WI Union-busting provisions added in budget committee

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

I guess you really don't believe what you write.....

Oh no. I quite believe what I write. As I already said I don't think it's likely he'll be charged by the sheriff, why in the world would I make a lousy bet I don't agree with?

You are the one actually trying to defend this slime. Why don't you at least clearly state what you think will happen here? All you've mumbled are insinuations of other people (not currently under investigation for either ethics or potential charges) being at fault or potentially at risk. While you say everyone else doesn't have enough information to make such judgments. Hypocritical much?

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Oh no. I quite believe what I write. As I already said I don't think it's likely he'll be charged by the sheriff, why in the world would I make a lousy bet I don't agree with?

You are the one actually trying to defend this slime. Why don't you at least clearly state what you think will happen here? All you've mumbled are insinuations of other people (not currently under investigation for either ethics or potential charges) being at fault or potentially at risk. While you say everyone else doesn't have enough information to make such judgments. Hypocritical much?

Have you read all the accounts of the people that were there? If a subordinate of yours charged you at work, after an argument, would you try to use your hands or just belly bounce the charger.

And nothing will happen HERE. Just a bunch of Badgers smiling, enjoying the beautiful day, and knowing the State is finally headed in the right direction.

Nothing happening here but the Dems last ditch effort, using costly recall elections after a costly recount under the guise we can't afford the Governor's changes. The average tax paying badger sees through that like a freshly polished window.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Have you read all the accounts of the people that were there?

Yes, I have read every public statement they have put out. Have you?

Prosser has never denied he grabbed her by the neck. He only tried to blame her for it (as he blamed the other justices for making him swear and threaten them last time) Did you notice that?

If a subordinate of yours charged you at work, after an argument, would you try to use your hands or just belly bounce the charger.

Strange you say that. If a woman charged at you with her fists raised, the normal response is to grab her wrists. Not her neck

Nothing happening here but the Dems last ditch effort, using costly recall elections after a costly recount under the guise we can't afford the Governor's changes. The average tax paying badger sees through that like a freshly polished window.

I think the "average tax paying badger" will vote for recall.

How 'come the average tax paying badger doesn't see how Walker's budget is going to cost them money and raise your taxes? I don't think your window is as freshly polished as you imagine.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

How 'come the average tax paying badger doesn't see how Walker's budget is going to cost them money and raise your taxes? I don't think your window is as freshly polished as you imagine.

Because for example when a public worker is forced to pay for in part his healthcare and pension the "average tax paying badger" understands that saves money. When a needless recount is demanded over 7,000 votes and it changes by a few votes, that costs money. It's not rocket science.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes, I have read every public statement they have put out. Have you?

Prosser has never denied he grabbed her by the neck. He only tried to blame her for it (as he blamed the other justices for making him swear and threaten them last time) Did you notice that?.

yes I have and did you notice she never has accused him of grabbing her neck NOR denied charging him!!!!

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

I think the "average tax paying badger" will vote for recall.

Good for you. I'm sure you have constant contact to the "average tax paying badger" in Kentucky.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Because for example when a public worker is forced to pay for in part his healthcare and pension the "average tax paying badger" understands that saves money. When a needless recount is demanded over 7,000 votes and it changes by a few votes, that costs money. It's not rocket science.

I think you need to read the independent financial reviews of Walker's budget bill.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

yes I have and did you notice she never has accused him of grabbing her neck NOR denied charging him!!!!

Wrong. She indeed publicly has accused him of grabbing her neck, and denied charging him. You know, those quotes she gave? Sunday? On the weekend? Because media demand was so high and the story went national right away?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Good for you. I'm sure you have constant contact to the "average tax paying badger" in Kentucky.

They sure seem to be doing better at the Dems recalling Republicans (100% success rate) than the Republicans are doing trying to recall Dems (failed at half of what they tried, barely got enough sigs for the rest).

Did you see what happened in Ohio? Their Republican governor forced through a union busting bill like Walker did. In Ohio, however, the public can demand such laws be put to public referendum before becoming law.

They needed 230,000 signatures or so. They got 1.3 million. They will vote on it this fall. The public will decide if the Ohio Republican union-busting law will actually be law, or not. I predict not.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

LOL
Who suggested putting zero into education? The amount of money keeps increasing yet the quality of education keeps decreasing. I guess we should just blame the kids?

