Town to Behead People Who Don't Pray 5 Times a Day

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by repent

whats the problem?
rules are rules.

thats their religion, and that is what their religion requires.
they are being give THREE DAYS notice before the law is implemented.
that is ample time for anyone who does not want to abide to evacuate the city.

I admire the Sheik and his Islamic court.
at least they will know where everyone stands.


Repent

welcome to repents world.

[timmgirvan]

We should take a poll on how many of us here consider themselves to be "type A" personalities! Cajun spoke of her driving habits...I'm not sure if that's a clue. Are sports people/gamblers "type A" in totale or what?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

Don't forget to add my name to that list! Another piece of garbage from Repent, and I find it interesting that you agree! The are two "small" problems with that point of view...first, I believe these folks in charge came to power as part of the control of said area by radical militia forces, not because they represent the views of the town. So, they are imposing their bastardized "faith" on folks who lived there before them and believe differently...how again is that fair? But more importantly (and here is where I'll get incoming fire), they are indeed like elements of the so-called Christian right...a matter of degree perhaps but the same bastardization of religious principles! Lets make this simple so folks don't ask me what I'm saying....Belief in a set of religious principles DOES NOT give someone the right to harm another! In a free society...each person should be totally free to believe (or not believe) as their conscience dictates but belief DOES NOT equate to power over another!! There is only one moral justification for taking a human life...self-defense or defense of innocent others! Cutting off a person's head because they only prayed 4x one day instead of 5 does not quite qualify...I don't give a damn what their so-called canon law states! And wishing death on someone because they are gay or practice another religion doesn't make the grade either!! When religion is used as a justification for murder, it becomes malignant...and meaningless! Not the core principles of the religion itself, but it's use!

i agree completely with this. i thank my lucky stars every day that i live here. i cannot even begin to imagine what life must be like in some of these other countries. it's frustrating at times dealing with chauvinism here, but here is NOTHING like other countries. covered head to toe, no freedom of movement, no voting, no working (that alone would drive me insane)...societies where women are still considered one more piece of property. or women are killed if they are raped, so as not to bring 'shame' on their family.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

He wasn't saying that all of the victims were women, but that the CAUSE of the witch trials was a bunch of old biddies.

Thanks for the info, though... I had no idea about the one that was pressed to death with rocks.

yeah, i've read about 'pressing' before. keep loading the poor bastard down til his body can't hold up all the weight anymore....

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

GR, Do I need to remind you what your quote was yesterday? Your quote was that "Fundamentalist Christianity and fundamentalist Islam are more alike than they are different." That was your quote.

And now you get mad at me when I say that you said the Relgious Right is just as bad as the extreme Muslims? I don't get it.

Well, at least you understood the ignore request was a joke... I think... that's progress.

Rupert, do some research on where fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims stand on women, birth control, gays, and the role of religion in government and get back to me. I think you'll find they have remarkably similar positions on these topics, they just differ on how often you pray and who the big prophet was.

My point from that earlier post was, we need to be just as firm with our home-grown, Christian terrorists as we are with foreign, Muslim ones, else we look like hypocrites. Our "war" should not be against Islam, it should be against religious extremism, no matter what religion that extremism wraps itself in. And we should couch it in those terms, because then the moderates of all faiths will get behind us, knowing we're not attacking "their" religion; we're attacking those who would attempt to harm anyone's right to practice any faith freely and openly.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

LOL Nicole...

I don't disagree with all that you just posted, but if I may...

I have a hard time accepting the notion that ignorance and fear of the unknown causes people to resort to violence and anger. I believe that it IS human nature to take the easy road, and the easy road in a lot of cases is to be filled with contempt. It is HARD WORK for me to look at the world with rose colored glasses... it really is. I am not a hateful person, but I honestly have to work at being patient and kind. (If you're ever in a car with me, you will know this. ) With that said, I try to be a good person and respect others, even if I don't agree with their viewpoints. I think that if more people at least ATTEMPTED this, we would be in a better place.

