A Saratoga wrap up, best and worst

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by GPK

Didn't bet a single harness race last night....that was where we had to go for the simulcast. If I bet harness racing 1 time a month, thats alot. I haven't bet harness racing on a consistent basis in well over a year.

I could have sworn I read you talking about Balmoral like it was sex replacement therapy.I must be mistaken.

[GPK]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

I could have sworn I read you talking about Balmoral like it was sex replacement therapy.I must be mistaken.

I know all about it because that was the track I was betting 3-4 nights a week 12-18 months ago. I might bet that track 1 time a month now, for kicks and giggles mainly.

I know the feeling.

I didn't miss a day at Keeneland for years.
Would go in opening day and out closing day.

Was in with a great group of horsemen, horsepeople and sicko gamblers.
Those were the days.

Everyone has pretty much scattered around the world now, and it just ain't the same.

Originally Posted by oracle80

Bellamy you really don't get it.
Not everyone goes to the Derby or the Bc. Trust me, everyone goes to the spa.
At those events you can't even watch workouts without a badge or paying to get in.
Its not about the horse racing Bellamy. You can watch that on tv, and most people do.
saratoga's daily attendance is the highets average in the USA. Dwarfs every place else. Now why do you think that is when they could all stay home and watch on tv?
You really should come here once before you make a statement like that. I don't know how you could compare them without attending it.
I could go forever without attending a BC, and not care one bit. I love the derby and Kentucky, but if given a choice between never being there again, and attending the Spa. It would take less than a nanosecond to make the choice.

Hogwash! Travers day 40,000, Derby day 150,000, but I guess 40,000 includes "everybody"...there was not a single west coast trainer there, and why should there be when they can make money at Del Mar...you know a lot but you don't get it that the East Coast is not the end all be all, take John Q. Public in Mesa, Arizona who loves racing, maybe he gets to the Spa once in his entire lifetime...it's just too out of the way, even if you find a cheap flight to the city you're still 3.5 hours away, which is why they'll never have a BC there, but they will at Monmouth? Hmmm. I'm not trying to pick a fight, but the pecking order is 1) Derby, BC and then everything else is based on proximity.

Originally Posted by BellamyRd.

Hogwash! Travers day 40,000, Derby day 150,000, but I guess 40,000 includes "everybody"...there was not a single west coast trainer there, and why should there be when they can make money at Del Mar...you know a lot but you don't get it that the East Coast is not the end all be all, take John Q. Public in Mesa, Arizona who loves racing, maybe he gets to the Spa once in his entire lifetime...it's just too out of the way, even if you find a cheap flight to the city you're still 3.5 hours away, which is why they'll never have a BC there, but they will at Monmouth? Hmmm. I'm not trying to pick a fight, but the pecking order is 1) Derby, BC and then everything else is based on proximity.

Well lets see, I've been to all three, and to me its not close.
Hogwash is trying to use a derby day figure to compare to 36 days. Wanna go average for average daily attendance at a meet?
And most folks don't go to the track for racing alone, its also the atmosphere and things to do afterwards and before.
I've been to cups at CD, Bel, Gulf, Arlington and Lone Star. They are ok I guess, but its just another day at the track.Especially since you have to pay a fortune to get in the door. And I never saw anyplace like Siros afterwards at any of them.
Derbies are great, if you are lucky enough to have friends with a great box. But i dunno about paying 50 bucks to get in the joint to sit on a folding chair in the grandstand and buy a 6 dollar water. The AVERAGE GUY gets into Saratoga for 3 dollars and gets to see grade one races 13 times a meet.
And besides, those events are one day. You blow in and you blow out.
Saratoga is 6 weeks, and anyone whos ever been there will tell you that there isnt anything like it. Anybody else been to all three and have an opinion as to what they would attend if they only had a choice to go to one?

I'm a big fan of the racing at Saratoga and if I went I'm sure I'd love the atmosphere & and scenery
my point was that a derby or breeder's cup is going to get more of the top trainers and horses showing up from all over the country (and world), thus making it a more inclusive event(s)
as for a fan not close to the east coast, they would have a better chance of seeing a BC because they move it around, or going to a derby because it is more centralized
for a trainer/owner well they'd keep their horses out west until BC time
that's simply my point...I'm sure you could ask people which they'd like to be at and the majority probably would say Saratoga, but people can't just be beemed up there from all parts of the country...a better question would be how many derbys have you been to, how many BCs, and how many trips to the Spa? not so much which provided you with the best experience
as I'm sure Saratoga is a wonderful experience everyone should go at least once I would urge, myself included

Originally Posted by BellamyRd.