It's a difficult task on the blame game. The fault is to be leveled at many people, unions included, but they are far, far from the only one's involved. Yes, you blame the kids too. If someone commits a murder, the shooter is to blame. What happened in his life to get him to the point where they commit a murder is irrelevant to some extent. You have to punish the shooter though many others were to "blame" or in some way "responsible" for his state. Same with kids in school. If they have virtually zero desire to learn, some of the blame is on them without question. No?? Education is a tough game...very, very tough in some areas of the country. Determining why every single kid who has no desire whatsoever to learn anything in the public school system is an impossible task that cannot and will not ever be solved.

I find the conservative attack on unions distasteful to the extreme. Yes, there are bad elements to them without question and that is not even a debatable point. That is human beings in a nutshell. Why would unions be exempt from distasteful human beings?? They aren't. But the whole gist of the attack on unions it is the desire of slave labor. that is all this is about. Dirt cheap labor is the goal and corporations have it and they ain't gettin it in America. corporations are doing fantastic without having to hire American workers. The initial goal of labor unions were very, very good and they did a lot, a lot of good. They were a prominent player in the explosion of the middle class in AMerica. It's now over. No one will work for slave wages in this country but they do in many other countries in the world. why in hell would steve jobs make an i-phone in this country when he doesn't have too?

The ultimate goal of destroying all unions that exist is the goal for a return to cheaper labor here. that is all it is. And if you really think the goal of destroying teacher unions is to reward "great" teachers you live in an alternate universe. No, it's cheap labor is all it is. You lose the "lavish benefits", and lose all collective bargaining, you get cheaper labor. And everyone knows that is all this is about but won't really admit it. They're afraid to do that. That is all it is about. For a group of politicians all over the country to promote the "fact" that public school teachers are living extravagent, easy, problem free lives simply for the purpose of pitting the rubes against each other is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever witnessed in my life. It's beyond sick.

The deficit theater is another high level comedy act that is better than Monty Python in it's level of comedy. The schtick being played out by Ds and Rs is masterful. They are perfectly on board with each other and playing all of us for fools and suceeding with aplomb. That people think there is one iota of difference in them is silly. That people think elections in this country have any meaning whatsoever is more comedy. The game is nearly over now. It's ok, medicare over, social security over, unions over, 7 wars at once....BAM--you-betcha!! Sarah Palin, Barrack Obama, Mitt Romney, John McCain. We would see zero difference whatsoever in any of them. zero. Geithner, Bernake--BAM--you betcha!! Austerity bitches, austerity!

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

The deficit theater is another high level comedy act that is better than Monty Python in it's level of comedy. The schtick being played out by Ds and Rs is masterful. They are perfectly on board with each other and playing all of us for fools and suceeding with aplomb. That people think there is one iota of difference in them is silly. That people think elections in this country have any meaning whatsoever is more comedy. The game is nearly over now. It's ok, medicare over, social security over, unions over, 7 wars at once....BAM--you-betcha!! Sarah Palin, Barrack Obama, Mitt Romney, John McCain. We would see zero difference whatsoever in any of them. zero. Geithner, Bernake--BAM--you betcha!! Austerity bitches, austerity!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

It's a difficult task on the blame game. The fault is to be leveled at many people, unions included, but they are far, far from the only one's involved. Yes, you blame the kids too. If someone commits a murder, the shooter is to blame. What happened in his life to get him to the point where they commit a murder is irrelevant to some extent. You have to punish the shooter though many others were to "blame" or in some way "responsible" for his state. Same with kids in school. If they have virtually zero desire to learn, some of the blame is on them without question. No?? Education is a tough game...very, very tough in some areas of the country. Determining why every single kid who has no desire whatsoever to learn anything in the public school system is an impossible task that cannot and will not ever be solved.

I find the conservative attack on unions distasteful to the extreme. Yes, there are bad elements to them without question and that is not even a debatable point. That is human beings in a nutshell. Why would unions be exempt from distasteful human beings?? They aren't. But the whole gist of the attack on unions it is the desire of slave labor. that is all this is about. Dirt cheap labor is the goal and corporations have it and they ain't gettin it in America. corporations are doing fantastic without having to hire American workers. The initial goal of labor unions were very, very good and they did a lot, a lot of good. They were a prominent player in the explosion of the middle class in AMerica. It's now over. No one will work for slave wages in this country but they do in many other countries in the world. why in hell would steve jobs make an i-phone in this country when he doesn't have too?

