Beyer still not sold on Big Brown

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I hope Curlin opts for the Japan Cup Dirt - Big Brown runs in the Arc - and the Breeders Cup Classic features three bad longshot turf marathoners who take to the synthetic track - and make up a giant trifecta.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I hope Curlin opts for the Japan Cup Dirt - Big Brown runs in the Arc - and the Breeders Cup Classic features three bad longshot turf marathoners who take to the synthetic track - and make up a giant trifecta.

Malibu Moonshine over Successful Appeal and Zenyatta

[onebadbeast]

Everyone Hates A Winner. Deal With It, Triple Crown Is Going Down, We Have All Waited 30 Years F0r This! Writers Have Nothin Better To Do Than Pick, Pick, Pick, Like A Bunch Of Bitches Yappin On Their Cells All Day. I Know, I Was Married To One Of Those Cacklers. So Lets Get It On! Casino Sushi Vs. Have A Brown Day. Go Brown And End The Long Nightmare.

[Zippy Chippy]

Fortunately for Big Brown, he doesn't have to be a super horse to win the Triple Crown-- he just has to be better than the best horses of his generation. He is proving that he is just that. I don't think you can really fault Big Brown for having been foaled in a year when the crop was weaker than usual . . .

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by onebadbeast

Everyone Hates A Winner. Deal With It, Triple Crown Is Going Down, We Have All Waited 30 Years F0r This! Writers Have Nothin Better To Do Than Pick, Pick, Pick, Like A Bunch Of Bitches Yappin On Their Cells All Day. I Know, I Was Married To One Of Those Cacklers. So Lets Get It On! Casino Sushi Vs. Have A Brown Day. Go Brown And End The Long Nightmare.

Nobody really complained when it was Smarty Jones going for the Crown, or Silver Charm.

People have not been screaming for a Triple Crown winner for the sake of having a Triple Crown winner. It's a call for a super horse, who in turn, because of ability, can win the Triple Crown.

[onebadbeast]

I Know We Dont Have Big Red Here, But It Would Be Nice Anyway.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by Zippy Chippy

I don't think you can really fault Big Brown for having been foaled in a year when the crop was weaker than usual . . .

All this REGURGITATING is getting old. IF in fact the crop is weaker than usual THEN why weren't ALL THE EXPERTS ALL OVER BIG BROWN BEFORE THE DERBY?
Wouldn't you take $6.80 on a mortal lock? And he was a mortal lock IF the rest of the crop is crap. Right?

Wonder why, rather than spending time disseminating all this BS about the crop and BB's limitations (initially), some of these DOOFUSES weren't mortgaging their houses to get $6.80 (or that sweet $37.00 double with Proud Spell).

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

All this REGURGITATING is getting old. IF in fact the crop is weaker than usual THEN why weren't ALL THE EXPERTS ALL OVER BIG BROWN BEFORE THE DERBY?
Wouldn't you take $6.80 on a mortal lock? And he was a mortal lock IF the rest of the crop is crap. Right?

Wonder why, rather than spending time disseminating all this BS about the crop and BB's limitations (initially), some of these DOOFUSES weren't mortgaging their houses to get $6.80 (or that sweet $37.00 double out Proud Spell).

I'm sure you know this, but the best horse doesn't always win the Derby. I didn't think he was a mortal lock coming out of the 20 hole with only 3 starts under his belt. Sorry ...

I didn't cash a ticket on the Derby, so I feel like a real dumbass, but the above two reasons were reason enough to make me stay away.

[the_fat_man]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[cmorioles]

If Curlin faces Big Brown on tupperware, it won't prove anything other than which horse is faster on a fake surface that is nothing like dirt. Hopefully they meet before that on dirt.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

All this REGURGITATING is getting old. IF in fact the crop is weaker than usual THEN why weren't ALL THE EXPERTS ALL OVER BIG BROWN BEFORE THE DERBY?
Wouldn't you take $6.80 on a mortal lock? And he was a mortal lock IF the rest of the crop is crap. Right?

Wonder why, rather than spending time disseminating all this BS about the crop and BB's limitations (initially), some of these DOOFUSES weren't mortgaging their houses to get $6.80 (or that sweet $37.00 double out Proud Spell).

