150 years ago today...

[Danzig]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42547375/ns/us_news/



honestly, i'm surprised no one already started a thread about this....surely i'm not the only history buff here?
at any rate, i'm in the midst of shelby foote's 3 volumes about the civil war, with the siege of vicksburg about to commence....i recommend the books to anyone with a slight interest or a love of reading.

a somber day. whenever i visit a civil war battlefield, the word that most comes to mind is poignant. it's a shame it had to come to war; reading that 600,000 were lost to settle differences is mind-boggling, and a crying shame. hopefully, we learn from our past.

[otisotisotis]

poignant indeed.
and very nice of ancestry.com to give free access to civil war records until thursday. As you read about the seige of Vicksburg, know that I had a direct descendant captured just before @ Big Black, then his father captured July 4 @ Vicksburg. The elder was paroled, captured at a later battle, and died of starvation as a p.o.w.. Hope to get to Annapolis one day to visit him. The irony is that he enlisted as a substitute for a drafted wealthy businessman....some things remain the same.

[rpncaine]

Going to Gettysburg tomarrow. Total History buff and can't wait to stand at the Clump of Trees and imagine Pickett's division marching toward us. Watched the repeat of Ken Burn's "The Civil War" this week to get immersed in the moment.

[Danzig]

quite a few northern soldiers were there as a result of being paid to take another persons' place. also, i read that the only man executed after the war for war crimes was the man in charge of andersonville prison...over 12000 men died there.
i've been to vicksburg, gettysburg, shiloh, manassas, pea ridge. going to chattanooga and chickamauga in august. some day chancellorsville and antietam-the house where stonewall died after chancellorsville is still there, but not open to many.


also, the conspirator opens friday-about mary surratt. i've been to where her house still stands; also travelled the route that john wilkes booth took after the assassination-also been to dr. mudd's. of course, it helped that i grew up near there. fascination, amazing...you look at maps showing how the armies travelled-no wonder they went thru shoes like crazy!

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by rpncaine

Going to Gettysburg tomarrow. Total History buff and can't wait to stand at the Clump of Trees and imagine Pickett's division marching toward us. Watched the repeat of Ken Burn's "The Civil War" this week to get immersed in the moment.

Gettysburg is a great place to visit... have fun!

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Danzig

also, the conspirator opens friday-about mary surratt. i've been to where her house still stands; also travelled the route that john wilkes booth took after the assassination-!

did you take a rowboat over the river??

(sorry I was watching the John Wilkes Booth special on History Channel the other night)

I've been to Mudd's house also.... I think he was innocent.

[GenuineRisk]

Link to the secession statements from Georgia, Mississippi, South Carolina and Texas. Useful reading when dealing with people who insist the war was not fought over slavery:

http://sunsite.utk.edu/civil-war/reasons.html

Money quote (from Texas):
"We hold as undeniable truths that the governments of the various States, and of the confederacy itself, were established exclusively by the white race, for themselves and their posterity; that the African race had no agency in their establishment; that they were rightfully held and regarded as an inferior and dependent race, and in that condition only could their existence in this country be rendered beneficial or tolerable.

That in this free government *all white men are and of right ought to be entitled to equal civil and political rights* [emphasis in the original]; that the servitude of the African race, as existing in these States, is mutually beneficial to both bond and free, and is abundantly authorized and justified by the experience of mankind, and the revealed will of the Almighty Creator, as recognized by all Christian nations; while the destruction of the existing relations between the two races, as advocated by our sectional enemies, would bring inevitable calamities upon both and desolation upon the fifteen slave-holding states."

[hi_im_god]

an unfortunate intoduction on this video but it contains the entirety of sullivan ballou's amazing letter which wrapped up episode 1 of ken burn's civil war.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa2hv8U8cWU

[OldDog]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

an unfortunate intoduction on this video but it contains the entirety of sullivan ballou's amazing letter which wrapped up episode 1 of ken burn's civil war.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa2hv8U8cWU

Thanks for the link. I saw that again (I've lost count) as PBS re-aired Ken Burns' series recently, and it is without a doubt one of its most poignant segments.