The ultimate goal of destroying all unions that exist is the goal for a return to cheaper labor here. that is all it is. And if you really think the goal of destroying teacher unions is to reward "great" teachers you live in an alternate universe. No, it's cheap labor is all it is. You lose the "lavish benefits", and lose all collective bargaining, you get cheaper labor. And everyone knows that is all this is about but won't really admit it. They're afraid to do that. That is all it is about. For a group of politicians all over the country to promote the "fact" that public school teachers are living extravagent, easy, problem free lives simply for the purpose of pitting the rubes against each other is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever witnessed in my life. It's beyond sick.

The deficit theater is another high level comedy act that is better than Monty Python in it's level of comedy. The schtick being played out by Ds and Rs is masterful. They are perfectly on board with each other and playing all of us for fools and suceeding with aplomb. That people think there is one iota of difference in them is silly. That people think elections in this country have any meaning whatsoever is more comedy. The game is nearly over now. It's ok, medicare over, social security over, unions over, 7 wars at once....BAM--you-betcha!! Sarah Palin, Barrack Obama, Mitt Romney, John McCain. We would see zero difference whatsoever in any of them. zero. Geithner, Bernake--BAM--you betcha!! Austerity bitches, austerity!

So the fact that teachers unions have strangled the life out of the education system in this country is due to human nature?

I wish you would have attempted a retort of the ridiculous waste of money caused by the unions for no good purpose other than self preservation and political gain instead of a rambling diatribe that shows great potential to have been aided by scotch.

The saddest thing is when people rush to defend the teachers unions is they do so in spite of the unions lack of help for those that they should be helping, the dedicated teachers and students.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

So the fact that teachers unions have strangled the life out of the education system in this country is due to human nature?

I wish you would have attempted a retort of the ridiculous waste of money caused by the unions for no good purpose other than self preservation and political gain instead of a rambling diatribe that shows great potential to have been aided by scotch.

The saddest thing is when people rush to defend the teachers unions is they do so in spite of the unions lack of help for those that they should be helping, the dedicated teachers and students.

That is silly. There are several factors involved with strangling the life out of public education. To cop out and say teacher unions are 100 percent responsible for education problems is a complete cop out as well. Poverty doesn't play a factor at all? I drink nothing...ever....honestly. I reqally don't. As a type 1 diabetic for the brunt of my life, over drinking would simply not be prudent. When my mom and dad went to work the existence of unions played zero role in what they were trying to accomplish day to day. Yes, they existed, but our views are coming from two different points of view. If you think you know more about the inner workings of public education day to day than I do dream on. I lived it.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

That is silly. There are several factors involved with strangling the life out of public education. To cop out and say teacher unions are 100 percent responsible for education problems is a complete cop out as well. Poverty doesn't play a factor at all? I drink nothing...ever....honestly. I reqally don't. As a type 1 diabetic for the brunt of my life, over drinking would simply not be prudent. When my mom and dad went to work the existence of unions played zero role in what they were trying to accomplish day to day. Yes, they existed, but our views are coming from two different points of view. If you think you know more about the inner workings of public education day to day than I do dream on. I lived it.

The problem is you are looking at it solely from your own personal experience. No one said that teachers unions are 100% responsible but they have to take the lions share of the blame. They are the single most powerful bloc involved with education and the huge national unions overwhelm the local boards and set up systems and rules that squeeze every penny they can into their coffers often at the expense of the students.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lano...concludes.html

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

Wrong. She indeed publicly has accused him of grabbing her neck, and denied charging him. You know, those quotes she gave? Sunday? On the weekend? Because media demand was so high and the story went national right away?

you need to start reading again. The media outlets you read may report things that way but the statements to the Capital Police and the witnesses are much different. Actually it was said by Bradley that he did not choke her but he would have if another justice didn't pull me away from him. I can't wait to see you eat crow on this one.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

you need to start reading again. The media outlets you read may report things that way but the statements to the Capital Police and the witnesses are much different. Actually it was said by Bradley that he did not choke her but he would have if another justice didn't pull me away from him. I can't wait to see you eat crow on this one.

