Dear Dubai apologists...

[tector]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I don't think Godolphin discloses private purchase prices but just this year they paid out a fortune between Vineyard Haven, Desert Party, and Regal Ransom. Midshipman, who they got in the purchase from Stonerside, cannot be quantified.

According to this:

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/o...cky_Derby_run/,

Vineyard Haven alone cost $12 million.

And no one here seems to comprehend that entire focus of Team Dubai's dirt breeding and training operation is to win the Derby--anything else that falls out of the process is gravy. We are talking about hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars over the past decade or so.

Here's an interesting flashback:

http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/...from_duba.html

And here we get the update:

http://www.newsvine.com/_news/2009/0...-1st-derby-win

Yet all the setbacks through the years have done little to change the way Sheik Mohammed runs his program. His best 3-year-olds will spend the winters in Dubai. That's it.

"He's a very, very competitive man and if somebody told him he couldn't do it from Dubai, well, he is going to do it from Dubai," said trainer Eoin Harty, who guided Desert Party as a 2-year-old before he was moved to Godolphin.

Like the Yankees, Sheik Mohammed spares no expense in search of a championship.

Godolphin horses are superstars in Dubai and well taken care of at the stable's state-of-the-art training facility. Life is just as good on the road. Desert Party and Regal Ransom traveled to Churchill Downs in their own planes and have their every step closely monitored by an attentive staff and a nation glued to a popular 24-hour racing channel.

Ferguson has spent more than $281 million on over 300 yearlings at the Keeneland September sale in the last 10 years. It hasn't led to a Derby win but that doesn't mean Sheik Mohammed is going to keep his wallet closed when he sees a horse he likes.

The spending spree has slowed recently, but not because of the economic downturn. All that buying has helped Sheik Mohammed build an impressive collection of stallions and broodmares, and the hope is one day he'll be able to breed a winner without having to buy one.

[tector]

By the way, am I the only one who remembers this book?

http://www.amazon.com/Desert-Derby-B...1582849&sr=1-1

Apparently.

[SniperSB23]

I guess I'm alone in that I hate Sheikh Mo, hate Pletcher, but love what Sheikh Hamdan has done for the game. And even after seeing the Derby I still believe that anyone betting a Pletcher horse not named Dunkirk was far more foolish than anyone betting a Dubai horse. As was anyone betting the winner.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

FTFY

Yeah, at least my computer doesn't have 2500 viruses and have some robotic sounding German chick screaming at me when I boot up.

How many times must I repeat myself. NO MORE PORN SITES!

And when it happens yet again in another week don't go blaming the software I told you to use that successfully cleaned it up the last time.

To prevent these future 'between the keyboard and chair' errors:

1. Stop going to your fetish porn sites.
2. Learn to use bit torrents. Maybe Pants here can explain how.

[MisterB]

Originally Posted by tector

You have to be kidding, mac.

If I gave Pletcher half the money these drape-wearing dopes have squandered on their Derby ambitions over the past decade, he'd have won at least 3 or 4 Derbies by now, if only inadvertantly

Are you serious?? This has to be the quote of the decade

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

If you cant see by now that it is pretty much impossible to buy the Derby there is nothing that I can say to make you not believe that. They could have bought IWR and FF the day before the race and still not hit the board let alone win. There is a certain amount of luck needed to win the Derby and you cant buy that. It would be almost impossible to diminish winning the Derby.

Obviously Sheik Mo's plan takes preference over winning. He may be obsessed with winning 'his' way but again i doubt that he is devastated over another loss.

Again what difference does it make how much one spends? Did Thunder Gulch's win feel like it was bought? Coolmore spends a whole lot more than anyone else not from Dubai. Are the Phipps laughable because they have never won the Derby despite having the best American broodmare band over the last 40 years?

So the whole theory is that if they win it is diminished because they spend so much but if they dont win they are assholes? Maybe they arent a warm, fuzzy story but the fact they havent won shows the challenge of the sport and why it attracts so many diverse people from all walks of life. Jesus i sound like a freakin liberal...

Too funny!

--Dunbar

[Kasept]

Thread of the Year nominee...

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Yeah, at least my computer doesn't have 2500 viruses and have some robotic sounding German chick screaming at me when I boot up.

How many times must I repeat myself. NO MORE PORN SITES!

And when it happens yet again in another week don't go blaming the software I told you to use that successfully cleaned it up the last time.

To prevent these future 'between the keyboard and chair' errors:

1. Stop going to your fetish porn sites.
2. Learn to use bit torrents. Maybe Pants here can explain how.

He'd f.uck that up too and ruin it for the rest of us.

[King Glorious]

I still say that if you have $5 in you pocket and you offer $1 for a candy bar.......and I have $1000 in my pocket and offer $5 for that same candy bar.......you offer was a bigger offer than mine because it was a higher percentage of what you actually have. I was just offering up pocket change. You were offering up a significant amount of all you had. That's the way I look at their purchases. You may look at the amount and think they are spending way too much. I look at it and say they are spending relatively nothing for them.

[Linny]

US writers are convinced that Sh Mo has a single mindled desire to win the Derby at all cost. His buying horses like VH seem to confirm it. But what most of them don't realize is that his US buying/racing is small compared to his worldwide splurging. It's not just winning the Derby, it's winning his way, via Dubai. As long as he tinks he can do it, he'll buy horses and send them to th meat grinder at Al Quoz.