Alongside it on youtube I saw this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBghmvRMluY

Shelby Foote, in my opinion, made Ken Burns' documentary. I can think of no better voice, both in knowledge and delivery, to tell about the Civil War.

[trackrat59]

I love Civil War history. I tend to focus on the Confederate and Union Cavalry. I'm lucky to be in and around a lot of good Civil War historical sites of significance. I’m only about an hour from Gettysburg in MD.

The best was, once I did a guided ride on horseback around the battlefields of Gettysburg. We rode Pickett’s Charge and all that good stuff. It was a four hour ride. I figured it would be smart to take my "quiet" horse on this ride.

I had fun but my horse could not get outta there fast enough due to the cannons going off, and the double-decker buses giving tours. The best was when we rode by the super-duper large tarp flapping in the wind over one of the larger monuments that was being refurbished at the time. That about did us both in.

[OldDog]

Originally Posted by trackrat59

I love Civil War history. I tend to focus on the Confederate and Union Cavalry. I'm lucky to be in and around a lot of good Civil War historical sites of significance. I’m only about an hour from Gettysburg in MD.

The best was, once I did a guided ride on horseback around the battlefields of Gettysburg. We rode Pickett’s Charge and all that good stuff. It was a four hour ride.

I had fun but my horse could not get outta there fast enough due to the cannons going off, and the double-decker buses giving tours. The best was when we rode by the super-duper large tarp flapping in the wind over one of the larger monuments that was being refurbished at the time. That about did us both in.

Civil war sites on horseback -- it doesn't get much better than that.

I worked a job for a while that was adjacent to an old railroad right of way, the tracks of which were torn up years ago. I checked around and found that it was the Charleston & Savannah RR, a vital link between the cities and the object of a number of skirmishes and battles until the Union took Savannah and soon after that the railroad. Although the ROW goes through a lot of private property, it's amazing just how much of it is still visible. Many of the bridges remain. I've walked several miles of it, much of it barely above the swamps it crosses. I can't imagine being a foot soldier in the area, especially in the summertime. At one point, a two-lane highway bridge goes over the old railbed. The bridge was built after the tracks had been torn up, yet the state still built it to a height such that railcars could pass under it with ample clearance. Perhaps they were thinking that the South might rise again.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Link to the secession statements from Georgia, Mississippi, South Carolina and Texas. Useful reading when dealing with people who insist the war was not fought over slavery:

http://sunsite.utk.edu/civil-war/reasons.html

Money quote (from Texas):
"We hold as undeniable truths that the governments of the various States, and of the confederacy itself, were established exclusively by the white race, for themselves and their posterity; that the African race had no agency in their establishment; that they were rightfully held and regarded as an inferior and dependent race, and in that condition only could their existence in this country be rendered beneficial or tolerable.

That in this free government *all white men are and of right ought to be entitled to equal civil and political rights* [emphasis in the original]; that the servitude of the African race, as existing in these States, is mutually beneficial to both bond and free, and is abundantly authorized and justified by the experience of mankind, and the revealed will of the Almighty Creator, as recognized by all Christian nations; while the destruction of the existing relations between the two races, as advocated by our sectional enemies, would bring inevitable calamities upon both and desolation upon the fifteen slave-holding states."

one need only read the confedarate constitution to know it was most definitely about slavery...


i haven't seen the ken burns fims, but if shelby foote spoke like he wrote, then i've missed something!
i read shermans' memoirs after visiting shiloh, fantastic writing. not boring at all, and with a dry sense of humor. another book for those who want to read about that era.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

did you take a rowboat over the river??

(sorry I was watching the John Wilkes Booth special on History Channel the other night)

I've been to Mudd's house also.... I think he was innocent.

lol no, i just remember country roads and brown signs.

[trackrat59]

If anyone is looking for a great read, check out Confederates In The Attic by Tony Horwitz.

One review of the book said; "The Civil War rages across the South in ways both quirky and compelling."

I couldn't put this book down when I first read it. Laughed my butt off.

