Dutrow's Confidence in Big Brown

[zippyneedsawin]

I Know.. not another Big Brown thread!! But I thought the quotes from Dutrow in the throughbredtimes.com article were rather interesting. I've never heard a trainer speak this confidently about his horse before the derby. ( I know, it's trainer-speak.. but it's usually more optimistic/positive.)
Here are some of this quotes:



"It’s a horse race and I have the best horse in the race. It’s that simple,” Dutrow said. “We’re going to Kentucky to win; anything less than that is not going to be OK with us. There’s such good karma going around the stable now that I don’t see how he can get beat.”

“I’ve never been in this kind of spot before but I don’t feel any pressure, not as long as my horse is going good,” Dutrow said. “I’m having fun. This is what I was born to do.”


“It’s an honor to be a favorite now and he’ll be the favorite on Derby day—I can guarantee that,” Dutrow said. “We’re a betting stable and we’ll make sure he’s the favorite.”


http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/rac...g-workout.aspx

[Travis Stone]

The "I don't see how we can get beat" line is a bit much, however, everything is else is what you need going into a major event. Look at Tiger Woods, you ask him everyday what his agenda is, and it's winning. Granted, he never says he won't win, but part of his success comes from his ability to use his confidence in himself to help reach the top.

This of course begs the question, what is Dutrow's handicap index?

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by zippyneedsawin

I Know.. not another Big Brown thread!! But I thought the quotes from Dutrow in the throughbredtimes.com article were rather interesting. I've never heard a trainer speak this confidently about his horse before the derby. ( I know, it's trainer-speak.. but it's usually more optimistic/positive.)
Here are some of this quotes:



"It’s a horse race and I have the best horse in the race. It’s that simple,” Dutrow said. “We’re going to Kentucky to win; anything less than that is not going to be OK with us. There’s such good karma going around the stable now that I don’t see how he can get beat.”

“I’ve never been in this kind of spot before but I don’t feel any pressure, not as long as my horse is going good,” Dutrow said. “I’m having fun. This is what I was born to do.”


“It’s an honor to be a favorite now and he’ll be the favorite on Derby day—I can guarantee that,” Dutrow said. “We’re a betting stable and we’ll make sure he’s the favorite.”


http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/rac...g-workout.aspx

He knows so much it was bad weather that led to Big Brown even stepping foot on dirt.

[ntheiroff]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

He knows so much it was bad weather that led to Big Brown even stepping foot on dirt.

Craig,

That is exactly what I mentioned to Pickwick several days ago.

[blackthroatedwind]

I actually enjoy Dutrow's bravado. Racing can be a game of unparalled characters.....and Dutrow definitely fits the bill. He makes it more fun in this respect. Let him brag away.......it makes a good story.

Dutrow thinks a LOT of horses he runs can't lose. If you like Big brown, and are betting him, you better hope this is one of the occasional times he is right.

[jms62]

Never heard such confidence and speaking in absolutes from a trainer going into the derby BUT could this be Dutrow securing a big paycheck for BB's connections and himself from UPS as a sponsor by selling Big Brown as a modern day Secretariat ? Sorry I am so jaded but his actions seem a bit curious. Then again Big Brown may get to eat from that special oat bucket, the one with such powers that you are so sure he will win you bet 160 K on him...

[slotdirt]

Did he read the Bobby Frankel script from 2003? Sounds like it to me.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I actually enjoy Dutrow's bravado. Racing can be a game of unparalled characters.....and Dutrow definitely fits the bill. He makes it more fun in this respect. Let him brag away.......it makes a good story.

Dutrow thinks a LOT of horses he runs can't lose. If you like Big brown, and are betting him, you better hope this is one of the occasional times he is right.

I agree.

I went to see First Saturday in May last night and that is what made that movie and this industry as a whole so interesting. Life would be dull if we were all the same.

[slotdirt]

I don't know, Sightseek, I saw the same movie you did last night. Where was the Bravada in that? I thought I saw six pretty humble guys going for the ride of their lives.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I don't know, Sightseek, I saw the same movie you did last night. Where was the Bravada in that? I thought I saw six pretty humble guys going for the ride of their lives.

I meant how different all of the people in the industry are, not that they all have an abundance of bravado.

[slotdirt]

Gotcha.

[parsixfarms]

I could care less about Dutrow's bravado. It's his history in the sport that make it impossible for me to root for Big Brown. Imagine if he became the face of racing for the next 7 weeks.

[Split Rock]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

I could care less about Dutrow's bravado. It's his history in the sport that make it impossible for me to root for Big Brown. Imagine if he became the face of racing for the next 7 weeks.

