You Guys are Too Hard on Funny

letswastemoney · #1 09-03-2006, 05:35 PM

Okay maybe he was overmatched in the Woodward.

But still if you are going to knock Funny Cide's attempt at a Grade 1, then you have to give the SAME attention to Naughty New Yorker, Flower Alley, and Suave (didn't Suave finished DEAD last?). I don't see anyone saying Suave is finished.

Although some did mention Naughty New Yorker shouldn't be in the race, he wasn't given nearly the same amount of criticism as Funny Cide got from some of you.

Oh yes and of course Flower Alley must be injured, but not Funny Cide oh no. It's because Funny Cide must suck.

I'm not saying Flower Alley is not injured, but there's always a possibility he just doesn't want to run anymore. Maybe the long layoff has made him lazy.

Also I think it's great that everyone remembers Funny's Derby and Preakness wins, but nobody ever seems to recall he is the 2004 Jockey Club Gold Cup Winner.

I mean if we must knock every decision the owners of Funny Cide make, then where does it stop? Why not elimate all G3 type horses from ever attempting a G1 again? Better yet why not limit G1 races to just the "super horses" like Bernardini and Invasor and make short little 4 or 5 horse "super" fields. The rest of the field must not have a chance right?

I just think all of you act like Funny Cide is your horse and everyone must know what's right for him but the owners. They gave it a shot and it didn't work out. That's all.

Danzig · #2 09-03-2006, 07:38 PM

yeah, he's the '04 jcgc winner...that being two years ago. we all appreciate funny cide...we just tend to see him more realistically than his owners do. i'd rather he be a winner in races such as the one at woodbine, than him finishing up the track yesterday. he's a mulitiple gr winner, we all know that...but he's not quite that level anymore. he's still a stakes performer, he just can't perform well at the highest level. that's not being mean, it's the truth.
if the same is true for flower alley, so be it. doesn't mean he's a bad horse, just not at the top of the game.

to be honest, i questioned why nny was in there....suave, no...he won his last--and if you read his pp's, there's no reason to panic based on yesterdays performance.

any horse can and most likely will throw in a clunker now and then. witness bro derek yesterday--that's why you don't bet a huge chalky fave when he's vulnerable, and first time off a layoff, they're vulnerable!

BUT, funny cide didn't suffer an afleet alex/lung infection type thing yesterday, he's just not a gr 1 performer anymore.

it's a shame that some here tend to only read, or glean certain things from this board. most responses to funnys race was much like what i just said, keep him in smaller stakes where he can win. we all know a horse likes to win, esp those who have done so in the past.

Suffolk Shippers · #3 09-03-2006, 09:10 PM

I think the majority opinion on this board is that Funny Cide is NOT done and people are generally not hard on the horse himself. The ones who SHOULD be taken to task are the owners in Sackatoga Stables.

The horse is about to be seven years old, he is a gutsy, dual classic champion. He gave fans of the sports and non fans a common cheering interest because of the "feel good" story. He created alot of new fans in horse racing, who have stuck around to watch the last few years. Funny Cide should be championed for those reasons, and I think, by and large he is.
He has his detractors, as do most people, horses, etc. However, at the end of the day, even detractors cannot dispute his spirited run from March-June 2003, from the Wood battle with Empire Maker to the Derby and through the Preakness and Belmont. He was a revered horse, especially to New Yorkers, who turned out 100,000+ on a dismal day of rain and cool weather.

You also cannot dispute that since that point, he hasn't been a top horse in almost any regard. That's not necessarily a bad thing. Not every horse is a Secretariat, Spectacular Bid, Ghostzapper, etc. The biggest push against Funny Cide is lovers of the game saw a very rare oppourtunity to have a horse for the ages, because he couldn't be taken to the breeding shed. Just because he hasn't been that horse, should not be held against him. He should be recognized as someone who gave a riveting shot to the arm to a game that could always use one and not a super horse. I think alot of us on this board, and elsewhere, realize that.

Unfortunately, Sackatoga Stables does not. Funny Cide has not had the juice to run grade I handicap races at all recently, and had no business in the Woodward yesterday. Personally, I found it very upsetting to see a horse who brough so much life to the game, having such difficulty in a race. Sackatoga needs to realize that this horse cannot handle this kind of regimen and running him is not fun to watch in those spots. True fans of this horse would likely be happy seeing him in NY bred restricted stakes for as long as he can handle it, with an occassional jump up to a weakly drawn G3 race. Some (myself included) would be happy to see him led out to pasture to live a quiet life away from the track. He may be a snappy old gelding, but I bet fans would love the chance to go and meet him, get to feed him a carrot or something like that. Sackatoga, there are ways to keep Funny Cide's legacy going, but you should be aware, that legacy is not in G1 or 2 handicap races.
It just isn't.

