Occupy Wall Street

[clyde]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You are not my customer, you are nameless, faceless troll. If people wouldnt send me a horse based on posts on an internet board they probably wouldnt be very good clients anyway. Your innocent act is laughable considering you are the one who is always taking shots at my business and me personally which works for you since no one knows who the hell you are or what you do. You dont know anything about me or my business. Grow up and discuss the issues without trying to run me down or interject insults whenever possible.

He lost in a showdown play against SubPrime Selector........he lost!



So that's it.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by jms62

I am not saying that. I am saying that the likes of those uber conservatives crying free market have no problem taking advantage of H1B's and using illegals vs paying a rate that would attract American Citizens. Free Market only when it suits them , eventually someone will take the job and it wouldn't be at the absurd levels quoted above by our resident Economist.

Free market is at work. We find workers who are willing to work for the wages given. Pretty simple. The idea that because an employee is on a worker program or is undocumented they are abused or underpaid is typical liberal bullshit. My grooms make $500-700 per week depending on how many horses they care for. Riders between $700-1000 a week. Hotwalkers who only work 4-5 hours a day make $250 and are paid for any extra's they do. They are provided housing. I pay for their cable. They get vacations. They get bonuses when their horses hit the board. My assistants get rent checks. At most tracks they are provided some form of medical and dental coverage via the HBPA. They are covered against workplace injury by workmans compensation insurance. They can file for unemployment if they are laid off. What Danzig said was right, most Americans wont do this work because its too hard, too early, too hot, too cold, etc. The only Americans tht wind up on the backside are those who wnt to be trainers or those with no other real options.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Free market is at work. We find workers who are willing to work for the wages given. Pretty simple. The idea that because an employee is on a worker program or is undocumented they are abused or underpaid is typical liberal bullshit. My grooms make $500-700 per week depending on how many horses they care for. Riders between $700-1000 a week. Hotwalkers who only work 4-5 hours a day make $250 and are paid for any extra's they do. They are provided housing. I pay for their cable. They get vacations. They get bonuses when their horses hit the board. My assistants get rent checks. At most tracks they are provided some form of medical and dental coverage via the HBPA. They are covered against workplace injury by workmans compensation insurance. They can file for unemployment if they are laid off. What Danzig said was right, most Americans wont do this work because its too hard, too early, too hot, too cold, etc. The only Americans tht wind up on the backside are those who wnt to be trainers or those with no other real options.

You are really generous and everything you say is just great. You can pay them a million bucks however if their options are work for you as their sponsor or go home then it is not a free market and I will argue that point until put me in the ground.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by jms62

You are really generous and everything you say is just great. You can pay them a million bucks however if their options are work for you as their sponsor or go home then it is not a free market and I will argue that point until put me in the ground.

The terms are spelled out prior to them coming. I pay people by the amount of work done and the quality of that work regardless of their status as a H1B worker or not.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The terms are spelled out prior to them coming. I pay people by the amount of work done and the quality of that work regardless of their status as a H1B worker or not.

You are a wonderful human being however my point is made. High Tech industry needs the likes of you.

[clyde]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Free market is at work. We find workers who are willing to work for the wages given. Pretty simple. The idea that because an employee is on a worker program or is undocumented they are abused or underpaid is typical liberal bullshit. My grooms make $500-700 per week depending on how many horses they care for. Riders between $700-1000 a week. Hotwalkers who only work 4-5 hours a day make $250 and are paid for any extra's they do. They are provided housing. I pay for their cable. They get vacations. They get bonuses when their horses hit the board. My assistants get rent checks. At most tracks they are provided some form of medical and dental coverage via the HBPA. They are covered against workplace injury by workmans compensation insurance. They can file for unemployment if they are laid off. What Danzig said was right, most Americans wont do this work because its too hard, too early, too hot, too cold, etc. The only Americans tht wind up on the backside are those who wnt to be trainers or those with no other real options.

Do you claim ownership?


Yes or no.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by clyde

Do you claim ownership?


Yes or no.

