Save Presque Isle Downs

[Ogygian]

With the upcoming meet 3 weeks away, I have some questions for Doug and anyone else that cares to chime in regarding this poor excuse for a track.
My first concern...they are still only at 500 stalls, and a list of 1100 applications for those stalls. There were to be an additional 200 built, what is going on with that???? More stalls=larger fields=more wagering, doesn't make much sense. Also the grooms stay at Tally-HO, there are quarters being built, how far off is that project.
I can't tell you how many times fields were only 5 or 6...Doug, what was the average number of starters per race over last years meet?
Also are they ever going to do anything cosmetically to the track, they may as well just take the trash that is going to the dump and unload it in the infield. Erie/Commodore Downs may have had a better infield. The souvenir stand is a banquet table with some sweatshirts.
I know the track is a afterthought, but seriously, it is embarrassing. They spent all this time and money, couldn't they have done a little better job? I was expecting Target and got a Dollar General. In my view this track is headed down the exact path that Erie/Commodore headed down, the one Thistledown is currently heading down...can or will it be fixed?

[slotdirt]

Wow, that's kind of harsh for a track that is only in its what, third season? I love the poly option for horses in the greater Northeast, and have never heard anything bad about the place from folks who run their horses there.

[Ogygian]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Wow, that's kind of harsh for a track that is only in its what, third season? I love the poly option for horses in the greater Northeast, and have never heard anything bad about the place from folks who run their horses there.

I am only speaking from the fan standpoint on my opinions of the track. After seeing and being at the elite tracks and kind of expecting something of that sort for PID, It is identical to Mountaineer, which is to be expected I guess. I may have set my expectations too high.
As for those who run their horses their, I have a friend that trains a few horses, they aren't superstars by any means, they had 6 stalls last year. They were told they had to average 5 starts per stall to keep them...they had 9 different horses that started 48 times. This year they were awarded zero(0) stalls. Now they have to ship from Thistle...
The concerning part is the trainer is local, which the track was built to help the locals, this may be an isolated case, but could be solved by building extra stalls.
As for it being in it's third season...it was rushed the first year and had a 30 day meet for Casino reasons, it looks like they didn't make any changes before the 2nd year and it looks like nothing has been done this year either.
It is very plain jane...

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Average field size was 7.10 starters per race at last years meet.

While low - that number was pretty inflated because PA bred MSW races would carry a purse of $50,000 and each starter was guaranteed $1,000. Thus sometimes inflating the total purse to as high as $56K

While you would often see fields of 12 in those races .. more than half of the horses in those races were either like career maidens with one zero Beyer figure after another - or other hopeless sorts who'd be lucky to break a 20 with a perfect trip.

They only care about slots. It's really that simple.

[sdjcom]

Mountaineer has full fields, and is a multi-building small resort, hotel, spa, golf course, the Harve entertainment center,nice resturants, several large casino areas,simulcast, PID isn't even close.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Ogygian

As for those who run their horses their, I have a friend that trains a few horses, they aren't superstars by any means, they had 6 stalls last year. They were told they had to average 5 starts per stall to keep them...they had 9 different horses that started 48 times. This year they were awarded zero(0) stalls. Now they have to ship from Thistle...
The concerning part is the trainer is local, which the track was built to help the locals, this may be an isolated case, but could be solved by building extra stalls.

I know who you're talking about and that's just terrible.

The opinion that the management there has of the locals is very low.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

While you would often see fields of 12 in those races .. more than half of the horses in those races were either like career maidens with one zero Beyer figure after another - or other hopeless sorts who'd be lucky to break a 20 with a perfect trip.

How is this any different than what was going on (and still is) at NYRA this winter? Talk about UNPLAYABLE.

At least PID has POLY. I'm going to play this track this year. I bet it's probably very beatable. All the other stuff is peripheral.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

How is this any different than what was going on (and still is) at NYRA this winter? Talk about UNPLAYABLE.

At least PID has POLY. I'm going to play this track this year. I bet it's probably very beatable. All the other stuff is peripheral.

I had good success there last year, and didn't really put a lot of extra effort into it. Other than CD and OSA, the only other track I showed a real profit on. Pools are small so you can't play big into it but I did well with simple win and exacta bets.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

How is this any different than what was going on (and still is) at NYRA this winter? Talk about UNPLAYABLE.

At least PID has POLY. I'm going to play this track this year. I bet it's probably very beatable. All the other stuff is peripheral.

It's different because horses are running just to collect the 1K. That's not the case at AQU

This poor thing would have run once a week if given the chance ... (notice how she was only 10/1 in the route race against MALES! that was some race!)





This poor thing was made to attempt a comeback off of a 2+ year layoff in hopes of collecting some 1K checks. What you don't see is that it was twice a gate scratch.




As for you playing PID this year ... I certainly wouldn't try and discourage you.

Thanks to a 35/1 longshot that won by 5 lengths on closing day of last years meet - my top selection showed a flat bet profit for the 100 day meet. I also had a flat bet profit with both "best bets" and Best longshots" at both '07 and '08.

However, if playing tracks with small fields, many highly uncompetitive races, small pool sizes, and sky high takeout isn't your type of thing .. you'll find better options anywhere else you look.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

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However, if playing tracks with small fields, many highly uncompetitive races, and sky high takeout isn't your type of thing .. you'll find better options anywhere else you look.

This appears similar to GG. Most seem to think that big, competitive fields make for better racing. I think the opposite. If you play tracks like GG selectively, you can actually do very well. I follow GG on a regular bases but I rarely bet more than 1 or 2 races a day there.

It's all about picking your spots. And, if you play a lot of other tracks, it's easier to resist the urge to bet races where you don't have an advantage/opinion.

This summer I'm focusing on DMR, AP, WO, and PID. I'll also, of course, be playing many of the non poly tracks.

Equibase uses TRAKUS data for the WO charts. Can't get anything more accurate out there. This makes the track a must to play.

Most of the focus seems to be on lowering takeout, while it should be on more accurate, more accessible, data, IMO.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Equibase uses TRAKUS data for the WO charts. Can't get anything more accurate out there. This makes the track a must to play.

Hopefully it's accurate enough to offset the take-out...

[The Indomitable DrugS]

The takeout at Woodbine compares favorably to PID ... and the fields are much deeper and races more competitive and the pool sizes larger.

[philcski]

The takeout in PA in general is an absolute joke. Always has been.

Or in a Byk-style word I've been holding out on, it's USURIOUS.

[PatCummings]

Someone mentioned PID has Polytrack, was there a change away from Tapeta?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

No. Still Tapeta.

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

I was there July 4th weekend last year......the wife & I enjoyed the facility very much! A lot nicer the Finger Lakes, maybe because it's newer and the race product isn't much different. Will be making a trip there again sometime this year.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by PatCummings

Someone mentioned PID has Polytrack, was there a change away from Tapeta?

most of us use the term polytrack to talk about any synthetic surface. kind of like when you ask for a kleenex, and get handed a puffs...it's still a tissue.

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Most of the focus seems to be on lowering takeout, while it should be on more accurate, more accessible, data, IMO.

Seriously?