Bless You George Washington...

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by merasmag

if the rule had been in place trainers woulda planned for it

How would trainers have planned for it?

You mean they would have actually tried winning Grade 1 races?

This might be your best post yet!

[anamulla]

Even last year I thought it was a wrong move from his connections to enter GW in the classic. This year the decision to bring him back to compete with this strong field was even worst because in addition to all this, the horse never ran in the slop in the pass, so I couldn't understand what the connections were thinking. To me clearly they never considered what was the best for the horse, they just used him as a betting tool.
Note: Bobby Frankel was not present yesterday at MTH, because he didn't feel in good spirit because his dog is very sick with cancer. He prefered stay in So. California with his dog in the hospital. That's love to an animal.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by anamulla

Even last year I thought it was a wrong move from his connections to enter GW in the classic. This year the decision to bring him back to compete with this strong field was even worst because in addition to all this, the horse never ran in the slop in the pass, so I couldn't understand what the connections were thinking. To me clearly they never considered what was the best for the horse, they just used him as a betting tool.
Note: Bobby Frankel was not present yesterday at MTH, because he didn't feel in good spirit because his dog is very sick with cancer. He prefered stay in So. California with his dog in the hospital. That's love to an animal.

Or a good excuse not to go...

He still gets paid.

[Scurlogue Champ]

Originally Posted by anamulla

Even last year I thought it was a wrong move from his connections to enter GW in the classic. This year the decision to bring him back to compete with this strong field was even worst because in addition to all this, the horse never ran in the slop in the pass, so I couldn't understand what the connections were thinking. To me clearly they never considered what was the best for the horse, they just used him as a betting tool.
Note: Bobby Frankel was not present yesterday at MTH, because he didn't feel in good spirit because his dog is very sick with cancer. He prefered stay in So. California with his dog in the hospital. That's love to an animal.

They didn't use this horse as a "betting tool" in any sense of the word. I reckon the folks around Ballydoyle along with many in England and Ireland thought about as much of George Washington as all of the sap-heads over here thought of Barbaro.

They loved this horse dearly, and your analysis is way off. Without a doubt they thought he could win this race and be declared a champion. Aidan O'Brien isn't an idiot.

Maybe Barbaro broke down as well because he was a "true turf horse..."

Pure rubbish, all of this ****.

Racehorses break down, and the Ballydoyle team loved him just as much as anyone else loves any horse.

[stonegossard]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

This thread is ridiculous and is further evidence that this board is on the decline. While GW was a gallant horse, to try and act as if the outcome would have been any different on any surface is a joke. When approached with real facts, like DrugS has given, people really shut up. Get a grip guys.

I see Super Boardman swooped down and scolded you. Too funny.

I agree...the surface had nothing to do with his demise....the connections gave up on him and kept throwing him to the wolves...very often....that was the problem.

These whiney "oh the poor horsie" threads are a bit much....they should keep them all in one area so we dont have to read em.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Scurlogue Champ

They didn't use this horse as a "betting tool" in any sense of the word. I reckon the folks around Ballydoyle along with many in England and Ireland thought about as much of George Washington as all of the sap-heads over here thought of Barbaro.

They loved this horse dearly, and your analysis is way off. Without a doubt they thought he could win this race and be declared a champion. Aidan O'Brien isn't an idiot.

Maybe Barbaro broke down as well because he was a "true turf horse..."

Pure rubbish, all of this ****.

Racehorses break down, and the Ballydoyle team loved him just as much as anyone else loves any horse.

Champion of what?

I'd guess that it wasn't Aidans choice to run

[Bravado2112]

Ya know, it's not like George Washington was beaten 50 lengths or eased when he ran in the Classic last year. As a 3yo trying dirt for the first time and having never run more than a mile before, he made a nice middle move before flattening out and finished 6th beaten 7 lenghts - running a 106 Beyer. He beat more than half the field and finished 3 1/2 lengths behind Premium Tap who would have been an elite handicap horse this year if he remained in the US. That 106 Beyer he ran last year was right in the same ballpark as what Street Sense and Tiago had run this summer/fall - and he easily could have improved on that with the experience and maturity.

I'm not saying I liked him to win, but running him back as a 4 year old with some maturity, dirt experience, and a couple of 10 furlong races under his belt certainly wasn't the most outlandish entry you'll ever see.

What happened was horrible but it's not like the owners were running Rick's Natural Star or some 10 claimer who didn't belong in the race to begin with.

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by Bravado2112

Ya know, it's not like George Washington was beaten 50 lengths or eased when he ran in the Classic last year. As a 3yo trying dirt for the first time and having never run more than a mile before, he made a nice middle move before flattening out and finished 6th beaten 7 lenghts - running a 106 Beyer. He beat more than half the field and finished 3 1/2 lengths behind Premium Tap who would have been an elite handicap horse this year if he remained in the US. That 106 Beyer he ran last year was right in the same ballpark as what Street Sense and Tiago had run this summer/fall - and he easily could have improved on that with the experience and maturity.
I'm not saying I liked him to win, but running him back as a 4 year old with some maturity, dirt experience, and a couple of 10 furlong races under his belt certainly wasn't the most outlandish entry you'll ever see.

What happened was horrible but it's not like the owners were running Rick's Natural Star or some 10 claimer who didn't belong in the race to begin with.

He was getting worse on turf. . .

[Scurlogue Champ]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Champion of what?

I'd guess that it wasn't Aidans choice to run

A two time European champion turf miler who wins the Breeders Cup Classic on dirt would be considered a bit of a champion in my book.

And I'd guess you were wrong, I think he wanted to run the horse.