You can claim me cheap.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jms62

You are really generous and everything you say is just great. You can pay them a million bucks however if their options are work for you as their sponsor or go home then it is not a free market and I will argue that point until put me in the ground.

all they have to do is have a sponsor. it's not as tho if they don't have one, they can never get another. i'd imagine they have to have a sponsor as a way to keep track of a temporary visitor/employee. i'd think that would be an INS rule, not an employer rule. it's the govt's job to keep track of workers from other countries. and surely different offers are there for people to apply, choose from, etc?

btw, i find the now missing posts that were quoted by others that you wrote to be out of line. there's a difference between talking about a subject, and attacking someone personally. chuck didn't create the H1B program. if you don't like the program, take it up with the people who created it or operate it, that can amend it. i've visited chuck, more than once, at various barns in several states. his operation seems top notch from what i've seen fwiw.

[clyde]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You can claim me cheap.

Oh boy.




You could get Honula for that high end groom rate...bet you could.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Danzig

all they have to do is have a sponsor. it's not as tho if they don't have one, they can never get another. i'd imagine they have to have a sponsor as a way to keep track of a temporary visitor/employee. i'd think that would be an INS rule, not an employer rule. it's the govt's job to keep track of workers from other countries. and surely different offers are there for people to apply, choose from, etc?

btw, i find the now missing posts that were quoted by others that you wrote to be out of line. there's a difference between talking about a subject, and attacking someone personally. chuck didn't create the H1B program. if you don't like the program, take it up with the people who created it or operate it, that can amend it. i've visited chuck, more than once, at various barns in several states. his operation seems top notch from what i've seen fwiw.

Listen the first part of your post shows that you have no idea whatsoever about the process. You are posting to a process as you would like it to be. When you come over on an H1B visa you are tied to the company that sponsors you for 6 years. You cannot go elsewhere, you cannot go home and start the process again . For 6 years its work for the company that sponsers you or go home.

As to part 2, there are no missing posts and if Chuck calls me a know nothing twit I will very well respond in like so if you don't like it GFYS and put me on Ignore. Chuck took a personal shot at me, I took one back in my mind its over. If he were here I'd buy him a beer. The only person I really disliked on these boards is Nascar and he is gone.

Again I never said anything about Chucks operation I was providing links to the industry in general and if you tell me that there isn't H1B abuse in the industry aside from Chucks barn then I will tell you are full of shi*T.

I think for your own peace of mind you need to put me on ignore. You either read something entirely different in my posts, reply to something that you know nothing about yet portray it as if it exists as you think it does, try and put words in my mouth with the "did you mean ****" , and then cite to "missing" posts to come to a conclusion based upon others responses to posts that do exist Are you having a bad day or what?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by clyde

Oh boy.




You could get Honula for that high end groom rate...bet you could.

Honula is out of my league

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You realize that MIT has a wide variety of degree programs other than Engineering right? What does that chart prove? It comes down to this. You are too stupid to understand that MIT grads have a huge head start in their various fields of expertise.

And you are too stupid to understand that's not the discussion

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by jms62

Listen the first part of your post shows that you have no idea whatsoever about the process. You are posting to a process as you would like it to be. When you come over on an H1B visa you are tied to the company that sponsors you for 6 years. You cannot go elsewhere, you cannot go home and start the process again . For 6 years its work for the company that sponsers you or go home.

As to part 2, there are no missing posts and if Chuck calls me a know nothing twit I will very well respond in like so if you don't like it GFYS and put me on Ignore. Chuck took a personal shot at me, I took one back in my mind its over. If he were here I'd buy him a beer. The only person I really disliked on these boards is Nascar and he is gone.

Again I never said anything about Chucks operation I was providing links to the industry in general and if you tell me that there isn't H1B abuse in the industry aside from Chucks barn then I will tell you are full of shi*T.

I think for your own peace of mind you need to put me on ignore. You either read something entirely different in my posts, reply to something that you know nothing about yet portray it as if it exists as you think it does, try and put words in my mouth with the "did you mean ****" , and then cite to "missing" posts to come to a conclusion based upon others responses to posts that do exist Are you having a bad day or what?

