Indian Vale

[stonegossard]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Can I first?

Let Stone have my sloppy seconds.

Just dont pull a smokey stover and back away at the last moment and not follow through.

[stonegossard]

Originally Posted by freddymo

DrugS is broke..Why do you need money anyway? Just bet Byk's winners and you will be rich enough

Why dont you bet.......................oh....forgot.


My bad.

[Payson Dave]

Originally Posted by philcski

Haha!

I've seen it. It's... white?








Sorry Bethi! Couldn't resist!

Well based upon a brief sighting at the Spa, I was pretty sure it wasn't black....

[stonegossard]

Originally Posted by Payson Dave

Well based upon a brief sighting at the Spa, I was pretty sure it wasn't black....

In this strange world you never know.

[freddymo]

Thebby would you mind posting a sweet jpeg of your arsss?

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Anyone of Hystericalady's last three dirt races are good enough to mop up this pathetic field.

She's faster than the other speed, and the nine furlong distance will suit her perfectly. I also am quite puzzled how she can be considered dead money at 8/1. I suppose she becomes a FAR less attractive if her synthetic races are held against her - but, anyone who's watched her dirt races knows she's a speed horse who breaks open races with an explosive burst off the far turn, and on synthetic surfaces, those horses always underperform.

i don't see this unfolding like the Molly Pitcher, that was not a fast pace and she was totally not challenged at any point whatsoever, not hard to look great powering home under those circumstances. at a minimum i see Indian Vale and Bear Now as faster early than Hysterical Lady.

one way to look at her synthetic races is to say she doesn't do well on cushion track, although I don't buy that because her figures are more or less in line with her other races. another way to look at it is to say that routing she isn't as good as the type of fillies and mares she'll face in the distaff. so let me get this straight, she is so good on dirt that she'll mop up on this pathetic field, yet when members of this pathetic field beat her on cushion track (Balance, Tough Tiz' Sis), its because the cushion track effects Hysterical Lady much more than the others? i don't buy it. she could be in the mix but i don't see her finishing better than third.

[robfla]

hate to be on topic, but:

on the other hand; if you DO throw out the cushion races then she is 7 wins in 11 starts at distances from 4.5f to 8.5f. She is proven she doesn't NEED the lead as shown in the 7f Humana at CD and others. If you watch that race it is one of the most visually impressive of the day notwithstanding that of Street Sense ( Derby Day ) If she can sit behind the speed and make her move on the far turn she can win at 10-1. Castro is underrated too so maybe 12-1 + due to the post

[Scav]

Originally Posted by robfla

hate to be on topic, but:

on the other hand; if you DO throw out the cushion races then she is 7 wins in 11 starts at distances from 4.5f to 8.5f. She is proven she doesn't NEED the lead as shown in the 7f Humana at CD and others. If you watch that race it is one of the most visually impressive of the day notwithstanding that of Street Sense ( Derby Day ) If she can sit behind the speed and make her move on the far turn she can win at 10-1. Castro is underrated too so maybe 12-1 + due to the post

I love her in that race, but it is very possible that she will be 4w into that first turn, and that will be her demise.

And I just read through this whole thread and it is amazing how bad a thread can go because of a one person, there is alot of good things in this thread and no one is going to read it after page 2 because of the drama. Bethani, a little note, you don't have to explain yourself to no one IMO, you do what you do because things are great around here, as long as Morty stays in his cage where people can get a dose of him and then safely get away. no need to waste your time bantering unless you are in the mood to yell at your monitor for an hour, I am sure many around here echo those statements.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

although I don't buy that because her figures are more or less in line with her other races

I'd like to argue this. Hystericalady's last two dirt performances were close to -2(-1.75 and -1.5) where her cushion performances were no where near that (2.75, 3, 2.25). I see a huge difference in those.

My issue with her is the post, if she finds a way to only be 2w into the turn then she mops this field IMO. but 4w and she will have issues.

[nomad]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

Since we're off topic...

http://birdloversonly.blogspot.com/2...his-dance.html

Glad to see someone in the Holiday spirit. Happy Halloween to you too.

Now back to Indian Vale.......

Now back to my pps.........

Hysterical Lady will be very tough in here. She's got the style & the speed & has won here. I will stick to my original picks, right or wrong, HS, Octave, Balance (at 20/1??!!!)

I think Nashoba's Key is our next monster. Had she run in this one, she would have been my choice.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

at a minimum i see Indian Vale and Bear Now as faster early than Hysterical Lady.

Hystericalady was cross entered in the Sprint race ...

She's won at 4.5 furlongs, a stakes winner at 5 furlongs, set the pace in the INSANELY fast paced Las Flores at 6 furlongs earlier in the year, won a Grade 1 race at 7 furlongs at Churchill by open lengths after being rated very hard and sitting about a length off of the speed crazy Shaggy Mane.

And you think Indian Vale is faster? A daughter of Belmont winner A.P Indy, who's made the early lead just once in the last two years - when she set the pace in the disgracefully paceless Next Move at AQU.

