AP Source: Obama to seek changes in Pell Grants

[Nascar1966]

Way to look out for this nation's future Mr President.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110213/...ma_pell_grants

I am sure all you supporters of our awesome President will say this is good for the future of this nation.

[Danzig]

lol
'we need to cut spending'. then a suggestion is made by the evil obama, and it's an awful move.

The first proposal would end the "year-round Pell" policy that let students collect two grants in a calendar year, with the second grant used for summer school. The official said the costs exceeded expectations and there was little evidence that students earn their degrees any faster.

The change would save $8 billion next year and $60 billion over a decade, the official said.

A second proposal would reduce loan subsidies for graduate and professional students. That would free $2 billion next year and save $29 billion over 10 years, according to the official.

The government currently pays the interest on student loans for some graduate and professional students as long as they stay in college. But the official said experts think the subsidy has failed to encourage more students to attend graduate school and it isn't well-matched to borrowers who have trouble repaying the loans.



i agree with their suggested changes.

What's the use in an education when there are no jobs?

Good for President Slapd.ick.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Danzig

lol
'we need to cut spending'. then a suggestion is made by the evil obama, and it's an awful move.

The first proposal would end the "year-round Pell" policy that let students collect two grants in a calendar year, with the second grant used for summer school. The official said the costs exceeded expectations and there was little evidence that students earn their degrees any faster.

The change would save $8 billion next year and $60 billion over a decade, the official said.

A second proposal would reduce loan subsidies for graduate and professional students. That would free $2 billion next year and save $29 billion over 10 years, according to the official.

The government currently pays the interest on student loans for some graduate and professional students as long as they stay in college. But the official said experts think the subsidy has failed to encourage more students to attend graduate school and it isn't well-matched to borrowers who have trouble repaying the loans.



i agree with their suggested changes.

This is education we are talking about here. You dont think there are other programs that can be cut or eliminated? Yes I am in agreement with you that cuts do need to be made to reduce the deficit.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

This is education we are talking about here. You dont think there are other programs that can be cut or eliminated? Yes I am in agreement with you that cuts do need to be made to reduce the deficit.

well, you can latch onto 'aahhh, it's education' or you can read and understand the article, and the fact that it only addresses pell grants, which is only one way to fund higher education. and yes, there are other budgetary items that can and should be cut. this is a good plan on his part. sorry you can't see that. it's a start, and one of many needed steps.


now, since you agree there must be cuts, surely you understand they might not all be palatable?


did you notice the highlighted areas? paying out all year didn't produce faster graduation rates, and wasn't worth the cost. it makes sense to cut this.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Danzig

well, you can latch onto 'aahhh, it's education' or you can read and understand the article, and the fact that it only addresses pell grants, which is only one way to fund higher education. and yes, there are other budgetary items that can and should be cut. this is a good plan on his part. sorry you can't see that. it's a start, and one of many needed steps.


now, since you agree there must be cuts, surely you understand they might not all be palatable?

I agree with you. What is your view on Iraq and Afghanistan? Should we send the troops home or not. Imagine the money that would be saved if this country got out of there. Im still waiting for WMD'S to be found in Iraq. Correct me if im wrong but wasn't that one of the main reason's why Bush attacked Iraq.

Americans have a sense of entitlement. Being a plumber is beneath most of them. They won't bother with a trade school.

The 18-25 year old Americans are the biggest sissies in American history. Most of them never truly suffered defeat or faced adversity in school/athletics because the liberal pantywaists wouldn't allow them to fail.

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

I agree with you. What is your view on Iraq and Afghanistan? Should we send the troops home or not. Imagine the money that would be saved if this country got out of there. Im still waiting for WMD'S to be found in Iraq. Correct me if im wrong but wasn't that one of the main reason's why Bush attacked Iraq.

We should bring all of the troops home and cut foreign aid completely. It is not our responsibility to save other countries from ruin.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

I agree with you. What is your view on Iraq and Afghanistan? Should we send the troops home or not. Imagine the money that would be saved if this country got out of there. Im still waiting for WMD'S to be found in Iraq. Correct me if im wrong but wasn't that one of the main reason's why Bush attacked Iraq.

we should never have gone into iraq. never, ever, ever in a million years. we'd be thru in afganistan by now had we not taken men and money away from afganistan. then again, i don't know that we should have gone into that pissant country either. look at every other country that has invaded afganistan and where it got them. no-freaking-where. think back to gulf '91 and the aftermath. we had never stood higher in many peoples' estimation. now, fast forward over the years....we got attack on 9-11-look at the worlds reaction. for the most part, shock, horror and a lot of support. what did we do? think about all that. what should we have done? not what ended up happening, that's for damn sure. universal good will evaporated with our push to invade iraq. iraq had nothing to do with 9-11. nothing.

a war should be justified, your cause should be right, and you have to be able to win the thing. can we win in afganistan? i don't know that we can.
like sherman said, "War is cruelty. There's no use trying to reform it, the crueler it is the sooner it will be over." but we want to fight a ''civilized' war, which is why that joker is dragging on and on...and on.


bush was a fool. his push to war in iraq was the cruellest act of his presidency. i wish like hell we could go back to those dark days and redo all that. what a mess he's gotten us into. the deficit is what it is due to those two misbegotten wars. and for what? where has it gotten us? what has been gained? nothing. there were other ways to attack terrorism. what a bill of goods we were sold.


three things are needed to fight a war.
money, money, and yet more money.

[Riot]

Seems like a good way to cut out some costs without impacting students in a significant way. Isn't that what we want government to do? Cut the wasteful spending?