[NoChanceToDance]

I'm not convinced that Aidan wanted to run him here, either. He was quoted a few weeks before saying that George would go for the Champion Stakes (at Newmarket the weekend before), which looked like a Gr1 he could win, and judging by the result, a Gr1 he would have won.

It was only at the last moment that he was not declared in that race and then a press release said that GW was going for the Classic.

Aidan isn't the sort of person to change his mind. He has a plan for all of his horses and tries to work to that plan as close as possible. I would be very surprised if it was his decision to run him at Monmouth, especially in the Classic. He is employed by the Coolmore bosses, i quite think they made the decision, not Aidan..... and there is a chance that it was against Aidan's choice.

I quite think that was the same with Dylan Thomas. There was never ANY talk of running in the BC Turf after they said he's run in the Arc. I remember having this conversation with someone a month or two ago. I said if they ran in the Arc, they wouldn't go to the BC, not when there is only 20 days inbetween. Even right before the Arc they said America wasn't really on the agenda. They said if he won the Arc (we all know he did) that would be the end for him. If he didn't win, they would "consider" the BC for him. So, naturally, after he won i just thought he had been retired. Yet about three days later they had confirmed him for the BC Turf. The decision seemed to come right out of the blue.

My guess would be that John Magnier wanted as many runners as possible for the BC this year.

Judging from news reports after George's tragic injury, there were no words between O'Brien and Magnier. Aidan (along with family) left Monmouth very quickly after the incident.

[johnny pinwheel]

it comes down to running sound horses. any horse that doesn't start for months or retires and comes back. should be questioned. the greed factor is a problem. they made discreet cat 7/5, he has not won since 8/2006. do you think hes the same horse? well they ran him. then the ones that are good and healthy ,well most of them will be retired. street sense,hard spun,curlin will say bye ,bye. gw was impotent so back to racing he went. these rich folks used to race for pride. not the bottom line. who pays the price ?horses like GW and the fans thats who!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Scurlogue Champ

A two time European champion turf miler who wins the Breeders Cup Classic on dirt would be considered a bit of a champion in my book.

And I'd guess you were wrong, I think he wanted to run the horse.

How do you know I'm guessing...

I cant wait to see the ads in the Bloodhorse

HORSE GOES TO STUD>>>CHAMPION IN SCURLOGUES BOOK

[parsixfarms]

George earned his retirement. Having made the decision last year that his racing career was over, the Coolmore group should be ashamed of themselves for bringing him back to the races, solely because they concluded that he could not be the "profit center" for them that they envisioned. Of course, shame is in short supply with this outfit; after all, they are the prime American backers of Patrick Biancone - and why do I suspect that on November 1, 2008, he'll be training for them again.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Cardus

Comments from leading Irish trainer Jim Bolger about George Washington, the Breeders' Cup, drugs, and American racing:

http://news.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=41736

Naturally they blame everything except the EUROPEAN connections for the breakdown. The fact that an overmatched, former champion whose form had deteoriated and who was being ridden and whipped down the backstretch of the race to keep up is ignored.

This is supposedly one of those non drug, sound european horses that brokedown, not our drug infested, weak American horses.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by merasmag

they usually do veer off but b4 my "board break" i noticed the overzealous moderators consolidating and moving posts right and left...maybe they got tired of it but, even tho this horse was not one i followed religiously, i still hope this thread doesn't denigrate into an idiotic discussion of the idiotic comments in the article

First of all, the 'idiotic comments' aren't emanating from the article...

Jim Bolger has every right to make those comments and they're being echoed by many other important European conditioners and media members. And they're absolutely timely, germane and important fodder for discussion here.

[fpsoxfan]

The article simply reflects how many people deal with many things these days. Point the finger towards someone or something. It was a tragedy. It's part of the sport we love. I wish it would never happen, but it does.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by johnny pinwheel

it comes down to running sound horses. any horse that doesn't start for months or retires and comes back. should be questioned. the greed factor is a problem. they made discreet cat 7/5, he has not won since 8/2006. do you think hes the same horse? well they ran him. then the ones that are good and healthy ,well most of them will be retired. street sense,hard spun,curlin will say bye ,bye. gw was impotent so back to racing he went. these rich folks used to race for pride. not the bottom line. who pays the price ?horses like GW and the fans thats who!

i bet a year ago when they retired gw, you screamed greed. you probably wanted him to run at four, i know i did. so now greed brought him back?
you know, citation missed his entire four year old season. came back like gangbusters at five. that's just one example.
there are other horses who have run well past the age of four, or have been retired and then brought back to racing for one reason or another.

had gw not been sub-fertile, he'd not have come back. but we're talking about a four year old in his prime, not a much older horse. he missed a few months, probably not much more of a layoff then what flower alley had between his bc and his first race the next season. he was multiple group one placed this year, not exactly scraping the bottom of the barrel.
should he have run the race, in hindsight we'd all say no. but there were no indications leading up to the race that he shouldn't go. no one would have done as they had, had they known then what we all know now. but no one had that benefit.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Kasept

First of all, the 'idiotic comments' aren't emanating from the article...

Jim Bolger has every right to make those comments and they're being echoed by many other important European conditioners and media members. And they're absolutely timely, germane and important fodder for discussion here.

We also have the right to tell him that if the Euros suddenly dont like our money then they dont have to come. If our racing is so bad then stay home. They certainly have no problem sending their bleeders over here. If they dont like the track conditions than they should stay home or scratch.

[Danzig]

i suppose bolger thinks poly would have made all the difference for george, and the 'turf tracks without the drugs' comment must be his reasoning for the euros going 0- this year.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i suppose bolger thinks poly would have made all the difference for george, and the 'turf tracks without the drugs' comment must be his reasoning for the euros going 0- this year.

typical bs and I hate to tell him that Churchill and Belmont which are the 2 likely choices for the next BC's are still dirt.