Bear Now obviously doesn't have the raw speed of a Hystericalady - but she needs the lead and Hystericalady doesn't...and she's drawn inside of HL.

I'd like to see Flores send HL, but he's annoyingly patient, especially when drawn outside. If she doesn't clear, and gets hung up on the first turn, I think HL can still win with rating tactics.

Prior to running on the synthetic surfaces - Hystericalady was seen as some brilliant speed crazy run-off who couldn't rate...if someone said after her Humana win that Indian Vale was faster than her...it would compete with the legendary Excellent Meeting reminds me a lot of Alydar comment from AOL about five years ago.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Hystericalady was cross entered in the Sprint race ...

She's won at 4.5 furlongs, a stakes winner at 5 furlongs, set the pace in the INSANELY fast paced Las Flores at 6 furlongs earlier in the year, won a Grade 1 race at 7 furlongs at Churchill by open lengths after being rated very hard and sitting about a length off of the speed crazy Shaggy Mane.

And you think Indian Vale is faster? A daughter of Belmont winner A.P Indy, who's made the early lead just once in the last two years - when she set the pace in the disgracefully paceless Next Move at AQU.

Bear Now obviously doesn't have the raw speed of a Hystericalady - but she needs the lead and Hystericalady doesn't...and she's drawn inside of HL.

I'd like to see Flores send HL, but he's annoyingly patient, especially when drawn outside. If she doesn't clear, and gets hung up on the first turn, I think HL can still win with rating tactics.

Prior to running on the synthetic surfaces - Hystericalady was seen as some brilliant speed crazy run-off who couldn't rate...if someone said after her Humana win that Indian Vale was faster than her...it would compete with the legendary Excellent Meeting reminds me a lot of Alydar comment from AOL about five years ago.

i was merely comparing how these horses ration their speed in route races, not making a claim that Indian Vale is a faster sprinter than Hysterical Lady. Last I looked the subject race is being run at nine furlongs.

of course she is fast, but this is not a sprint we are talking about here and she doesn't run a sprint-like pace in her route races for reasons that should be obvious. whether you want to believe it or not Indian Vale and Bear Now run pace numbers in their route races that are faster than Hysterical Ladys numbers from her route races. by saying that I am not making a meaningless generic statement that those horses are faster than Hysterical Lady. you're looking for Hysterical Lady to make an explosive move off the turn to take the lead and win, I don't see that happening.

[robfla]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I'd like to see Flores send HL,

isn't Castro aboard? I would much prefer Castro over Flores

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

i was merely comparing how these horses ration their speed in route races, not making a claim that Indian Vale is a faster sprinter than Hysterical Lady. Last I looked the subject race is being run at nine furlongs.

of course she is fast, but this is not a sprint we are talking about here and she doesn't run a sprint-like pace in her route races for reasons that should be obvious. whether you want to believe it or not Indian Vale and Bear Now run pace numbers in their route races that are faster than Hysterical Ladys numbers from her route races. by saying that I am not making a meaningless generic statement that those horses are faster than Hysterical Lady. you're looking for Hysterical Lady to make an explosive move off the turn to take the lead and win, I don't see that happening.

3 of the last 4 routes are on Poly and the other route shee made an easy lead and towered over the field and drew off.. As a 3 year old she routed on dirt with equal or better pace the IV.. Anyway IV is on to the breedibg shed and hopefully the Pletcher magic drugs are out of her system

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by freddymo

3 of the last 4 routes are on Poly and the other route shee made an easy lead and towered over the field and drew off.. As a 3 year old she routed on dirt with equal or better pace the IV.. Anyway IV is on to the breedibg shed and hopefully the Pletcher magic drugs are out of her system

the surfaces at Hollywood and Santa Anita are not polytrack. I know many people loosely refer to all synthetic surfaces as polytrack, but the cushion track surface is distinctly different than polytrack.

[King Glorious]

I have no problem with Indian Vale being favored. She's unbeaten at the distance when running two-turns and there is a chance that she can be the speed of the race. Even if she isn't leading it, she's shown several times that she can run with other horses during the early stages and still finish. Perhaps Unbridled Belle should have been made the favorite and she has finished ahead of IV the last three races to back up her position. But two of those were at 10f, obviously too far for IV. I think these two are the top two in the race and were equally deserving of the favorite role in a pretty open race.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Prior to running on the synthetic surfaces - Hystericalady was seen as some brilliant speed crazy run-off who couldn't rate...if someone said after her Humana win that Indian Vale was faster than her...it would compete with the legendary Excellent Meeting reminds me a lot of Alydar comment from AOL about five years ago.

that comment was from 1999 i believe dude. how does the HL vs IV speed issue compare to the legendary comment that Johar wouldn't win the BC because he would not be able to get loose on the lead?

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

the surfaces at Hollywood and Santa Anita are not polytrack. I know many people loosely refer to all synthetic surfaces as polytrack, but the cushion track surface is distinctly different than polytrack.

You are right Cushion isn't poly but carpet isnt dirt..HL is going to on the lead at the head of the stretch