This seems similar to the good move of eliminating banks as middlemen for student loans - banks were getting a check for mailing in paperwork to the government, then passing out the check to the student when the government approved. Big waste. Now the student can deal directly with the government. Good thing.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Seems like a good way to cut out some costs without impacting students in a significant way. Isn't that what we want government to do? Cut the wasteful spending?

This seems similar to the good move of eliminating banks as middlemen for student loans - banks were getting a check for mailing in paperwork to the government, then passing out the check to the student when the government approved. Big waste. Now the student can deal directly with the government. Good thing.

I agree. Hey it's Valentine's Day and I found common ground with you. LMAO

Tho NASCAR is 'a friend of ours'

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

This is education we are talking about here. You dont think there are other programs that can be cut or eliminated? Yes I am in agreement with you that cuts do need to be made to reduce the deficit.

Defense.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

Way to look out for this nation's future Mr President.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110213/...ma_pell_grants

I am sure all you supporters of our awesome President will say this is good for the future of this nation.

I think it's a good thing and appears to have no consequences since students don't graduate any faster with summer school/duplicate grants and graduate loans weren't appropriate. Using IRS information is especially encouraging as it surely will give a potential fraudster second thoughts.

BTW Why does everything have to be put into 10-decade quotes for Dems and yearly quotes for GOPers. For instance after an article outlining the recent GOP plan to cut the budget by 100 Billion for one year why isn't 'the cut has the potential to save a Trillion dollars over a decade' included?

[Danzig]

a move needs to be made in encouraging kids to attend a trade school as well. college is one route to a good future, but we are facing a shortage of electricians, plumbers, hvac, auto mechanics, etc. it's all well and good to encourage kids to go to school, but some only end up racking up debt with a degree not worth the paper it's printed on. the papermill here in town has been trying for months to hire electrical/instrumentation techs. this is a highly paid position, especially for this area. they haven't found one candidate in months that qualified. and this is the same all over. people are out of work, but people are hiring-but the unemployed need to be qualified!

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Danzig

a move needs to be made in encouraging kids to attend a trade school as well. college is one route to a good future, but we are facing a shortage of electricians, plumbers, hvac, auto mechanics, etc. it's all well and good to encourage kids to go to school, but some only end up racking up debt with a degree not worth the paper it's printed on. the papermill here in town has been trying for months to hire electrical/instrumentation techs. this is a highly paid position, especially for this area. they haven't found one candidate in months that qualified. and this is the same all over. people are out of work, but people are hiring-but the unemployed need to be qualified!

In this area we have a crazy amount of HVAC techs, electricians and plumbers available largely because of the hault in construction, making every contractor and in some cases large developers delve into smaller jobs just to keep busy. Bartering and doing business 'off the books' has also taken off and will be a by-product of the unemployment situation for years to come. But for the first time in 4-5 years I finally see homes being sold (many on short sales) and foundations being dug.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Danzig

the papermill here in town has been trying for months to hire electrical/instrumentation techs. this is a highly paid position, especially for this area. they haven't found one candidate in months that qualified.

But, but, but ... you have to live in Alabama?

I think a number of folks remain unemployed because they can't sell their house quickly and and move to a new state.

[Riot]

Foreign aid is only about 1% or less of our budget.

That foreign aid did pay off when the army in Egypt took Obama's calls this past week.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Riot

But, but, but ... you have to live in Alabama?

I think a number of folks remain unemployed because they can't sell their house quickly and and move to a new state.

You might be right right. Consider this also some folks stay unemployed because they make more collecting unemployment.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

You might be right right. Consider this also some folks stay unemployed because they make more collecting unemployment.

Nobody really "makes more" collecting unemployment. The most you can make, even if you had a rather high salary, is about $300-350 a week. Before taxes. That's minimum wage. If you had a minimum wage job, you make far less. And you pay income taxes on unemployment.

Nobody chooses bare survival over a better paying job. Would someone choose to net $300 a week, if they were a lawyer or an auto line worker, over working at McDonalds for $250 a week? I'm sure they might. And they are entitled, as long as they are using their time to actively looking for work as a lawyer or auto line worker (and yes, unemployment double checks that you have been looking for work)

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

You might be right right. Consider this also some folks stay unemployed because they make more collecting unemployment.

No one makes more money collecting unemployment, as it's based on what the person earned before.

Even were a misanthropic statement like this true, and it's a popular meme in right-wing circles these days (if you take support away from the destitute they'll CHOOSE not to be destitute!), I would still support unemployment benefits, for the simple reason that it benefits me (no, I am not on unemployment). Unemployment benefits, like food stamps, are one of the most effective ways of pumping money into the economy. They work because they are immediately spent: on food, on rent, on gas, on car repairs. That money, taxed from corporations and given to those looking for work, goes back to private businesses in the form of money paid for necessities. It's a symbiotic relationship. We live in a consumption based economy. If people aren't purchasing things, our entire economy suffers. When the economy suffers, we all suffer, unless we are the super-wealthy who live off of investment income, and even then we eventually start to suffer, though not to the level the middle-class do.

Tax cuts to the wealthy do not benefit the economy in the same way, as they tend to invest the extra money (because they actually have extra money), rather than spend it to the degree that the unemployed spend their benefits. Unemployment benefits go, in their entirety, right back into the economy. Which is good for all of us.

The other reason for their existence is that they give people an opportunity to look for work in their field, rather than being economically forced to take the first job available. A technician with two kids who has to immediately take a job at Denny's washing dishes because he has no savings is a technician who is not available to go out on job interviews for openings in his field.

And that's the other thing with unemployment- you must, at any moment, be ready to show that you've been looking for work or your benefits will be cut.

I realize for the DTers who don't believe anything Rush and Beck told them to think, this post will be ignored, but I hope it was at least passably informative to the moderates. Very little media attention is given to the economic benefits of unemployment insurance, and they are, in fact, fairly substantial.