The Boss has passed.

[gales0678]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You didnt answer the question. What if CBS sold to a different, less bombastic owner? Say they sold to John henry (the red sox owner not the horse)?

Yeah those Yankee/Royal and Yankee/Indian games are must see tv.

when did the small teams have a chance over the yankees , dodgers etc etc in any given era of baseball ??? the orioles and red sox beat up on the yanks in the 60's and early 70's , that was it

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by gales0678

when did the small teams have a chance over the yankees , dodgers etc etc in any given era of baseball ??? the orioles and red sox beat up on the yanks in the 60's and early 70's , that was it

There were no small market teams for much of that period.

[Cannon Shell]

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You are missing the point. If you start from scratch in those markets which team has a better chance at winning? The NFL teams do because if you do your homework, draft good players, work the cap, hire top coaches and get a little lucky with injuries your team can compete for the title regardless of where you are located. In baseball that simply isnt true. In Pittsburgh or Kansas City you can do all of the above and yet not have a chance to be anymore than a one or two year fringe playoff contender. The same franchises in the NFL can be perennial contenders.

The money is easier to share in football because there is very little local broadcasting (preseason only) which is where the inequity exsts. I am not saying that the Yankees should send the Pirates money from those broadcasts. But the current system in which the yankees simply pay a luxury tax isn't much of a detriment becuase of the huge tv and radio revenues they accumulate.

The system that baseball currently has causes too many teams to always be seller which in turn leads to more and more unwatchable games and dead fan bases. Tampa is a great example of what happens. Of course there are alot of factors that effect things there (bad stadium in poor location, prior poor ownership/management) but the fact that the team was unwatchable for many years is being felt in the apthy towards the team which is really good. Add in that they will have a hard time holding onto the young stars that have made them a playoff team and you have a situation that stinks. But how can you blame fans for not wanting to get attached to a player or team? A few years ago Cleveland beat the yankees in the playoffs and what do ya know their best pitcher winds up playing for who? While the Indians are unable to keep the core parts and have to rebuild.

look at the wins
http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/AL/
http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/NL/

I am not missing the point. You are simply changing your point. You said that when George took over in 1973, baseball was the number one sport and he was one of the primary reasons why that is no longer the case. I say TV is the Primary reason why that is the case and blaming George doesnt make a whole lot of sense.

I don't dispute much of what you say in this thread. I simply contend that baseball's TV entertainment product is nowhere close to the NFL's. That has little to do with competitive balance.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Crown@club

Actually each MLB team receives at least $80 million from TV deals and radio rights. This was big news when the Marlins were asked where did their money go when they refused to sign Dan Uggla this season.

MLB teams each get 30 million dollars from the central fund (40 mill -10 mill for pensions,etc). Most MLB will then make an additional 15 million and up on local tv deals (with teams like the Yankees being the exception with their own network).

The other 35 million that you are talking about comes from revenue sharing from teams like the Yankees and goes to the bottom ten teams in the league.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

I am not missing the point. You are simply changing your point. You said that when George took over in 1973, baseball was the number one sport and he was one of the primary reasons why that is no longer the case. I say TV is the Primary reason why that is the case and blaming George doesnt make a whole lot of sense.

I don't dispute much of what you say in this thread. I simply contend that baseball's TV entertainment product is nowhere close to the NFL's. That has little to do with competitive balance.

I didnt change my point. That the competitive balance in baseball has been an issue in its losing popularity and that george played a large part in that.

Again the context in which I answered a particular post from Gales is missing. He wants to act as though baseball would have been in such terrible shape without Georges arrival on the scene. That isnt true and his lasting legacy will be the continuing inequity in payrolls in baseball. TV has nothing to do with what we were discussing which was George's legacy and has little to do with baseball's demise.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

MLB teams each get 30 million dollars from the central fund (40 mill -10 mill for pensions,etc). Most MLB will then make an additional 15 million and up on local tv deals (with teams like the Yankees being the exception with their own network).

The other 35 million that you are talking about comes from revenue sharing from teams like the Yankees and goes to the bottom ten teams in the league.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/10/25/comm...sbiz/index.htm

. Baseball will finish this year with just over $6 billion in revenue, according to Bob DuPuy, Major League Baseball's president and chief operating officer.

To put that into context, that puts baseball right on the heels of the more than $6 billion in revenue reported by the National Football League in 2006.

