SUN: Racing's media makeover paying off

The podunk tracks should be limited to two days a week and the big tracks at 3 days a week.

Quite frankly some of these owners, trainers, and jockeys should find another line of work. It's sickening watching these jug blowers (West Virginia) and farmers (Iowa) make good money with a s.hit product.

The welfare needs to end.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Real interesting betting on 5k claimers that are snapping legs and can't run 6f's in 1:15

Hey some people bet on Womans basketball too

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Borgata is doing 40% less business then they used too. I am there 10 days a month save the weekends the place is becoming a bowling alley.

Freddy stop pulling numbers out of air. Net rev was 175 millon in the first quarter of 2010 compared to 187 million the first quarter of 2009. I think anyone that lives on the east coast could say that the 5% decline was weather related as this was a pretty harsh winter. In april, Borgata had a 2.4% year over year increase.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Freddy stop pulling numbers out of air. Net rev was 175 millon in the first quarter of 2010 compared to 187 million the first quarter of 2009. I think anyone that lives on the east coast could say that the 5% decline was weather related as this was a pretty harsh winter. In april, Borgata had a 2.4% year over year increase.

What was it 5 years ago?

Borgata: 1. Borgata had a terrific qtr. 2. The property continued to lead the Atlantic City market in revenues despite operating with 10% fewer slot machines and a closed player lounge for half of the qtr. as they prepare for the public space expansion that opens around the end of June. 3. The property's EBITDA was $65.3m, an increase of 15% over 1Q05. 1. This was the property's second highest ever behind only last summer's record qtr. 2. The first record best EBITDA occurred in Jan. through March, winter when nobody has posted [big] numbers like that. 4. Borgata's EBITDA margin was nearly 35% in 1Q06 with 54% of the revenue increase from the prior year coming to the EBITDA line.

These days are LONG GONE BRO

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Freddy stop pulling numbers out of air. Net rev was 175 millon in the first quarter of 2010 compared to 187 million the first quarter of 2009. I think anyone that lives on the east coast could say that the 5% decline was weather related as this was a pretty harsh winter. In april, Borgata had a 2.4% year over year increase.

I know nothing but wasnt last years first quarter a worse economic period in general? What are the numbers against two years ago?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Grasping at strws? You are now analyzing my choice of words?

The fact that of the 109 condo units sold so far all have been 100% financed by City center themselves isnt troubling to you? The fact they were planning on $2.7 billion dollars in revenue of condo sales at the height of the market isnt troubling? The fact that when launched the MGM stock prices was $100 a share and it is now at $14 isnt troublesome? That this place was a stretch in the best of times and is assuredly facing something less than that isnt troubling?

You can't get condo financing in Nevada, Arizona, Florida and parts of california with Fannie Mae unless you have at least 20% down as an owner occupant and over 25% as an investor...if the condo is warrantable. Those condos aren't warrantable because of lack of presale and/or investor concentration. FHA is going to be the same problem. Considering those two entities make up over 90% of all loans closed and no bank is going to portfolio a loan for a vegas condo without 50% skin in the game, the fact that the project is doing the financing is to be expected. That will change as the market stabilizes.

Are you really going to compare gaming stock prices in 2003 to 2010 and blame it on city center? Come on Chuck.

They aren't far from profitablity. I can't help that you can't understand that.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I know nothing but wasnt last years first quarter a worse economic period in general? What are the numbers against two years ago?

They are doing OK and only Harrahs next door and th Borgata have any business.. They give rooms away 4 years ago they were 400 a night on a friday in Feb.. Now if you give then 250 bucks of slot play twice a month you get a free room in two seconds.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

You can't get condo financing in Nevada, Arizona, Florida and parts of california with Fannie Mae unless you have at least 20% down as an owner occupant and over 25% as an investor...if the condo is warrantable. Those condos aren't warrantable because of lack of presale and/or investor concentration. FHA is going to be the same problem. Considering those two entities make up over 90% of all loans closed and no bank is going to portfolio a loan for a vegas casino without 50% skin in the game, the fact that the project is doing the financing is to be expected. That will change as the market stabilizes.

Are you really going to compare gaming stock prices in 2003 to 2010 and blame it on city center? Come on Chuck.

They aren't far from profitablity. I can't help that you can't understand that.

Maybe they can do a package deal with free skiing at the Xandu at the Meadowlands.. They shout get Dubai to buy that Turkey also they needs some quality in the portfolio

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by freddymo

They are doing OK and only Harrahs next door and th Borgata have any business.. They give rooms away 4 years ago they were 400 a night on a friday in Feb.. Now if you give then 250 bucks of slot play twice a month you get a free room in two seconds.

No doubt. Every casino has seen a downturn. But they still TURN A PROFIT while most everyone else in the same sector has been hemmoraging money.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

You can't get condo financing in Nevada, Arizona, Florida and parts of california with Fannie Mae unless you have at least 20% down as an owner occupant and over 25% as an investor...if the condo is warrantable. Those condos aren't warrantable because of lack of presale and/or investor concentration. FHA is going to be the same problem. Considering those two entities make up over 90% of all loans closed and no bank is going to portfolio a loan for a vegas casino without 50% skin in the game, the fact that the project is doing the financing is to be expected. That will change as the market stabilizes.

Are you really going to compare gaming stock prices in 2003 to 2010 and blame it on city center? Come on Chuck.

They aren't far from profitablity. I can't help that you can't understand that.

The arent that far from profitability. Ok.

They have already marked the condo prices down 30% and they had as many people walk away and give up their deposits as people who bought places. They have to provide all the financing for the few people that do want to buy. Thier centerpiece hotel opened and is 23% off the rest of the strip in occupancy. They have a $500 million dollar construction expense dispute.