*Jumping off of my soapbox.*

I think you're completely right about people doing what's easy. I hadn't thought to put it that way, but I think you're right on the nose with that. It's hard to look at other viewpoints, knowing you might change your mind, or, after all that, you might not (I've had both experiences).

We soooo need to take a car ride together-- I thought I was queen of chewing out other drivers, but clearly I am not. We could yell a duet! We'll put Kev in the back with earplugs.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

double double toil and trouble
fire burn and cauldron bubble

Witch! She's a witch! Burn her!

Sorry. Props for the Macbeth reference. I love that play. Not the way I love "King Lear" but I love it.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Witch! She's a witch! Burn her!

Sorry. Props for the Macbeth reference. I love that play. Not the way I love "King Lear" but I love it.

lol i like macbeth....when my mother in law comes in sight...well, there's 'by the pricking of my thumbs...'lol

i like king lear, but i think othello is my favorite.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

I think you're completely right about people doing what's easy. I hadn't thought to put it that way, but I think you're right on the nose with that. It's hard to look at other viewpoints, knowing you might change your mind, or, after all that, you might not (I've had both experiences).

We soooo need to take a car ride together-- I thought I was queen of chewing out other drivers, but clearly I am not. We could yell a duet! We'll put Kev in the back with earplugs.

Oh yeah, I am an absolutely obnoxious driver... Either hit the gas or move out of my way! LOL

In response to Timm's post, I am about as type A as they get...

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Well, at least you understood the ignore request was a joke... I think... that's progress.

Rupert, do some research on where fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims stand on women, birth control, gays, and the role of religion in government and get back to me. I think you'll find they have remarkably similar positions on these topics, they just differ on how often you pray and who the big prophet was.

My point from that earlier post was, we need to be just as firm with our home-grown, Christian terrorists as we are with foreign, Muslim ones, else we look like hypocrites. Our "war" should not be against Islam, it should be against religious extremism, no matter what religion that extremism wraps itself in. And we should couch it in those terms, because then the moderates of all faiths will get behind us, knowing we're not attacking "their" religion; we're attacking those who would attempt to harm anyone's right to practice any faith freely and openly.

I don't think you can compare the two religions. One group tells people that they should repent from their sins. But it is your choice whether or not you choose to repent. If you don't want to repent, that is your choice. The other religion will tell you what to do and if you don't do it they will kill you. That is a huge difference.

I'll give you analogy. A father tells his son that he should not smoke marijuana. He tells his son that he thinks marijuana is harmful and that it's not a good idea to smoke it. But if his son chooses to smoke it any way, that is his decision.

Another father tells his son not to smoke marijuana and makes it clear that if his son does smoke it that he will literally murder him in cold blood. The father is serious and will murder his son with a butcher knife if he catches him smoking marijuana.

I don't think it would be fair to say that the two fathers are pretty much the same because they don't want their kids to smoke marijuana. The two fathers are not the same at all.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

I think (if I may be once again permitted to push my nerd glasses up on my nose) that it's not so much human nature to hate and judge as it is human nature to fear what we don't understand. Which I think is much bigger than a human nature thing; I think it's a survival mechanism for most living things capable of fear-- how often do we see horses freak out at something new? It's an excellent survival tactic in the wild, but in our civilized world, I think it gets turned into anger and violence.

I had a very different opinion on homosexuality as an 18-year-old college freshman than I did as a 19-year-old college sophomore. And what changed me was watching an extraordinary, amazing college professor die of AIDS over that year (this was a few years before the pro-tease inhibitors came on the market) and having a classmate who was gay and willing to answer any and all question I could think of to ask him about himself. I got past the fear of the unknown and so moved to a point where I could never see someone else's orientation as a reason for hatred.

On the other hand, you have my uncle, who on some level, I think is so unwilling to risk having his mind changed that he won't even watch Ellen DeGeneres' talk show. I think that is the fear instinct, coupled with a drive to protect oneself, taken to the unfortunate end in a civilized society.

The difference between us and most animals (primates are awfully bright), though, is that we can ask ourselves why we hate something; why it provokes an emotional reaction in us. Because it's bad or because it's different? And we can choose to go out and talk to people who have different opinions and maybe make a fuller, more informed decision about what deserves to be hated and what needs us to understand. But it's hard. Fear is hard-wired into us, so it's tough to work past it. But animals do it all the time (here I think of BuffyM's Buck and the scary bush) and so can we.