Yes, baseball has a lot more games from which to generate sales than the NFL, but that has always been the case. Simply put, baseball has done a much better job in the past few years of boosting its revenue beyond traditional sources, i.e. ticket sales and television broadcasting.

Baseball's sales have increased 50 percent from 2004 and have doubled since 2000. The NFL's sales grew at roughly half of baseball's pace during the same time period.

DuPuy told me the level of growth this year surprised even him and Commissioner Bud Selig. He attributed the gains to more competitive balance in the game, which has helped improve attendance for teams in smaller markets such as the National League champion Colorado Rockies and Milwaukee Brewers, which was in the race for a division title up until the final week of the season.
The growth of the online ticket resale market has also spurred more season ticket sales, DuPuy said. It also helped cut down on the number of no-shows, which increase sales at the concession stands. That's one of the reasons that the MLB signed a deal with eBay (Charts, Fortune 500) unit StubHub, which lets people buy and sell tickets, in August.

Online ticket sales is the perfect example of why baseball revenue has grown so dramatically. The sport has been able to take advantage of several sources of revenue that could hardly be imagined as baseball was coming out of the 1994-95 strike.

The MLB.com Web site, satellite radio broadcasts, an out-of-market television game package and much better than expected international growth have all boosted sales..

[Storm Cadet]

I had many opportunities to meet Mr. Steinbrenner through the Olympics and USA Basketball. He was on our team charter heading to Barcelona in 92 for the Summer Olympics and he met each and every athlete on the flight, took pictures and signed autographs. He asked each athlete where they were from, what sport they are participating and how many Games this was for each! He was there to meet and greet the athletes each night after awards ceremonies! He was just as proud as the athletes on their medals! After the Games he also went to the White House for the post Olympic celebration that George Bush threw for us and again was great with all, posing for pictures and signing autographs.

With USA Basketball the Boss hosted us many times in his office and private box at Yankee Stadium prior to our overseas trips. He was always very gracious in his gifts to the staff and players. Thanks Mr. Steinbrenner for making NY, the USOC and The Yankees better! We will miss you in New York.

[horseofcourse]

Just another Cleveland sob story. Of course a native Clevelander, Steinbrenner was sure he had the Indians bought in 1971, but then owner Vernon Stouffer made a last second behind the scenes sale to Nick Miletti. Two years later Steinbrenner bought the Yankees for over a million dollars less than what the Indians were sold for two years earlier. What could have been!!

[slotdirt]

With Cleveland's luck, they would have traded for Mark Fidrych and signed JR Richard to a long-term deal, leaving Steinbrenner and the team in ruins by 1983. Things happen for a reason, I suppose.

[Bigsmc]

Who is in the booth with Keith Jackson and Howard Cosell calling the ALCS game that is on Classic right now?

*Edit* It's Reggie Jackson.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

http://money.cnn.com/2007/10/25/comm...sbiz/index.htm

. Baseball will finish this year with just over $6 billion in revenue, according to Bob DuPuy, Major League Baseball's president and chief operating officer.

To put that into context, that puts baseball right on the heels of the more than $6 billion in revenue reported by the National Football League in 2006.

Yes, baseball has a lot more games from which to generate sales than the NFL, but that has always been the case. Simply put, baseball has done a much better job in the past few years of boosting its revenue beyond traditional sources, i.e. ticket sales and television broadcasting.

Baseball's sales have increased 50 percent from 2004 and have doubled since 2000. The NFL's sales grew at roughly half of baseball's pace during the same time period.

DuPuy told me the level of growth this year surprised even him and Commissioner Bud Selig. He attributed the gains to more competitive balance in the game, which has helped improve attendance for teams in smaller markets such as the National League champion Colorado Rockies and Milwaukee Brewers, which was in the race for a division title up until the final week of the season.
The growth of the online ticket resale market has also spurred more season ticket sales, DuPuy said. It also helped cut down on the number of no-shows, which increase sales at the concession stands. That's one of the reasons that the MLB signed a deal with eBay (Charts, Fortune 500) unit StubHub, which lets people buy and sell tickets, in August.

Online ticket sales is the perfect example of why baseball revenue has grown so dramatically. The sport has been able to take advantage of several sources of revenue that could hardly be imagined as baseball was coming out of the 1994-95 strike.

The MLB.com Web site, satellite radio broadcasts, an out-of-market television game package and much better than expected international growth have all boosted sales..