Had Midshipman, VH, RR and DP all stayed in the US with their original trainers he might have had an overwhelming shot. (This assumes that Midshipman and VH would have trained on.) Sh. Mo is more committed to his plan than to winning the Derby.

[cakes44]

It's not like leaving the horses he owns over here with Eoin Harty gives him any better chance at winning the Derby.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by cakes44

It's not like leaving the horses he owns over here with Eoin Harty gives him any better chance at winning the Derby.

Really? I must have missed Eoin Harty failing with a bunch of top 3YO prospects.

NT

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Really? I must have missed Eoin Harty failing with a bunch of top 3YO prospects.

NT

Indeed, you have missed them.

That is, unless you are discounting the two year olds he wrecked before they turned three.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Indeed, you have missed them.

That is, unless you are discounting the two year olds he wrecked before they turned three.

I really have less than zero interest in California racing so I don't know who they are. If you'd like to tell me, that's great.

NT

[Linny]

Any good baby he had for Darley/Godolphin was taken away and sent to Dubai. He did OK with those fillies a couple of years ago.

[PatCummings]

Been off the map for a few days - but a delightful read here.

For the person who said they hate Sheikh Mo and Todd Pletcher, but LOVE Sheikh Hamdan, I'm interested in hearing that rationale.

I still do not think you can deny that the preparations of Desert Party and Regal Ransom this year were the best of any previous Godolphin attempt. It wasn't enough, nowhere close.

I bet both of them, in a variety of fashions, and lost. But ANYONE talking about mocking others for whom they bet in the Derby...c'mon. Before the race - mock away. After Mine that Bird won? Really? Everyone I know who hit something in the Derby won because of hitting the "ALL" button or making a mistake (guy next to me meant to bet 'that Pop-Pop horse' aka Papa Clem, but hit the 8 instead - had the exacta for $2 as a result).

Call it what you will, but horse racing in Dubai is hot, and it's not just the weather. It might not yield a host of Kentucky Derby champions (and they will certainly try, although I believe the long-reported "obsession" is overblown), but Dubai is one of the VERY few places in the world where racing's influence is expanding, not contracting.

Godolphin has won a bunch of big races, they will continue to, and surely there will be some they don't get. Many, many big time horsemen have tried to land the Derby and failed. WinStar, Vinery, Padua, Phipps, Stonestreet, Zayat, Winchell, Juddmonte, Peachtree, West Point, Reddam, Melnyk, Wygod, Stonerside/McNair, Whitney, Shadwell, and Godolphin. Some will keep trying, some won't. For most all of the people who are in the position to buy these horses, they know that no matter what big races they win, they will almost always spend more money than they win. It is a sport of many losers and few winners.

We can't deny, however, that the money these big wigs flow through racing with their big-time purchases help keep the sport running. Like em or not, it's true.

There are few people who dislike seeing the "little guys" take home the big prize, at least in this country. It's a typical American story and position. As for Dubai, the home team has the biggest support. They are rabid for the success for Godolphin.

So - where does this leave us? Same place we started I suppose.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I really have less than zero interest in California racing so I don't know who they are. If you'd like to tell me, that's great.

NT

He ruined several prospects in Ky and NY, as well as Ca.

As for me telling you who, your apathy towards the whole thing has affected me too.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

He ruined several prospects in Ky and NY, as well as Ca.

As for me telling you who, your apathy towards the whole thing has affected me too.

In NY over the last five years he's 7 of 51 with 2YO for an ROI of $0.84.

Below is a list of 2YO he's started on the NYRA circuit during that time:

Armament
Barbican
Barcola
Beholden
Bellevue Belle
Bemused
Chambermaid
Changing Weather
Desert Party
Dixie Lyrics
Elusive Schemes
Exotic Story
Golden Manna
Hatta Flower
Imperial Reign
Incriminate
Keep Thinking
Marietta
Maxey Boy
Media City
My Golden Opinion
Northern Pick
Positive Force
Reynaldothewizard
Rondo
Sahara Heat
Stormy Blessing
Sweet Ariette
Tates Queen
Testimony
Unification

It's fine if you think he has ruined 2YO I just would love to know who, my apathy for CA racing aside.

NT

[Linny]

Please , which of that list would have been legit TC candidates? About half were fillies. Several others were sprint or miler bred and unlikely to get 10f in G1 racing. Others appeared to be OK but many were taken away and sent to Dubai.
Several on that list were described to me as "not much" by people within the Darley/Godolphin training operations, so don't kid yourself into seeing all those horses as classic prospects.

As for Desert Party, he won a graded race at Saratoga before getting hurt in the fall. The brain trust at Godolphin took him to Dubai and planned out a schedule for him as a sprinter even though he's by Street Cry from a mare by a Belmont winner. They never really considered either RR or DP as Derby colts until the UAE Derby.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

In NY over the last five years he's 7 of 51 with 2YO for an ROI of $0.84.

Below is a list of 2YO he's started on the NYRA circuit during that time:


Barbican



NT

He was one of my favorites and then he got hurt and really sucked afterwards.