated every moment of it. I would have probably... this country was an open door when I graduated. I was very lucky. I was born white and male with enough money to get into college.

You dont make stronger middle class through government redistribution of wealth. You make a stronger middle class by changing ideas. You make people believe they are not bigger than the whole. That is very difficult to do in a country that is heterogenous and with the history this country has in race relations imo.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Start with Social Security. I'm guessing here, but without that, your mother in law (you so enjoy) may of had to live with you.

lol
social security?? the stuff that i pay into year after year, my money, his money your money, everyone's money. and you get back part of it?? the same social security that is supposed to be belly up when tony turns 65?!?! it doesn't do a thing for me now, certainly doesn't help my quality of life at all! we both have pension and 401k, i'm not holding my breath for the money i'm paying into some pyramid scheme to ever come back to me.
if that's the best you can do, your argument about social programs helping me is hogwash. i pay in, but have never taken out, and frankly don't expect to.
my in laws btw both have pensions, 401k as well, i think they may get the minimum from social security, which probably pales in comparison to what THEY paid in all those years that they worked.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

OBAMA has made it pretty clear who is gunna pay more for it(the ones who can most afford to do so.) No, the middle class doesn't pay the lion's share(because they don't make the lion's share of the money.) I don't think you realize just how rich the top level is.

funny, it's one of the dems big talking points, saving the middle class from all the taxes they pay..the middle class is far and away the biggest class, and the hardest hit. the poor get their payouts, rent assistance, fuel assitance, free day care, free insurance. all that 'free' stuff you and i pay for. hell, by the time i work my 50-60 hours a week, and tony works his time, and we pay for all that crap, and our own bills...we'd probably be better off claiming disability and living on the dole. i wouldn't have to get dressed in the morning.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

The notion that a five percent hike is going to impede investment is beyond laughable. For the record, Obama's plan on long term capital gains is for between 20-28%. The 20% is exactly where Reagan had them.

weren't you bashing reaganomics earlier? it's funny how many ideas obama keeps getting from the very group he's trying to save us from.
great, hit the rich-sounds good. and then more programs that they pay for, so no debt gets paid down, no change in the deficit. more of the same. i read the laundry list of stuff he wants, and you think that cap gains increase alone will pay for it?

[Danzig]

this is from yesterday, i googled 'barack obama bush tax'. this came up first on the list...an excerpt:

Obama has change of heart about Bush tax cuts as polls favor McCain

By Ross Balano, Midwest Voices Columnist 2008

Democrat presidential candidate Barack Obama had a change of heart yesterday about one of his major campaign issues; the Bush Tax Cuts.

The Associated Press quotes Obama as now saying that “he would delay rescinding President Bush's tax cuts on wealthy Americans if he becomes the next president and the economy is in a recession, suggesting such an increase would further hurt the economy.”

Two things struck me about this comment.

First; he uses the term increase. This is the first time I’ve heard him admit that rescinding the Bush cuts would in reality be a tax increase.

Second; he admits that an increase would hurt the economy.

For about as long as he has been running for president, which seems like forever, Obama has been preaching the woes of the Bush Tax Cuts. For those of you in Alma, those are the tax cuts pushed through congress by President Bush that Obama and fellow Democrats claim were “tax breaks for the rich” and are “shrinking the middle class.” Repealing that work of the evil Bush administration was “job one.” So why the change of heart?

[Mortimer]

Dannie...haven't you had wet dreams about me in the day time?


I'd really like to know.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Danzig

weren't you bashing reaganomics earlier? it's funny how many ideas obama keeps getting from the very group he's trying to save us from.
great, hit the rich-sounds good. and then more programs that they pay for, so no debt gets paid down, no change in the deficit. more of the same. i read the laundry list of stuff he wants, and you think that cap gains increase alone will pay for it?

For some reason you have a hard time comprehending Obama's tax policy. I dont know if its out of stubborness or an illogical yearning to stay ignorant on the subject but for some reason you dont want to take the time to research and learn....but yet you still want to attempt to discuss it.

Who said it was cap gains alone? Who said he is "getting ideas from the very group he's trying to save us from"? These statements demonstrate a total lack of knowledge on the subject at hand.

www.factcheck.org

[Danzig]

another excerpt:

What about increasing taxes on the wealthy?

“I think we’ve got to take a look and see where the economy is. I mean, the economy is weak right now,” Obama said on “This Week” on ABC. “The news with Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, I think, along with the unemployment numbers, indicates that we’re fragile.”


so, a five percent increase really won't hurt? or maybe it would? or maybe he doesn't know, but he wants to pander the same way every other pol on both sides of the aisle says what people want to hear? so much for all this change.