Actually you took the first shot with your thinly veiled insinuations and stereotyping. The only reason I bother to post in the political threads is to counter Riot's nonsense.

I think that the terms are 3 years with a possibility to extend to 6. And you can transfer employers on an H1b visa.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

And you are too stupid to understand that's not the discussion

Am I? Where was it stated that soley MIT engineer grads were in play? It is rich that you are telling me what my own discussion is.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Am I? Where was it stated that soley MIT engineer grads were in play? It is rich that you are telling me what my own discussion is.

I can read what you wrote.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Riot

I can read what you wrote.

Reading isnt the issue. Comprehension seems to be lacking. I do understand that your stance is that MIT grads are having a hard time finding work upon graduation though now you seem to be fixated on engineers.

Here is some more supporters of Occupy Wall Street:

http://whitehonor.com/white-power/th...reet-movement/

I guess the white supremecy job market is drying up as well

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Actually you took the first shot with your thinly veiled insinuations and stereotyping. The only reason I bother to post in the political threads is to counter Riot's nonsense.

I think that the terms are 3 years with a possibility to extend to 6. And you can transfer employers on an H1b visa.

My shot was you are pro H1B because you use H1B if you call that a shot.

As far as the transfer although technically feasible the standard practice is for sponser company to put in the contract that employee will not seek transfer for the duration of the contract. Would they win in court, certainly do they have the money or will power to fight that fight, No. I have guys crying all the time about how the company gets 100 bucks an hour and they receive 15 where the standard practice would be 80.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by jms62

My shot was you are pro H1B because you use H1B if you call that a shot.

As far as the transfer although technically feasible the standard practice is for sponser company to put in the contract that employee will not seek transfer for the duration of the contract. Would they win in court, certainly do they have the money or will power to fight that fight, No. I have guys crying all the time about how the company gets 100 bucks an hour and they receive 15 where the standard practice would be 80.

No one in the horse racing business holds people to their contract. Most racing businesses are too small to bother to contest someone leaving. The thing is that so many workers are so eager to get here that they can accept terms that dont seem great once they get here and smarten up. But considering where they come from and how willing they are to take the initial deal presented it is all relative. I think we are required to provide a whole lot more than we used to as well including potential legal fees for the employee which makes me not want to do H1b's anymore.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

No one in the horse racing business holds people to their contract. Most racing businesses are too small to bother to contest someone leaving. The thing is that so many workers are so eager to get here that they can accept terms that dont seem great once they get here and smarten up. But considering where they come from and how willing they are to take the initial deal presented it is all relative. I think we are required to provide a whole lot more than we used to as well including potential legal fees for the employee which makes me not want to do H1b's anymore.

The more we discuss this the more this is an apples and oranges situation. What I am talking about is companies with millions / billions at their disposal with a legal department that needs to show why they are getting paid 6 figs. Fighting that fight seems overwhelming as having to retain a lawyer alone can break them long long before court.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Reading isnt the issue. Comprehension seems to be lacking. I do understand that your stance is that MIT grads are having a hard time finding work upon graduation though now you seem to be fixated on engineers.

Here is some more supporters of Occupy Wall Street:

http://whitehonor.com/white-power/th...reet-movement/

I guess the white supremecy job market is drying up as well

"White supremecy (sic)"? WTF?

Yeah, comprehension seems to be a big issue for you. You can't even follow a thread

Here's my "stance" (before you went off into your fantasy land of anger and insult regarding MIT straw men): If the question is, are there more black birds or brown birds in the world, you'd say "my best guess is brown". But then you'd stick with brown, calling names and insulting and being rude to anyone who dared to have a different opinion. But most importantly, it would never, ever even cross your mind to actually count the number of brown vs black birds.

That was my point. And you just proved it in this thread

And again, I'm glad to see you've declared that MIT grads do not have any trouble finding work in the midst of a record recession! Good to know! If you could only declare the recession over completely, that would be a big help, too.

(See what I did there? That's sarcasm, having nothing really to do with MIT grads)