If you had a Derby horse...

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by Seattleallstar

Corey Nakatani id be ok with, hes probably the best rider in form now in America. He is schooling everyone all over the East Coast, from New York to Hot Springs.
Mike Smith never ever use in a million years, I just dont like the guy and his riding style. One of those people you just dislike for some no good reason, and hes one of those people for me.

I know he f.ucked about 10 guys in Tampa a couple of months ago with a stellar ride.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

I know he f.ucked about 10 guys in Tampa a couple of months ago with a stellar ride.

To be fair Matt, the entire bolded portion is not completely delusional, the East Coast, New York and Hot Springs are actual real locations.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

I might see if Bejarano is willing to jump ship from Secret Circle.

Might be stinging just a bit about not riding Bodemeister.

bejarano chose to stay with secret circle for the ark. derby, i'm pretty sure he knew that meant he wouldn't have bodemeister as well. the decision had to be made sooner or later. why would he ditch that horse, and bob, for another?

Originally Posted by Danzig

bejarano chose to stay with secret circle for the ark. derby, i'm pretty sure he knew that meant he wouldn't have bodemeister as well. the decision had to be made sooner or later. why would he ditch that horse, and bob, for another?

I'm not saying he would. The thread was who do you think might be available that's really good this late in the game.

You're stating some things as fact that I can only speculate on. If in fact Bejarano chose Secret Circle over Bode, which could very well be true, then only he and his agent are kicking themseleves now.

As for ditching Bob. For this one race THE KENTUCKY DERBY, loyalties go completely out the window. Jocks and agents try to WIN THE RACE at all cost with little regard to hurt feelings after the fact. Javier Castellano might be able to speak to that.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

I'm not saying he would. The thread was who do you think might be available that's really good this late in the game.

You're stating some things as fact that I can only speculate on. If in fact Bejarano chose Secret Circle over Bode, which could very well be true, then only he and his agent are kicking themseleves now.

As for ditching Bob. For this one race THE KENTUCKY DERBY, loyalties go completely out the window. Jocks and agents try to WIN THE RACE at all cost with little regard to hurt feelings after the fact. Javier Castellano might be able to speak to that.

So you're saying that jockeys and agents ignore the big picture in an effort to find the best possible mount? That's perfectly reasonable. But if that's so, then didn't Castellano kind of do the opposite of that?

[justindew]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

So you're saying that jockeys and agents ignore the big picture in an effort to find the best possible mount? That's perfectly reasonable. But if that's so, then didn't Castellano kind of do the opposite of that?

I don't think so, necessarily. He may have thought Algorithms was better than Union Rags.

[phystech]

I'd sell the horse and count my money.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

So you're saying that jockeys and agents ignore the big picture in an effort to find the best possible mount? That's perfectly reasonable. But if that's so, then didn't Castellano kind of do the opposite of that?

I don't know if the majority of them do this but I was listening to Gary Stevens not too long ago and he basically said what Vic said.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I don't know if the majority of them do this but I was listening to Gary Stevens not too long ago and he basically said what Vic said.

I didn't question what Vic said as being accurate, I questioned his comparison to Javier Castellano's situation. I'm of the opinion that opting off of Union Rags had everything to do with Todd Pletcher. I could easily be wrong, but I don't think Javier wanted to lose the ground that he has gained in that barn.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I didn't question what Vic said as being accurate, I questioned his comparison to Javier Castellano's situation. I'm of the opinion that opting off of Union Rags had everything to do with Todd Pletcher. I could easily be wrong, but I don't think Javier wanted to lose the ground that he has gained in that barn.

Gotcha.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by phystech

I'd sell the horse and count my money.

No doubt.

[justindew]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I didn't question what Vic said as being accurate, I questioned his comparison to Javier Castellano's situation. I'm of the opinion that opting off of Union Rags had everything to do with Todd Pletcher. I could easily be wrong, but I don't think Javier wanted to lose the ground that he has gained in that barn.

I'd say you're probably correct, with the possible caveat being that he may have felt it was a gamble worth taking given Algorithm's potential and the likelihood that Gemologist was his for the taking also. Of course, both of those horses are Pletcher's. So maybe I'm arguing both sides here.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by justindew

I'd say you're probably correct, with the possible caveat being that he may have felt it was a gamble worth taking given Algorithm's potential and the likelihood that Gemologist was his for the taking also. Of course, both of those horses are Pletcher's. So maybe I'm arguing both sides here.

Right, it was more of the Pletcher brigade than one particular horse. He could have been relatively high on El Padrino at the time he made the decision to go against Union Rags. He also knew that Algorithms was very good at the time and Gemologist was yet to make his 3YO debut. Clearly, Castellano has worked his way into Pletcher's barn and it's paying off in a big way. I think you do your best to maintain the loyalty rather than step outside the box. Isn't this what prompted Gomez to choose Pioneerof the Nile over Dunkirk 3 yrs ago?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

I'm not saying he would. The thread was who do you think might be available that's really good this late in the game.

You're stating some things as fact that I can only speculate on. If in fact Bejarano chose Secret Circle over Bode, which could very well be true, then only he and his agent are kicking themseleves now.

As for ditching Bob. For this one race THE KENTUCKY DERBY, loyalties go completely out the window. Jocks and agents try to WIN THE RACE at all cost with little regard to hurt feelings after the fact. Javier Castellano might be able to speak to that.

since they named mike when they did, and it said in the article i read that bejerano would stay on SC, i'm figuring he had the choice...and that smith would get whichever he didn't go with. that said, i don't think bejerano would move to a different trainers horses, considering that SC has as decent a shot as some of the others. i don't see a legit contender to leave bob and the horse for...but it is all just for fun anyway to guess in this thread.

and sure, jocks want to win the race-but i doubt an up and comer would leap off a potential gravy train of a big stable with a derby mount to go to another horse-such as union rags vs riding a horse (and maybe a lot more in future) for pletcher.

[justindew]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Right, it was more of the Pletcher brigade than one particular horse. He could have been relatively high on El Padrino at the time he made the decision to go against Union Rags. He also knew that Algorithms was very good at the time and Gemologist was yet to make his 3YO debut. Clearly, Castellano has worked his way into Pletcher's barn and it's paying off in a big way. I think you do your best to maintain the loyalty rather than step outside the box. Isn't this what prompted Gomez to choose Pioneerof the Nile over Dunkirk 3 yrs ago?

I'm not sure what he's said off-the-record, but I thought he tried to pick the best horse for the Derby and went with POTN.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

So you're saying that jockeys and agents ignore the big picture in an effort to find the best possible mount? That's perfectly reasonable. But if that's so, then didn't Castellano kind of do the opposite of that?

That's irrelevant. JV can ride for anyone. He's basicley first call for Shug and he will ride a lot for Pletcher still.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Right, it was more of the Pletcher brigade than one particular horse. He could have been relatively high on El Padrino at the time he made the decision to go against Union Rags. He also knew that Algorithms was very good at the time and Gemologist was yet to make his 3YO debut. Clearly, Castellano has worked his way into Pletcher's barn and it's paying off in a big way. I think you do your best to maintain the loyalty rather than step outside the box. Isn't this what prompted Gomez to choose Pioneerof the Nile over Dunkirk 3 yrs ago?

Pioneer was better. He proved it Derby day.

[justindew]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Pioneer was better. He proved it Derby day.

Yes he did. Yes he did. Damn you Mine That Bird.