I'm a big fan of the racing at Saratoga and if I went I'm sure I'd love the atmosphere & and scenery
my point was that a derby or breeder's cup is going to get more of the top trainers and horses showing up from all over the country (and world), thus making it a more inclusive event(s)
as for a fan not close to the east coast, they would have a better chance of seeing a BC because they move it around, or going to a derby because it is more centralized
for a trainer/owner well they'd keep their horses out west until BC time
that's simply my point...I'm sure you could ask people which they'd like to be at and the majority probably would say Saratoga, but people can't just be beemed up there from all parts of the country...a better question would be how many derbys have you been to, how many BCs, and how many trips to the Spa? not so much which provided you with the best experience
as I'm sure Saratoga is a wonderful experience everyone should go at least once I would urge, myself included

I don't really see how where people are located matters to be honest. If I lived in Cali, I'd hitchhike across the country if I had to be here on opening Day.
As far as the BC goes? Last year it was 3 1/2 hours from my house and I didn't go. Lans was full up with all sorts of folks for First Sam's race at his table and I woulda had to sit upstairs. I just said screw it, I've been to Belmont many times, would have to travel and sit in a traffic jam, blah. So I stayed home and watched it on tv without having to stand on line to pee.
I'll go this year because I love kentucky and the friends I have there. But you won't see me at Monmouth Park the following year even though its real close.
Racing is best enjoyed while being comfortable. Saratoga is about the only place I know of where you can wear shorts and get in the joint for three bucks and watch racing of that quality while music plays in the background and people party at picnic tables and people are dressed up the old fashioned way in jackets in the clubhouse boxes.
Afterwards you can WALK to a variety of bars and restaurants for more merriment and oh yes, the DRF is sold on every streetcorner.
Its the atmosphere Mike. I went to a BC at a certain place and couldnt even get the next days DRF. They didnt even have it at most of the stores around there.
This whole place embraces racing(especially for that 6 weeks) and everywhere you go people are talking horses. You go out for a drink and you will always see some guy with a DRF and you say "who do you like?". Its like a continuous 6 week racing festival where its ok to walk around a be a horse fan with the DRF under your arm. Its just not like that anyplace else that I have ever been.
The whole town is about racing 24/7 during the meet.
And noplace else is there an atmosphere like the one in the mornings during workouts. Thats the prize in the crackerjack box. Warm sunny mornings where the horses prance onto the track in front of you as you sit in a clubhouse box that belongs to a zillionaire in the afternoon. Trainers walking by and saying hello and asking the clockers(real and fake) "what did you get him in?" Most places won't let spectators in to see works at all.
Like I said, its not the racing, thats just the icing on the cake. Head on down to Belmont on Friday and you could shoot a cannon through the place and not hit anyone. On Saturday even with the grade ones you are talking about 15 grand or fewer. And if you go out in NYC on Friday night with the DRF under your arm and ask someone who they like, they will say either the Mets, Giants, Jets, or Yankees.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by oracle80

get in the joint for three bucks

A man of your stature has to pay $3 to get in???

[Revolution]

i have been to every large track in america and one in england and one in ireland. nothing compares to belmont park with a triple crown on the line. second is the kentucky derby. third is breeders cup day. fourth is breeders cup preview day at belmont park. saratoga does not have one day that can compare to any of the above four days. travers day is a distant fifth. saratoga is a great meet but it is primarily rich people from new york, new jersey, connecticut and the locals. the racing is great but the electricity there never approaches a derby or belmont day. never.

Originally Posted by Scav

A man of your stature has to pay $3 to get in???

Everyone pays these days Scav, last year even the jockey's wives had to pay. The audit of NYRA criticized letting anyone in free and gone were the days of owners leaving people passes every day.
Bailey threw a fit last year when his wife was asked to pay to get in.
They sold passes this year to make it easier for regulars. 35 bucks for the meet. 75 bucks for the meet for the clubhouse.
I hadn't payed to get in in 10 years before last year. Everyone pays now, unless you are press or have credentials as an employee or owner.

[Scav]

I would tell them GFY and I would also mention that I would put my action through Pinnacle, they would fork over $75 real quick.

NYRA: "$3 per day please"
Scav: "GFY, I will make sure Pinnacle sends you a thank you letter for my action"

Originally Posted by Scav

I would tell them GFY and I would also mention that I would put my action through Pinnacle, they would fork over $75 real quick.

NYRA: "$3 per day please"
Scav: "GFY, I will make sure Pinnacle sends you a thank you letter for my action"

NYRA: Thats very nice now please leave the grounds.
Scav: GFY
NYRA: Oh look there's Mr Cook, the head of security for us here who used to be the superintendant of the NYS Police force. Hes going to solve your problem for you!!