Which is why I love this board. It's also human nature to cluster into groups that are like us, and not venture out and look at anything different. Survival, in a more primitive time. But not now. But see? Look at all of us! The only thing we all absolutely have in common is that we love horse racing. The rest we'll discuss and hash out and argue but not resort to hate. Hey! The way to world peace is through Derby Trail! I knew it!

GR,
Interesting that you see "fear" as a reaction to threat.
Have a look at this link and see how it plays against "safety".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow%...archy_of_needs

Perhaps, "hate" fits somewhere else in Maslow's pyramid as an oppositional motivation as well. Trigger-response "stuff". I have been looking for causal factors, but honestly, still have a problem with the motivation for it.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

welcome to repents world.

Interesting to study, as are Rupert's analogies.
Let's forget the Spanish Inquisition, Crusades, the slaughter of the Aztecs and the Incas. Muslims are BAD! doncha know?
I'm getting a clearer picture of the response to fear (you know, that nasty thing that causes that adrenelin response to the "safety threat"). It's called "justification"...another excuse for "hating" those that caused it, or allows actions that make it ok to take what they have that you want ("greed").
Ahh..human motivation...fascinating stuff!

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I don't think you can compare the two religions. One group tells people that they should repent from their sins. But it is your choice whether or not you choose to repent. If you don't want to repent, that is your choice. The other religion will tell you what to do and if you don't do it they will kill you. That is a huge difference.

I'll give you analogy. A father tells his son that he should not smoke marijuana. He tells his son that he thinks marijuana is harmful and that it's not a good idea to smoke it. But if his son chooses to smoke it any way, that is his decision.

Another father tells his son not to smoke marijuana and makes it clear that if his son does smoke it that he will literally murder him in cold blood. The father is serious and will murder his son with a butcher knife if he catches him smoking marijuana.

I don't think it would be fair to say that the two fathers are pretty much the same because they don't want their kids to smoke marijuana. The two fathers are not the same at all.

Rupert, that's about as bad a mischaracterization of Islam as ever I've seen. The fact that you think honestly think Islam advocates killing nonbelievers any more or less than Christianity does is mind-boggling and a testament to the effectiveness of right-wing media. As DTS said, take a look at Christianity's history and you'll see several movements by some of its misguided followers to kill off non-believers, several of said movements being directed against Moslems. Fundamentalists are violent. Islam and Christianity are not.

For the love of Pete, go take a World Religions class or something. "The other religion will tell you what to do and if you don't do it they will kill you."????? That's what you think Islam is? Oh, God help us. I'd laugh if it didn't make me feel so very sad and hopeless for the world, because sadly, I don't think you're alone in this country in your insistance on villifying any religion besides your own.

And what about your heroine, Ann Coulter, saying, in the wake of 9/11, "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them all to Christianity." How does that tie in with your insistance that, "One group tells people that they should repent from their sins. But it is your choice whether or not you choose to repent."????

[Downthestretch55]

[quote=GenuineRisk]Rupert, that's about as bad a mischaracterization of Islam as ever I've seen. The fact that you think honestly think Islam advocates killing nonbelievers any more or less than Christianity does is mind-boggling and a testament to the effectiveness of right-wing media. As DTS said, take a look at Christianity's history and you'll see several movements by some of its misguided followers to kill off non-believers, several of said movements being directed against Moslems. Fundamentalists are violent. Islam and Christianity are not.

For the love of Pete, go take a World Religions class or something. "The other religion will tell you what to do and if you don't do it they will kill you."????? That's what you think Islam is? Oh, God help us. I'd laugh if it didn't make me feel so very sad and hopeless for the world, because sadly, I don't think you're alone in this country in your insistance on villifying any religion besides your own.
GR,
Sometimes it seems like you're shouting words against the wind. Sorry.
To me, it's a bit amusing that those that seek to justify due to their overwhelming knowledge ignor the fact that after Indonesia, India has the second highest Moslem population, 150 million (that's half of the total US population).
So what's next? Attack India?
Crazy stuff!
DTS

[skippy3481]

christanity and the muslim religion may have alot of viewpoints the same, but they differ where it matters, theology.