It's not historical, just lots of fun.

[trackrat59]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

did you take a rowboat over the river??

(sorry I was watching the John Wilkes Booth special on History Channel the other night)

I've been to Mudd's house also.... I think he was innocent.

I went to visit John Wilkes Booth's grave in Baltimore. He's buried at Green Mount Cemetery in Baltimore City. (enter at your own risk) People leave Lincoln Head pennies all over his headstone.

[hi_im_god]

i'm a little jealous of the east coast posters for their easy access to these sites. i biked the c and o towpath a few years back and rode through harper's ferry on the way to cumberland. i know we were within shouting distance of more than one battlefield but that wasn't the focus. i regret the hurry now

and danzig, you're a more dedicated reader than i was if you finish foote's trilogy. i knocked off the first volume and then skimmed the last two. i love history but was a "c" student. shelby's a little dense with information at times. but when i go back to it, i read the vicksburg campaign from volume 2. you're at the best part.

[Danzig]

i thoroughly enjoyed book one...angry right now that i haven't had time to get much into book two. have been sick for about a week, so i'm behind on a lot of stuff right now except for work.
the vicksburg seige took six weeks, so i figure it'll take up several chapters. and of course there's gettysburg.

and yes, it does help having grown up near so many historical sites. manassas, richmond, d.c., fredericksburg, etc. and of course revolution sites i've been lucky enough to go to, my favorite being yorktown. managed a trip to camden,sc a few years back-awesome stuff, including the jail where a young andrew jackson was locked up for fighting against king and country! jamestown, williamsburg..mt vernon-many times. if you ever get a chance to go to d.c. and the surrounding area, go! you will not regret it. too much history to skip.

now...if i can just get tony to drive me to new york.

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i thoroughly enjoyed book one...angry right now that i haven't had time to get much into book two. have been sick for about a week, so i'm behind on a lot of stuff right now except for work.
the vicksburg seige took six weeks, so i figure it'll take up several chapters. and of course there's gettysburg.

and yes, it does help having grown up near so many historical sites. manassas, richmond, d.c., fredericksburg, etc. and of course revolution sites i've been lucky enough to go to, my favorite being yorktown. managed a trip to camden,sc a few years back-awesome stuff, including the jail where a young andrew jackson was locked up for fighting against king and country! jamestown, williamsburg..mt vernon-many times. if you ever get a chance to go to d.c. and the surrounding area, go! you will not regret it. too much history to skip.

now...if i can just get tony to drive me to new york.

the siege took six weeks but before that grant had to figure a way around the cliffs on the mississippi to set up the siege. the campaign to set up the siege is the great part. once the siege started there wasn't really any doubt about the result.

i sit here imagining almost all of derby trail nation yawning and wondering why we're not pm'ing.

screw them.

[rpncaine]

Sitting in my hotel room in Gettysburg right now. Two very nice days of weather coming up and looking forward to walking around the battlefield. Wish I could get the family to do the horseback thing but my son had a bad experiance with the horses in the Boy Scouts and won't go near them!
Big thing around here right now is the attempt to bring in a CASINO. Will be interesting to hear how that plays out too.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

the siege took six weeks but before that grant had to figure a way around the cliffs on the mississippi to set up the siege. the campaign to set up the siege is the great part. once the siege started there wasn't really any doubt about the result.

i sit here imagining almost all of derby trail nation yawning and wondering why we're not pm'ing.

screw them.

i plan to go to arkansas post in july when my husband goes fishing for the wknd with his father and siblings.

as for the siege, grant just had his 7th unsuccessful plan to find a way into vicksburg. i've been to the military park a few times, the last time was a hike. 17 miles in a day! i won't do that again...anyway, we climbed up the side of a hill and found a marker at the top which stated that they hauled two cannon up to the top of this hill to start another point of bombardment. hell, we could barely get ourselves up there without carrying a thing. unreal. and of course there are houses with cannonballs still in the wall. most of the citizenry dug caves in the hillsides and lived there thoughout the siege, since the houses were so unsafe.