Obama's support for Ground Zero Mosque

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i see...what they do is horrible, so we should take a page from their book and act in kind. i thought we were better than that.

I don't think it's wrong to expect them to say they don't believe in the practices in the Koran that are against American Law. Don't think it's a page from their book to want them to say they respect our laws. I think people would be much more in favor of this location, if they would just do that. They won't, cuz they would be coming out against fellow Moslems. They want their cake, n' eat it too. We are guilty of letting them get away with it.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

by these statements, i see you didn't bother to go to the links i posted that show all the islamic statements by people in this country, as well as others, who spoke out against the terrorist attacks.
as for not agreeing with their religion-so don't convert to islam. allowing that building two blocks from the tower site won't cause conversions, it doesn't break any laws, and it won't protect anyone who happens to be islam who chooses to break a law. your discomfort with their religion doesn't mean they aren't free to practice it.
our laws, our guaranteed rights are for everyone, not just those deemed popular, not just those approved with a majority. it's why free speech is allowed, not just unobjectionable free speech.

There are a lot of reasons why people aren't allowed to open up shop in a location. Public input is involved. Nobody can tell them not to open a Mosque. "Where at" is another story. I find adult sex shops a hell of a lot safer than what is produced in Mosques, but sex shops can't just open up anywhere they want.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by GBBob

[/b]

And 100% of the population doesn't want to pay taxes, but you know that the majority doesn't always rule.

I'm not addressing this at you, but they have the LEGAL right to build this wherever they want.

If that's true, then why did 9 people have to vote on it? Seems the public does have a say where something can be built. There is public input on zoning.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by clyde

This 2 year old seems to make a lot of people jealous.




I welcome your slurs..they add to the legend.

Jealous? You're in fkn Cleveland!! Damn!! Who is jealous of this? Even Lebron can't run away quick enough.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Princess Doreen

Much the same as ElPrezBo embraces the constitution when it suits his needs - albeit infrequently?

It shouldn't be a right vs. left issue.

Should be a zoning issue. Period. The Public doesn't want it there. Build the hate center further away from the 9/11 site. Build 10 in Newark. Nobody will probably care that much.

[clyde]

I'll let you continue your assault upon yourself.





googlies!!

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by clyde

I'll let you continue your assault upon yourself.





googlies!!

Go kill ya some gnats.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Please cast more stones. You and Riot continue to be unable to discuss an issue without trying to color others as something they are not. Pot meet kettle.

Acting as though this site isn't far different than almost every other site in the country seems silly.

See, again, it's obviously not a meaningful site to them. They aren't that bent about it. Just another damn tourist attraction to these people. This is the main reason they don't have a problem with the zoning choice. if you don't care why something happened, then why would you care about the zoning in the aftermath? They don't particularly care about the specifics involved with the disaster (at all.) That might mean having to place guilt on someone, and then actually doing something about it. Just ignore the root cause, because it'd be hell for someone's feelings to get hurt.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

by these statements, i see you didn't bother to go to the links i posted that show all the islamic statements by people in this country, as well as others, who spoke out against the terrorist attacks.

Honey, if you've got links to Moslems directly speaking out against the actual words of Mo (that these terrorists were following,) then I'll gladly look at it. Anything else is useless bullshit artist stuff that they are expert at producing.

[Nascar1966]

Just was reading that Reid was against this mosque. He is probably trying to save his job since no one likes him now.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Because of drug dealers, not Christians.

so...you can tell me you know for sure that the dope dealers are all people who don't go to church? lol
catholic priests who were found to have molested kids went to church every day. im pretty sure they felt they were christians. being christian doesn't keep you from breaking laws, just like being islamic, jewish, hindu doesn't keep everyone on the right path.

but at least you are showing you can keep criminal behavior separate from religion, and don't think one has to do with the other. that's good.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Danzig

so...you can tell me you know for sure that the dope dealers are all people who don't go to church? lol
catholic priests who were found to have molested kids went to church every day. im pretty sure they felt they were christians. being christian doesn't keep you from breaking laws, just like being islamic, jewish, hindu doesn't keep everyone on the right path.

but at least you are showing you can keep criminal behavior separate from religion, and don't think one has to do with the other. that's good.

so you are saying that the Terrorists did NOT kill in the name of Allah?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Please cast more stones. You and Riot continue to be unable to discuss an issue without trying to color others as something they are not. Pot meet kettle.

Acting as though this site isn't far different than almost every other site in the country seems silly. Just as Riot can't seem to come to grips with stating that Muslims terrorists have twice attacked the area doesn't mean you think all Muslims are terrorists, pretending that this site won't be a target BECAUSE of the location is myopic at best.

