Arkansas Derby Field

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Buffymommy

Well, I would be pissed because IMO they cheated GH's connections out of some $$$.

And I hope everyone stays off of his bandwagon because I like this colt. Jockey stopped asking after the had to stop him.

Very likely they cheated Fifth Third Bank out of money which would explain why team Reddam didn't fight it.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Merlinsky

Bugger. Missed it. How'd Olympic Chief do? Did he trip anybody?

i saw that they wanted to enter him in the bluegrass stakes, and keeneland refused. so to oaklawn they went.
supposedly have a first time starter nominated for the ky oaks. yippee. a fool and his money...

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Very likely they cheated Fifth Third Bank out of money which would explain why team Reddam didn't fight it.

ownership was settled pre-race. just saw the news. no word on how they settled it, but it is settled.

i'd imagine it just wasn't worth fighting about, and the jock said it wasn't that big of a deal.
maybe they want better odds derby day with him showing an off the board finish in his last prep...

the cut off cost him, i saw him check twice, altho the first check was the one that cost him. no telling what he'd have done with a clear trip--but you can say that about a lot of horses.

if you liked grt hunter before the race, i see no reason to come off him now. a strange race, good luck figuring it out.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Danzig

ownership was settled pre-race. just saw the news. no word on how they settled it, but it is settled.

i'd imagine it just wasn't worth fighting about, and the jock said it wasn't that big of a deal.
maybe they want better odds derby day with him showing an off the board finish in his last prep...

the cut off cost him, i saw him check twice, altho the first check was the one that cost him. no telling what he'd have done with a clear trip--but you can say that about a lot of horses.

if you liked grt hunter before the race, i see no reason to come off him now. a strange race, good luck figuring it out.

I know it was settled pre-race. Just speculating that part of the agreement was that the bank would drop their claim in exchange for the purse money in the Blue Grass. If so it would explain why team Reddam wouldn't care that Teuflesberg wasn't DQd.

[jman5581]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I know it was settled pre-race. Just speculating that part of the agreement was that the bank would drop their claim in exchange for the purse money in the Blue Grass. If so it would explain why team Reddam wouldn't care that Teuflesberg wasn't DQd.

That kind of move is waaaaay too risky for a bank to make.... you're going to have to do better than that Sniper.

[jman5581]

But, then again, it's such a small asset compared to what it might cost them in "reputation" in one of their major markets. The "settlement" might have been to just drop it, although I highly doubt that as well.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by jman5581

That kind of move is waaaaay too risky for a bank to make.... you're going to have to do better than that Sniper.

Totally depends on how strong of a case they thought they had. No clue if it is the case though just thought I'd throw it out as a possibility. Just seemed strange that they didn't try to get Teuflesberg taken down and had to sign a confidentiality agreement to not disclose the terms of the agreement.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I know it was settled pre-race. Just speculating that part of the agreement was that the bank would drop their claim in exchange for the purse money in the Blue Grass. If so it would explain why team Reddam wouldn't care that Teuflesberg wasn't DQd.

oh, good point!

lol man, that would be funny if they agreed to take only what he won that day. ooops again!

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by easy goer

Beyer disciples must be pulling their hair out...

Yes, what exactly does this mean?

[philcski]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Yes, what exactly does this mean?

I'm saying the same thing, but AFTER the race.

How does one fairly evaluate this race from a speed figures perspective when the fraudulent pace dictates a final time that is worthless?
I've taken the same approach to the Blue Grass results for many years, cross it out and re-evaluate the candidates. I guess that's the right answer here too.

[blackthroatedwind]

I'm just trying to figure out, Phil, what that great giver of knowledge meant by its initial comments in this thread. Certainly someone so giving wouldn't want to make a snide comment.....I'm sure there was some brilliance behind that post and I am just too stupid to figure it out.

[philcski]

I've stopped trying to make sense of 90% of the sh!t on here.
Just sifting through for the nuggets of useful information and let the rest rot away peacefully.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by philcski

I've stopped trying to make sense of 90% of the sh!t on here.
Just sifting through for the nuggets of useful information and let the rest rot away peacefully.

Perfect! You've stated exactly what's on my mind recently. I think I put it to someone yesterday that I would just let the crap float on by.

Same sentiment.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by philcski

I've stopped trying to make sense of 90% of the sh!t on here.
Just sifting through for the nuggets of useful information and let the rest rot away peacefully.

I know, we really need a troll filter on here so we can just get to the good stuff without having to spend an hour wading through all the $h!t.

[SentToStud]

I'm wishing it was only 90%.

I read the speed figure threads and it's unbelieveable people spend so much time dissecting them, criticizing them, etc...

In the end, any speed figure is only one subjective measure. Someone else's speed figure is interesting and perhaps somewhat useful but the way people obsess over this stuff is insane.

You're far better off spending your time watching the races and forming your own ideas about who ran well/poor in spite of/because of/irregardless of how the races were run and how YOU think they'll move forward.

Nobody is going to win money unless they work at it and use their own creativity. If all you can come up with for a race that's three weeks away with no drawn field is criticism of a published speed figure, how the hell are you going to play a Wednesday card anywhere?

I think there's different ways to do good at this but the 3 or 4 decent or better horseplayers I know give very nominal consideration to someone else's figs (and only slightly more to their own) and spend most of their time on how races were and will be run and putting tickets together.

My own two cents on the Derby is that it's fruitless to bet to win on anything short and betting a longshot to win is only a stab. I will spend whatever time I invest looking to do two things; 1. Form negative opinions on two or more of the "name" horses to the extent that I can leave them off a tri or super ticket. Right now, NoBiz from an unfavorabe post is perhaps one. 2. I'll spend most of my time following the 'bottom' 2/3 of the field and hopefully come up with two or three that I believe have a better than conventionally thought chance of crashing the ticket at 25-1 to 50-1 (or whatever).

That's just my thoughts on how I'll spend my time on the race. For what it's worth, I won't spend very much time looking at Speed Figs and none on why they are right or wrong.

good luck.

[blackthroatedwind]

Excellent post.....however I cannot allow a man of your literary esteem to get away scott free for using " irregardless ".

[ArlJim78]

Sent To, very good advice for anyone.

I like the approach, throw out some of the marquee horses, and try to elevate some from the bottom third.

good approach for the derby, and lucrative it you make the right call.

anyone would be crazy to bet on a low priced horse in the derby.

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Excellent post.....however I cannot allow a man of your literary esteem to get away scott free for using " irregardless ".

... well, it's not as if I got both ends of Shaun Bridgmohan wrong ...

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by SentToStud

... well, it's not as if I got both ends of Shaun Bridgmohan wrong ...

Excellent!

[VOL JACK]

Andy, I think U kinda like AGS. How much stock do U put into JV obting elsewhere? How much do U think it will help his odds? BTW, didn't he opt for keyed entry last year instead of BGC?