So virtually no one is buying their condos. As many people walked away as bought. The few that did buy cant get financing anywhere else. No one is staying in their hotel. And you claim that they are close to profitability. I suppose that MGM stock should be a strong buy that $14 then? How much MGM stock do you own since you seem to be closing your eyes and wishing that all the bad news clouds would disappear?

I am not saying that City center was the entire reason that the stock tanked but the fact is that companies flush with cash will operate in a different plane than those who are having losing quarters.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by freddymo

What was it 5 years ago?

Borgata: 1. Borgata had a terrific qtr. 2. The property continued to lead the Atlantic City market in revenues despite operating with 10% fewer slot machines and a closed player lounge for half of the qtr. as they prepare for the public space expansion that opens around the end of June. 3. The property's EBITDA was $65.3m, an increase of 15% over 1Q05. 1. This was the property's second highest ever behind only last summer's record qtr. 2. The first record best EBITDA occurred in Jan. through March, winter when nobody has posted [big] numbers like that. 4. Borgata's EBITDA margin was nearly 35% in 1Q06 with 54% of the revenue increase from the prior year coming to the EBITDA line.

These days are LONG GONE BRO

Thats every business in the US with few exceptions. You are comparing a completely different economic climate.

I am not comparing Borgata 2010 to Borgata 2005. I am comparing Borgata to any other casino in AC. Why has it thrived, and by "thrive" I mean continue to turn a healthy profit, while the others have failed?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The arent that far from profitability. Ok.

They have already marked the condo prices down 30% and they had as many people walk away and give up their deposits as people who bought places. They have to provide all the financing for the few people that do want to buy. Thier centerpiece hotel opened and is 23% off the rest of the strip in occupancy. They have a $500 million dollar construction expense dispute.

So virtually no one is buying their condos. As many people walked away as bought. The few that did buy cant get financing anywhere else. No one is staying in their hotel. And you claim that they are close to profitability. I suppose that MGM stock should be a strong but that $14 then? How much MGM stock do you own since you seem to be closing your eyes and wishing that all the bad news clouds would disappear?

Actually, if you changed your google search, you might find that the convention booking is surging for the second half of 2010 and into 2011 and occupancy will be greater than 80%. The reason they were running at lower occupancy was to protect their price point which is going to be higher being geared to convention business.

Aria has actually improved occupancy in each successive month since its open. Remember, the average price per night is $194 vs.97.21 for the rest of the strip. May bookings indicate over 80% occupancy.

I think some of you would argue with a mirror. Sheesh.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Actually, if you changed your google search, you might find that the convention booking is surging for the second half of 2010 and into 2011 and occupancy will be greater than 80%. The reason they were running at lower occupancy was to protect their price point which is going to be higher being geared to convention business.

Aria has actually improved occupancy in each successive month since its open. Remember, the average price per night is $194 vs.97.21 for the rest of the strip. May bookings indicate over 80% occupancy.

Perhaps you should be working for MGM since you seem to be the only person who is so bullish on this project.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Perhaps you should be working for MGM since you seem to be the only person who is so bullish on this project.

Perhaps. But this is straying way off the original topic.

Charlestown does well because the horse racing product is just part of the overall package. Borgata does well because the gambling product is just a part of the total package.

Both places have done a great job marketing to non traditional gaming demographics and thus have outperformed most everyone else in their respective sectors.

Neither Borgata's nor Ctown's rewards programs are any better than their competitors nor are their payouts/takeouts any better. If anything, they are worse.

So whats the difference? Aren't there lessons to be learned?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Perhaps. But this is straying way off the original topic.

Charlestown does well because the horse racing product is just part of the overall package. Borgata does well because the gambling product is just a part of the total package.

Both places have done a great job marketing to non traditional gaming demographics and thus have outperformed most everyone else in their respective sectors.

Neither Borgata's nor Ctown's rewards programs are any better than their competitors nor are their payouts/takeouts any better. If anything, they are worse.

So whats the difference? Aren't there lessons to be learned?

Proof of this?

[philcski]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The arent that far from profitability. Ok.

They have already marked the condo prices down 30% and they had as many people walk away and give up their deposits as people who bought places. They have to provide all the financing for the few people that do want to buy. Thier centerpiece hotel opened and is 23% off the rest of the strip in occupancy. They have a $500 million dollar construction expense dispute.

So virtually no one is buying their condos. As many people walked away as bought. The few that did buy cant get financing anywhere else. No one is staying in their hotel. And you claim that they are close to profitability. I suppose that MGM stock should be a strong buy that $14 then? How much MGM stock do you own since you seem to be closing your eyes and wishing that all the bad news clouds would disappear?

I am not saying that City center was the entire reason that the stock tanked but the fact is that companies flush with cash will operate in a different plane than those who are having losing quarters.

I've never been a proponent of the project, because I think it's far too ambitious in terms of residential plans in the current (new) economy especially given their debt load when the project started- and on top of that siphons off business from their premier product next door, but the fact is they will be profitable at 75% occupancy at their current room rates based on their most recent 10Q and independent research. So- they are in fact close to profitability.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Proof of this?

Proof of their of their sucess or proof that the reasons listed are the cause of their respective success?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by philcski

I've never been a proponent of the project, because I think it's far too ambitious in terms of residential plans in the current (new) economy, and on top of that siphons off business from their premier product next door, but the fact is they will be profitable at 75% occupancy at their current room rates based on their most recent 10Q and independent research. So- they are in fact close to profitability.

The hotel being at 75% capacity makes the entire project profitable? That seems impossible.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Proof of their of their sucess or proof that the reasons listed are the cause of their respective success?

Well proof that their success is because of the reasons that you are claiming.