This idealism believing that somehow all things are equal and the world is a logical place runs contrary to real life.

again, why is the site incendiary? recognizing the religion of the perpetrators, while failing to consider that islamic people were also victims in this attack is ignoring fact. if a church wants to honor it's dead, that's ok...but a mosque wants to reach out in that area, it's wrong. that ignores the fact that muslims were victims that day, not just christians.


i'm really just surprised that this thread is so long, considering everyone concedes they have a right to build there. i heard today that the idiots who protest at funerals have been shown to have the right, due to free speech laws. it's unpalatable, shows insensitivity, but can't be blocked without being unconstitutional.

the rule of law must prevail. you can't disallow this building, i don't understand why so many are so vocal about this, when there's really nowhere to stand against it.
all nyc can do about this is to change the zoning, and i don't see that happening.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

so you are saying that the Terrorists did NOT kill in the name of Allah?

i think they can try to justify it however they wish. i think they are using religion as a way to garner support from other believers in that faith. i don't care why they did it honestly. anyone engaging in criminal behavior should be treated accordingly. anyone who aids them should be as well. however, having been raised as catholic, i'd hate for someone to lump me in with child molesting priests or the church who allowed it.
what we need to be is very careful that we don't change our beliefs, our freedoms, because of the actions of a few rotten to the core people.


john adams was a lawyer who was asked to handle a very tricky case-this was pre-declaration of independance. he was asked to be council for the accused who was charged with instigating the boston massacre. now, just think about how unpopular that british soldier was, and how much grief adams knew he'd get if he took the case. hell, his own cousin samuel was the leader of the sons of liberty. but he knew that the rule of law had to prevail, and he took that case. and he won, the man was found not guilty. i'd rather we all follow his lead in this case. don't you think that's what should happen? are our laws, the very foundation of this country, to be ignored in this case, because the group concerned is unpopular, a minority group? i hope not. and how much does that piece of paper really mean if we aren't able to follow it when it is tough to follow? the right way isn't always the easy way. would it be easy for me to say, yes, ban them. don't build it! absolutely. but it would be wrong. nazis, kkk marches, i detest them. but they are allowed for a reason. what do we say when they occur? ignore it, don't give them the benefit of seeing you upset. it's what they live for. we have to be gender neutral, color blind, we must be the same when it comes to religion. we must be able to differentiate between a criminal, and a person. sharing this religion is not criminal. your actions make you so. unless someone breaks a law, they should be left in peace. it's what i'd want, it's what you'd want.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Iran doesn't hate us. Iran's leaders use us as a justification for their behavior. The clerics used our relations with the Shah as a justification to create the anarchy that allowed them to rise to power and hold it.
And is there a greater example of Islamic intolerence than what is regularly said about or done to Israel by Muslims?

Do you hate Venezuela because their leader claims he hates us and has befriended the Iranians? The Iranian people hate their govt far worse than they hate us.

now, there's an a-ha moment. change iran to islam. change iran's leaders to terrorist leaders. now, does that help you to understand why i say you can't tar this whole religion? it's the same thing. the press fastens on the few crackpot zealots, and ignores the masses who just want to live in peace.

and no, i don't hate venezuelans, i feel bad for them, as well as iranians and any other people who have to labor under a system like that. it's got to be awful.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Honu

So hypothetically lets say there is a neighborhood where children have been assulted sexualy by some sick freaks years ago. In this neighborhood NAMBLA wanted to build a building where people of like minds could meet and discuss their common intrests, does anyone think that it would be ok?
Its very akin to the subject at hand, the people who are offended by the thought of a Mosque being built in close proximity to where practishoners of a certain religion commited crimes against thousands of people are no diffirent than anyone else who have been a victim of a crime.
I just dont get why the Muslims feel a need to build a place so close to where their brothers killed Americans for no other reason than hatred.

this has got to be the worst analogy ever in the history of analogies.

again, muslims died that day in the towers. or are you assuming only christians died? those murderers were killing americans, they didn't stop to make sure what religion everyone belonged to.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Well, they do all go by what the same butcher had to say. I'd like to hear them make an effort to separate themselves from the terrorists, rather than you doing it. This Imam has said that America was partially to blame for 9/11. Right there, you should have a problem with this, but you don't. See, he won't come out and say the scum in his religion were wrong, and they are to blame.

i don't? when did i say that? that would be like saying a robbed bank was partially at fault because they had all that money and were asking for it.
and i have seen where members of that religion have spoken out against the terrorist acts, but you keep ignoring that. not once have you conceded that point, accepted that it has happened.


but you're right about zoning. if there is no other similar building in that area, the city can re-zone. whether they can do so and get away with it, i don't know. if other religious buildings are in that area, they haven't got a leg to stand on in that regard.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

Just was reading that Reid was against this mosque. He is probably trying to save his job since no one likes him now.

in the village idiot's mind he had a bad day!

H'mmmmm Reid against Obama

Hope Riot starts a new thread or I willl

[clyde]

Originally Posted by Danzig

this has got to be the worst analogy ever in the history of analogies.

again, muslims died that day in the towers. or are you assuming only christians died? those murderers were killing americans, they didn't stop to make sure what religion everyone belonged to.

You are searching for misspells in Einstein's e=mcboom!!




I think most do see her logic.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Danzig

this has got to be the worst analogy ever in the history of analogies.

again, muslims died that day in the towers. or are you assuming only christians died? those murderers were killing americans, they didn't stop to make sure what religion everyone belonged to.

funny thing is there are Muslim sites who say the Jews did it to bash them and the evidence was some Jewish CEO's who weren't in the towers. Of course they neglected to say they weren't even in the country as well.