I'm planning to visit Saratoga for the first time next year. I'm already looking forward to a great week of racing.

[Gander]

LOL. Would you guys quit being a couple of hens (a la Scuds) and give me your opinion on the Pirates Bounty tomorrow at Delmar.

Originally Posted by Gander

LOL. Would you guys quit being a couple of hens (a la Scuds) and give me your opinion on the Pirates Bounty tomorrow at Delmar.

Probably victor espinoza and/or the horse that is the heavy favorite. Del Mar is on life support this year.

I'm the biggest derby fan there ever was
derby week I'm like a dope fiend about to make a big score
my eyes are bugging out and I'm foaming at the mouth
well, a few of you have seen me in this awful condition
...can't imagine anything more intense
but I'll withhold judgement
just saying, Saratoga is hard to get to for a lot of folks
even if the motivation is there

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Gander

Theres just something special about this place. I've been to a few California tracks and while nice to look at, there just seems to be something very social and "meet specific" lacking. The vast majority of people that I see are there because its something to do, a novelity. At Saratoga, people actually plan vacations around the track and as someone who lives here, there was only 1 weekend this entire meet that we didnt have guests from out of town up to visit. I've really come to appreciate the quality of racing here, its very easy to take for granted, especially if you dont compare it to other tracks like Delmar which has in general a very consistently weak quality of racing.

I need a break as I went more this summer than I have in a very long time, but 322 days is a little too long!

I guess I will just have to hope the next 32 days go by very quickly.

you say that Del Mar has a consistently weak quality of racing? What are you smoking? Del Mar has the best quality of racing in the country. Del Mar and Saratoga have the two best meets in the country in terms of quality. Look at the horses who have run at Del Mar over the years. Last year, the BC Juvenille winner Stevie Wonderboy ran at Del Mar, Wild Fit the BC Juvenille Filly runner-up ran at Del Mar. I don't think I need to bore you and name all the Breeder's Cup winners such as Singletary, Sweet Catomine, and Pleasantly Perfect have run at Del Mar. Del Mar has never lacked in their quality of racing. They have had just as many superstars over the years as Saratoga if not more.

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

you say that Del Mar has a consistently weak quality of racing? What are you smoking? Del Mar has the best quality of racing in the country. Del Mar and Saratoga have the two best meets in the country in terms of quality. Look at the horses who have run at Del Mar over the years. Last year, the BC Juvenille winner Stevie Wonderboy ran at Del Mar, Wild Fit the BC Juvenille Filly runner-up ran at Del Mar. I don't think I need to bore you and name all the Breeder's Cup winners such as Singletary, Sweet Catomine, and Pleasantly Perfect have run at Del Mar. Del Mar has never lacked in their quality of racing. They have had just as many superstars over the years as Saratoga if not more.

But Rupertk they run so many cheap claimers. I'm talking 10 claimers, and a lot at that.
Spa has claimers, but not like that. ANd they must have set the record this meet for maiden claimers, state bred maiden claimers. Yuch.
Its just that those cheap races seem to oevrshadow the quality races they do have. And if you think that racing is on a par with Spa,s well. I dunno what you are seeing. 12 grade ones at the spa, just as many grade 2's. I don't see that at Del mar.
And besides its the evevry day product thats so weak there.

[Revolution]

the saratoga v del mar argument is rather boring. both are excellent and have their own good things. the average purse distribution though at saratoga, del mar and i believe keeneland fall are virtually identical.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

you say that Del Mar has a consistently weak quality of racing? What are you smoking? Del Mar has the best quality of racing in the country. Del Mar and Saratoga have the two best meets in the country in terms of quality. Look at the horses who have run at Del Mar over the years. Last year, the BC Juvenille winner Stevie Wonderboy ran at Del Mar, Wild Fit the BC Juvenille Filly runner-up ran at Del Mar. I don't think I need to bore you and name all the Breeder's Cup winners such as Singletary, Sweet Catomine, and Pleasantly Perfect have run at Del Mar. Del Mar has never lacked in their quality of racing. They have had just as many superstars over the years as Saratoga if not more.

At the highest levels, i agree with you. The stars that come out in So Cal are most of the time every bit as good and sometimes better than the stars in the east. You could name a million stars like that.

What has slipped is the day to day stuff that fills out the card. I mean, it seems that the only races they can fill are 22k mcl races. I think more than anything its workers comp laws. When guys like Dollase, Lukas and even Frankel for the most part dont run their best stock anymore, its going to hurt overall quality.