Couldn't agree more. The guy has zip class.

[freddymo]

I think he and his kind have been the face of racing for a long time. Isn't it about time the world sees them in all their glory? No longer are the Phipps, Whitneys, Mott's and Claiborne's the benchmark. Now it's the cheat juicers, Shieks, and Coolmore.. Like it or not they are all here to stay.

[ELA]

Like it or not, that's kind of what you want in a trainer -- not the person, but the mindset, way of thinking, etc. Perhaps not the public aspect of it, or to that degree, but that mindset is what you want. You don't want a trainer who thinks, trains, etc. defensively. Sure, it cuts both ways, but very often when a trainers starts training defensively, then they start entering defensively. They pick defensive spots, don't tighten the screws so to speak, pick spots not wanting to lose a horse, etc. -- all of that. Yes, it's different with stakes horses, and there's no rule.

Dutrow is a great racetrack character. I didn't know him well before he got rolling, but to some extent, he has always been this way. He's a confident guy, boisterous, and whatever else you want to call it.

I've seen far too many run their business defensively, and from a position of weakness. When that happens, most of the time you are beaten at the draw.

Eric

[johnny pinwheel]

good lord , i hear this sort of thing every year. the horse has 3 races and hes the best thats ever been. sure i'll put my money on that, as the favorite no less. i'd be looking out for the people that are sandbagging. not the one that beat their chests.(somethings wrong with pyro? he sure didn't look it yesterday)

[pick4]

When Dutrow Jr is truly confident about one of his horses chances in a race he backs it up at the window. He "bets out" on the horse.

[pick4]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I think he and his kind have been the face of racing for a long time. Isn't it about time the world sees them in all their glory? No longer are the Phipps, Whitneys, Mott's and Claiborne's the benchmark. Now it's the cheat juicers, Shieks, and Coolmore.. Like it or not they are all here to stay.

You have cheats in all walks of life. Why would horse racing be any different?
You'll never see a horse testify in front of the US House of Representatives Committee on Oversight and Government Reform. The old days of the breeders who breed to race rather than race to breed are over. It's still a good game. If Dutrow Jr. is a cheater he'll get caught eventually once technology on drug detection improves. I know he has been caught for drug violations but I don't recall if they were improvement enhancing drugs or maintenance drugs.

[ELA]

Originally Posted by pick4

You have cheats in all walks of life. Why would horse racing be any different?
You'll never see a horse testify in front of the US House of Representatives Committee on Oversight and Government Reform. The old days of the breeders who breed to race rather than race to breed are over. It's still a good game. If Dutrow Jr. is a cheater he'll get caught eventually once technology on drug detection improves. I know he has been caught for drug violations but I don't recall if they were improvement enhancing drugs or maintenance drugs.

I am not going to open the Pandora's box of "cheaters" and "juice" trainers and that whole thing again -- and I am not making this statement about Dutrow. He's had positive tests, he served days, I think he still has more under appeal, and when the chips fall, they'll fall wherever they fall.

However, I think this is a different, but related, issue. The culprits are the culprits and it is what it is. The industry has always been a step, or many steps, behind the "cheaters" and perhaps it will always be that way. The industry will make progress in it's battle and so will the "cheaters" -- thus, the cat and mouse game will continue.

Be that as it may, what we have seen are the "targets" -- the Dutrow's and the Assmusen's of the industry -- and their stables upgrade and evolve. They are no longer just dealing with exclusively claimers and some allowance horses. They are regulars in the major stakes races around the world and they are showing up in all the big dances. They are starting to get support from major players in the game. That is the evolution of the business.

On the other hand, you have other trainers, who many do not label as "culprits" and "cheaters" -- they too are also evolving. Gary Contessa used to be a meat and potatoes trainer, a real blue collar kind of barn consisting of claimers. Now he's a player in stakes races and is competing on a much higher and broader level -- in stakes, graded stakes, etc. Bruce Levine is another, a top notch trainer who mostly raced NY Breds, claimers, and some stakes here and there. Now he's stepped it up to another level. Guys like this are also getting bigger owners, with more backing and firepower.

As Lee Strassberg (who plays Hyman Roth, the role based upon Meyer Lansky) says to Al Pacino -- "This is the business we chose, this is the business we are in". That's what it is. However, the industry is starting to change that. They are beginning to hold owners accountable, to the extent possible. Delaware went a step to far and had to dial it back a bit. Other states have followed suit or plan to. I believe we will see progress and the game will get better.

Eric

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

He knows so much it was bad weather that led to Big Brown even stepping foot on dirt.

So, your assumption is that he never galloped/worked the horse on the dirt and thus had no idea whether the horse could handle it or not?