First of all, this is an editorial and the dollars that are being thrown around for "total rev" are being kicked around by the COO of MLB who might just have a little bit of an agenda...No? LOL. "competitive balance" benefits whom? It wouldnt be the commissioner's team would it?

As far as the NFL's total revenue, do you really think you or anyone else has an accurate guage of what they are really taking in? The fact is, the Player's association is going after the books pretty hard.

If anyone, you included, really thinks that Mlb's total revenue is equal to the NFL's revenue, there is a bridge in arizona to buy and a short bus to ride over it on.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I didnt change my point. That the competitive balance in baseball has been an issue in its losing popularity and that george played a large part in that.

Again the context in which I answered a particular post from Gales is missing. He wants to act as though baseball would have been in such terrible shape without Georges arrival on the scene. That isnt true and his lasting legacy will be the continuing inequity in payrolls in baseball. TV has nothing to do with what we were discussing which was George's legacy and has little to do with baseball's demise.

Just so I understand, are you saying that TV did or didn't help football surpass baseball as the number 1 sport in the US?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

First of all, this is an editorial and the dollars that are being thrown around for "total rev" are being kicked around by the COO of MLB who might just have a little bit of an agenda...No? LOL. "competitive balance" benefits whom? It wouldnt be the commissioner's team would it?

As far as the NFL's total revenue, do you really think you or anyone else has an accurate guage of what they are really taking in? The fact is, the Player's association is going after the books pretty hard.

If anyone, you included, really thinks that Mlb's total revenue is equal to the NFL's revenue, there is a bridge in arizona to buy and a short bus to ride over it on.

So they are just making this stuff up? Why would they do that?

I just thought it was interesting that "competitive balance" was given as a reason for the increase in revenues since you more or less called me an idiot for suggesting that it was important.

But of course they have an agenda and are lying so I am still "wrong".

[Scav]

Someone find what Al Davis said about George. It was just on ESPN2 bottom line and it was CLASSIC!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Just so I understand, are you saying that TV did or didn't help football surpass baseball as the number 1 sport in the US?

Why must you try to draw a line everywhere and make things black or white or put words in my mouth? Your inference that tv was the driving force behind football becoming more popular is such a broad statement that it cant possible be answered any other way than yes. But TV doesnt turn itself on and make you watch it.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Scav

Someone find what Al Davis said about George. It was just on ESPN2 bottom line and it was CLASSIC!

Aren't you busy with THE DECISION?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

So they are just making this stuff up? Why would they do that?

I just thought it was interesting that "competitive balance" was given as a reason for the increase in revenues since you more or less called me an idiot for suggesting that it was important.

But of course they have an agenda and are lying so I am still "wrong".

Its not about being "right" or "wrong". The commissioner and his underlings have an agenda and you know it. Regardless of whether or not that agenda is in the best interest of baseball as a whole is debatable but his position on the subject of "competitive balance" is well documented and his own team is one of the chief beneficiaries of that position. Is anything I say here inaccurate?

Any story that claims that baseball is equal to the NFL in total rev has to be looked at with an extreme amount of skepticism if not dismissed as utter garbage.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Why must you try to draw a line everywhere and make things black or white or put words in my mouth? Your inference that tv was the driving force behind football becoming more popular is such a broad statement that it cant possible be answered any other way than yes. But TV doesnt turn itself on and make you watch it.

It indeed can be answered with a yes or no. Was TV a "driving force" behind football becoming a more popular sport than baseball?

Why dance? Its a simple question regardless of how "broad" it may be.

Its as simple as saying that digital cable/satellite is a driving force in the destruction of the movie rental business.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Its not about being "right" or "wrong". The commissioner and his underlings have an agenda and you know it. Regardless of whether or not that agenda is in the best interest of baseball as a whole is debatable but his position on the subject of "competitive balance" is well documented and his own team is one of the chief beneficiaries of that position. Is anything I say here inaccurate?

Any story that claims that baseball is equal to the NFL in total rev has to be looked at with an extreme amount of skepticism if not dismissed as utter garbage.

LOL

I suppose that yeah this is a conspiracy to prop up the Brewers.

So I post something that supports a statement that I made (and hardly a controversial one since it has been the 2nd biggest topic in baseball for years) but you summarily dismiss it because of some theoretical agenda and supposed campaign of disinformation from MLB executives?

Have you been taking classes on the Riot-style of denial posting?