Muslim faith teaches that entrance into heaven is by following the 5 pillars of islam and basically working your way into heaven.

Christianity teaches thats its by grace not works.

Of course there are other similarities and diffrences but it matters not if the two do not agree on how to enter heaven. Either one is wrong and one is right or they are both wrong.

[skippy3481]

Also in the quoran it does say "Kill all the infidels" ( i have citation if anyone doubts) but you have to read it in context with the rest of the paragraph. Most muslim commentaries believe that it was meant kill the infidels(or pagans) that attack you first and kill in self defense. No where does it say go out and hack people that are not muslim. And this is coming from a person of christian faith,i am by no means a muslim. Just thought a clarification was neccessary.

[Downthestretch55]

Originally Posted by skippy3481

christanity and the muslim religion may have alot of viewpoints the same, but they differ where it matters, theology.

Muslim faith teaches that entrance into heaven is by following the 5 pillars of islam and basically working your way into heaven.

Christianity teaches thats its by grace not works.

Of course there are other similarities and diffrences but it matters not if the two do not agree on how to enter heaven. Either one is wrong and one is right or they are both wrong.

Interesting that you showed up and weighed in on this, Skippy.
For those that don't know the story...it's in Genesis 16 and 21.
One born and rejected, one born to address a promise that was doubted.
For those that wonder how we got here, those two chapters won't take a lot of time.
Round and round we go....

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Rupert, that's about as bad a mischaracterization of Islam as ever I've seen. The fact that you think honestly think Islam advocates killing nonbelievers any more or less than Christianity does is mind-boggling and a testament to the effectiveness of right-wing media. As DTS said, take a look at Christianity's history and you'll see several movements by some of its misguided followers to kill off non-believers, several of said movements being directed against Moslems. Fundamentalists are violent. Islam and Christianity are not.

For the love of Pete, go take a World Religions class or something. "The other religion will tell you what to do and if you don't do it they will kill you."????? That's what you think Islam is? Oh, God help us. I'd laugh if it didn't make me feel so very sad and hopeless for the world, because sadly, I don't think you're alone in this country in your insistance on villifying any religion besides your own.

And what about your heroine, Ann Coulter, saying, in the wake of 9/11, "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them all to Christianity." How does that tie in with your insistance that, "One group tells people that they should repent from their sins. But it is your choice whether or not you choose to repent."????

Any Christians that would kill non-believers are just as bad as Muslims who would kill non-believers. I'm not denying that.

I don't know what Christians or Muslims did hundreds of years ago. All I know is what I see in the world right now. I don't see Christians killing non-believers.

I can't speak for Ann Coulter. I would have to think she was kidding but if she wasn't then she's crazy.

I feel sad for you if you think that the Christian Right(in this country today) wants to kill gays and non-believers. Sadly, I don't think you're alone in your belief. That is why there are plenty of liberals out there that think the Christian Right are some kind of terrible people. They actually think that a guy like Jerry Fallwell is comparable to Bin Laden.

[skippy3481]

Rupert, just because some muslim people misinterpret doesn't mean the whole religion wants to off everyone thats not muslim. Look at westboro baptist in the kansas. They would love to kill gays, that doesnt mean all christians do. You can't selectively slice out parts and apply them overall its not fair.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by Downthestretch55

Interesting that you showed up and weighed in on this, Skippy.
For those that don't know the story...it's in Genesis 16 and 21.
One born and rejected, one born to address a promise that was doubted.
For those that wonder how we got here, those two chapters won't take a lot of time.
Round and round we go....

DTS: spot on with the genesis(small g) of the problem! This the result of Abraham not trusting God to make him the father of Isreals' generations to follow. It was the wifes' idea to sleep with servant! SECOND time woman put the Kibbosh on Gods' Plan(Garden of Eden ring a bell) But...WE love you ladies!