America's Most Underrated trainer of the last 15-plus years...

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I think my vote goes to Penn National's Tim Kreiser.

I posted the following two years ago....

Trainers with more than 1,500 starters and a profitable ROI since 1996

Jeff Mullins 4,717 starts $2.01 ROI
Lloyd Mason 4,498 starts $2.01 ROI
Tim Kreiser 3,134 starts $2.04 ROI
Steph Beattie 2,790 starts $2.02 ROI
Larry Jones 2,765 starts $2.02 ROI
Jimmy Jerkens 2,454 starts $2.01 ROI
Julio Cartagena 2,291 starts $2.02 ROI
Ramon Preciado 2,010 starts $2.07 ROI
Mike Maker 1,985 starts $2.00 ROI
Bruce Alexander 1,953 starts $2.04 ROI
Andrew Leggio Jr. 1,928 starts $2.06 ROI
John Shirreffs 1,641 starts $2.04 ROI

Only Jeff Mullins and Lloyd Mason had more starters while maintaining profitability.

Scott Lake - before he broke out and became a big national figure - trained at Penn National with Kreiser. There was no comparison - Kreiser could out magician him all day long.

Over the last 5 years - horses claimed from Kreiser are 3-for-73 with a $0.42 ROI next time out. They are 0-for-14 when they go off at 2/1 or less.

Over the last 3 years - sprinters claimed from Kreiser are 0-for-42 next time out.

Over the last 3 years - sprinters claimed by Kreiser are 10-for-52 with a $2.66 ROI. 2nd off the claim the ROI spikes to $3.41

Over the last 3 years - sprinters switching barns to Kreiser are 4-for-16 (25%) with a $6.48 ROI. Two of the four winners were 21/1 and 23/1. One of the horses who didn't win - missed by just a neck at 8/1 odds and is a great example of vintage Kreiser steady improvement.



You see 3 wins in his first 7 races at odds of 5/2, 14/1, and 6/1. Getting beat less than a length 3 other times at odds of 8/1, 7/1, and 9/2. Winning a 36K entry level alw with a horse who was getting clobbered in non-winners in a year 5K claimers less than two months prior. Huge, steady, figure improvments.


What's most remarkable about Kreiser - in the last five years - Kreiser's only been given four non-Pa bred debuters who started either in a high priced maiden claimer or MSW race. One of them was a $2,000 yearling sired by Bandini. Another - Pepi Knows - was a $6,500 yearling. He's Graded Stakes placed with 245K in earnings from 14 starts. He was 2nd to Fabulous Strike Saturday.

Here's an alchemist that never got a shot. What little fresh stock he gets is an absolute joke. His horses also run very well when he ships to bigger circuits. He's historically very dangerous at Monmouth, Laurel, and Pimlico. Pepi Knows also did very well in New York.. though, he never has the type of horse to ship there.

[Thoroughbred Fan]

What's his day rate?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

No idea.

He was my first choice for Freddymo when he shipped one to Penn - but none of the jockey agents around here knew his phone number.

I guess - when you can't contact someone - it's one reason that explains why he never gets chances.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

No idea.

He was my first choice for Freddymo when he shipped one to Penn - but none of the jockey agents around here knew his phone number.

I guess - when you can't contact someone - it's one reason that explains why he never gets chances.

Where is Uncle FreddyMo?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

Where is Uncle FreddyMo?

No idea.

He was poised for a run at Poster of the Year - and he vanished.

[MISTERGEE]

any figs on Freddie Hyatt, I'm talkin his ROI
speaking of trainers Janet Del Castillo is "running" a horse tonight at CT for the first time. Ive never seen her enter there before. The horse is listed at 4-1. She is currently 1 win for her last 213 starts dating back to 2008. Might be a bet against?

[The Bid]

Only move w hyatt is when he sneak in a firster off that training track. You'll catch him once a meet at Tampa doing it

[Bigsmc]

Originally Posted by The Bid

Only move w hyatt is when he sneak in a firster off that training track. You'll catch him once a meet at Tampa doing it

http://www.equibase.com/static/chart...41011USA11.pdf

[Seattleallstar]

Scott Lake, Mark Shuman, Gerald Bennett, Jamie Ness

[The Bid]

Bigs that's his second of the meet. You gotta watch him
on that move

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Kreiser's only two starters at Penn last night - both in the same race - ran 1st and 2nd and made up a $42.60 exacta. The winner paid $13.80

http://www1.drf.com/drfPDFChartRaces...=20110412&RN=5

The winner had run Beyers of 12 and 33 - for a 17% trainer - in his previous two starts before joining the Kreiser machine. In this 3 starts for Kreiser, He's now run a 47, 58, and probably in the 60's last night. Now 2 wins and a seconds in his three starts since joining Kreiser.

[The Bid]

Tid

do u have the number for the hopeless horse maker ran at twp on closing day. His name was Plymouth bay. He had been beaten about 80 in his previous 4 before moving barns. Coming from Penn Natl

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by The Bid

Tid

do u have the number for the hopeless horse maker ran at twp on closing day. His name was Plymouth bay. He had been beaten about 80 in his previous 4 before moving barns. Coming from Penn Natl

71
about the same as he was running in his previous synthetic starts.
his previous 4 synthtic starts-69, 72, 66, 69
the dirt strts-33,43,7,32

[The Bid]

Thanks

[MISTERGEE]

after seeing this at CRC today the greatest trainer of all times is Nick Canani. Claims a horse for 30 k then first race back breaks the track record by 3/5ths after going 1:08 2/5 for 6f and draws away to win by about 10!!!!!!