ROFLMAO. Really? You expect us to believe that you have access to the statements from the Capital Police, huh? Because we all know those statements haven't been made public.

Or you are just repeating imagined crap made up and passed on by right wing blogs?

I'll go with the second - you are simply repeating imagined right wing blog crap that any of us can read on the internet - and read the public statements given Sunday by Prosser and Bradley, thanks.

You can stick to the right wing screeching spin machine about how Bradley threw her neck into Prosser's hands.

Wisconsin Supreme Court Justice David Prosser has issued a denial of witness reports that he grabbed fellow justice Ann Walsh Bradley by the throat on June 13. The altercation reportedly erupted in Justice Bradley's chambers during a heated discussion of Governor Scott Walker's controversial budget bill, which curtails collective bargaining rights for public workers.

Prosser says that the allegations against him "will be proven false" after a "proper review of the matter and the facts surrounding it are made clear".

Justice Bradley has issued a statement to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel stating that "(t)he facts are that I was demanding that he get out of my office and he put his hands around my neck in anger in a chokehold". Anonymous sources have confirmed Bradley's account, but spoke on condition of anonymity based on the need to maintain professional relationships. Other sources loyal to Prosser say that Bradley charged him with her fists raised and he grabbed her by the throat in an effort to defend himself.

Bradley responded to that version of events in an interview, saying, "You can try to spin those facts and try to make it sound like I ran up to him and threw my neck into his hands, but that's only spin."

She has announced her intention to pursue a formal complaint against Prosser. "Matters of abusive behavior in the workplace aren't resolved by competing press releases. I'm confident the appropriate authorities will conduct a thorough investigation of this incident involving abusive behavior in the workplace."

Prosser has a history of violent outbursts of anger, particularly against women justices. Last year, in a heated exchange, he called Chief Justice Abrahamson "a bitch" and vowed to "destroy" her. Bradley was present for that exchange and says she thought of contacting law enforcement personnel at the time. In an interview from March of this year, she expressed her concerns about Prosser's anger issues, saying, "It's been going on for years off and on".

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

ROFLMAO. Really? You expect us to believe that you have access to the statements from the Capital Police, huh?

Or you are just repeating imagined crap made up and passed on by right wing blogs?

Because we all know those statements haven't been made public.

I'll go with the second - imagined right wing blog crap - and read the public statements given Sunday by Prosser and Bradley, thanks.

You can stick to the right wing screeching spin machine about how Bradley threw her neck into Prosser's hands.

Put your money where your mouth is please. Here is some decent reading from the other side

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...tian-schneider

[wiphan]

Justice Ann Bradley should be playing for Manchester United with the kind of flop she had that day....

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

Put your money where your mouth is please. Here is some decent reading from the other side

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...tian-schneider

Yes, I have read stuff from "the other side".

This isn't an opinion issue, nor a political issue, nor a "problem caused by evil liberals trying to set up our good man Prosser" issue. It's a violence in the workplace issue, and an assault or simple battery against a judge issue.

Prosser has a known, self-admitted and verified history of verbal abuse in the workplace, and worse, blaming his admittedly wrong behaviour on being caused by those he abused.

Prosser doesn't get to start this incident from the position of being a good guy, due to his own previous behaviour at work. That's his very real problem. Not bad or imagined press.

The proof will be in if ethics charges or police charges are filed. We'll all just have to wait and see.

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes, I have read stuff from "the other side".

This isn't an opinion issue, nor a political issue. It's a violence in the workplace issue, and an assault or simple battery against a judge issue.

Prosser has a known, self-admitted and verified history of verbal abuse in the workplace, and blaming his admittedly wrong behaviour on being caused by those he abused.

Prosser doesn't get to start this incident from the position of being a good guy, due to his own previous behaviour at work. That's his very real problem. Not bad press.

The proof will be in if ethics charges or police charges are filed. We'll all just have to wait and see.

Your ignorance speaks volumes. All Prosser did in the past was call a Spade a Spade. If this incident involved a women who came at another women like bradley did to prosser this would be a non issue. The only reason it is an issue is that Prosser is a man. Bradley and Abrahamson are upset with the fact that prosser won and they will do anything to get him to resign or get kicked out since his appointment is for 8 yrs. The only violence in this incident was from Justice Ann Bradley, but we will see.

Why don't you start sending your $ to Segue Guy?