I find many expert handicappers to subscribe to the following. Until a horse runs a very fast race they simply do not consider a horse to be any faster then the horses tried speed. More likely then not they are right but it seems that they never break discipline. A horse is only as fast as they have run. I think there are exceptions which include Smarty Jones and Big Brown recently. Both are never going to be consider more then nice colt because never ever had that scary fast race. Whatever works for you I guess?

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I find many expert handicappers to subscribe to the following. Until a horse runs a very fast race they simply do not consider a horse to be any faster then the horses tried speed. More likely then not they are right but it seems that they never break discipline. A horse is only as fast as they have run. I think there are exceptions which include Smarty Jones and Big Brown recently. Both are never going to be consider more then nice colt because never ever had that scary fast race. Whatever works for you I guess?

That is because most horses don't run faster. Sure, a few will burn you, but at 2 to 1, and many times less, who really cares? You'll do better in the long run assuming they aren't faster than the numbers they have run.

By the way, Smarty ran fast.

[zippyneedsawin]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

All this REGURGITATING is getting old. IF in fact the crop is weaker than usual THEN why weren't ALL THE EXPERTS ALL OVER BIG BROWN BEFORE THE DERBY?
Wouldn't you take $6.80 on a mortal lock? And he was a mortal lock IF the rest of the crop is crap. Right?

Wonder why, rather than spending time disseminating all this BS about the crop and BB's limitations (initially), some of these DOOFUSES weren't mortgaging their houses to get $6.80 (or that sweet $37.00 double out Proud Spell).

who are the experts anyway??

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

That is because most horses don't run faster. Sure, a few will burn you, but at 2 to 1, and many times less, who really cares? You'll do better in the long run assuming they aren't faster than the numbers they have run.

By the way, Smarty ran fast.

I agree..They fool you thinking that they are faster then they are. It's hard to say how good Big Brown is but he really has an amazing start..

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by zippyneedsawin

who are the experts anyway??

and why would any expert that was skeptical of Big brown before the Derby, not have modified his opinion by now?? its like if you weren't raving and drooling about this horse before the derby, you supposedly don't know anything.

[freddymo]

That's an easy one..Because Big Brown hasn't run a Big BSF as far as I can summize Beyer feels he is only as good as his best BSF which is just ok for a G1 3 year colt

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Agree, but I could never hate a horse because of his connections. Big Brown didn't choose any of this. I bet against him in the Florida Derby and Kentucky Derby, but won't be doing so in the future ... I think he's just a really good horse and he towers above the others in this crop. It would be a good thing for racing if he won the triple crown ... Lord knows we need that.

completely disagree with the first, agree with the second, disagree with the third, and we really just need the various factions in racing to work together on signal, handle, etc.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

Nobody really complained when it was Smarty Jones going for the Crown, or Silver Charm.

People have not been screaming for a Triple Crown winner for the sake of having a Triple Crown winner. It's a call for a super horse, who in turn, because of ability, can win the Triple Crown.

i agree with that completely. we want to see something awesome-not the best of a bad bunch.

as for casino drive, if you agree with beyer that big brown is still untested, i don't know how you can then jump to casino drive, who is even more of a question mark.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by freddymo

That's an easy one..Because Big Brown hasn't run a Big BSF as far as I can summize Beyer feels he is only as good as his best BSF which is just ok for a G1 3 year colt

This is similar to when the Catholic Church forced Clavius and the rest of the Jesuit intelligencia to speak out against Galileo's discoveries (and the Copernican view of nature) in an all out effort to preserve the Aristotelian natural view.

We know how well that went.


Beyer knows better; I'm sure.

[Round Pen]

Originally Posted by freddymo

That's an easy one..Because Big Brown hasn't run a Big BSF as far as I can summize Beyer feels he is only as good as his best BSF which is just ok for a G1 3 year colt

Freedy not to start an arguement but expert handicapper's do not use BSF to be honest most of the time they are useless to them. Go check out what BB ran on the sheets on thorograph he Ran a -4 1/2 which is the best number in the history since Thorograph started doing the derby OK if you don't Like Jerry Brown (I do) and Thorograph.

Go check out the Rag SHeets he ran a -1 which is the best number in the history of Ragozin's since they started doing the Derby. SO to say BB is not fast is totally not true IMO

ROund Pen