Funny Cide isn't done by any means. We all just wish the people who make the decisions for him understood his first string days are long finished and he should be handled gracefully and not in a classless fashion, as Sackatoga is doing now.

AeWingnut · #4 09-03-2006, 09:13 PM

The top horses in that race were vulnerable. You never know until you run 'em

I like Funny Cide

I imagine he'll be given a break and go bak to Grade 3
just like me

Danzig · #5 09-03-2006, 09:14 PM

i second that post! definitely correct, most of us don't have problems with horses, it's with the handling.

no trainer gets more praise than one who knows how to spot a horse properly.
and no owner gets more than one who lets the horseman train the horse! that's what you're paying him for.

sumitas · #6 09-03-2006, 10:09 PM

Maybe FC had allergy problems kick in during the race. He was in a super position to challenge coming out of the far turn and dropped back rapidly. There has to be a reason for that and I do not believe it is that he is finished. I'm hoping to hear what his barn found out.

letswastemoney · #7 09-03-2006, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suffolk Shippers

I think the majority opinion on this board is that Funny Cide is NOT done and people are generally not hard on the horse himself. The ones who SHOULD be taken to task are the owners in Sackatoga Stables.

The horse is about to be seven years old, he is a gutsy, dual classic champion. He gave fans of the sports and non fans a common cheering interest because of the "feel good" story. He created alot of new fans in horse racing, who have stuck around to watch the last few years. Funny Cide should be championed for those reasons, and I think, by and large he is.
He has his detractors, as do most people, horses, etc. However, at the end of the day, even detractors cannot dispute his spirited run from March-June 2003, from the Wood battle with Empire Maker to the Derby and through the Preakness and Belmont. He was a revered horse, especially to New Yorkers, who turned out 100,000+ on a dismal day of rain and cool weather.

You also cannot dispute that since that point, he hasn't been a top horse in almost any regard. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

I really don't think you can look at Funny Cide's 2004 season and not have considered him one of the top horses. In addition to his JCGC, he barely lost by a head in the 04 Suburban. Every single beyer figure in his 04 season was from 102 to 112.

In fact, I'd say Funny Cide was a better and more consistent runner at 4 than 3. He faced the top horses in the world for the whole year and always hit the board except for the Breeders Cup Classic.

I also agree with the other poster that said the Woodward was weakly drawn. He wasn't going against Invasor or Bernardini. He was up against a suspect group of off form horses like Flower Alley and Second of June.

I'm saying that lower quality stakes horses take their shot at Grade 1s all the time and nobody thinks about it. But because it's Funny Cide it gets more attention.

Suffolk Shippers · #8 09-03-2006, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by letswastemoney

I really don't think you can look at Funny Cide's 2004 season and not have considered him one of the top horses. In addition to his JCGC, he barely lost by a head in the 04 Suburban. Every single beyer figure in his 04 season was from 102 to 112.

In fact, I'd say Funny Cide was a better and more consistent runner at 4 than 3. He faced the top horses in the world for the whole year and always hit the board except for the Breeders Cup Classic.

I also agree with the other poster that said the Woodward was weakly drawn. He wasn't going against Invasor or Bernardini. He was up against a suspect group of off form horses like Flower Alley and Second of June.

I'm saying that lower quality stakes horses take their shot at Grade 1s all the time and nobody thinks about it. But because it's Funny Cide it gets more attention.

He definately was a top runner in his 4 yr old season. Although the JCGC was weak that year, he did win and did post those figures you cite. I was basing my post more on his 5 and 6 yr old seasons. You can almost throw his 5 yr old year out, too...he was banged up I believe.

sumitas · #9 09-03-2006, 11:35 PM

His 5 yr old season he ran 3 races and he had a bad back. his 4 yr old season, his best, he ran all 0s and -1s. this year he's put up 3 0s on the sheets. so he's a little slower than he was at 4 but he had a shot in the Woodward.

Revolution · #10 09-04-2006, 12:53 PM

i do not think he ran his race. i think he is grade 2 horse but i can not knock them for trying. tagg though did not seem to want to run in the woodward.

Danzig · #11 09-04-2006, 01:05 PM

excerpts from the albany times union:

He (funny cide) hadn't run in a Grade I race in 14 months, and the result then essentially was the same, a 19-length blowout loss in the Suburban Handicap.

"I don't think he belongs in Grade I's, no," Tagg said.

Funny Cide was supposed to head to Illinois to run in the Grade II, $500,000 Hawthorne Gold Cup. That now seems highly unlikely. Tagg wants to run the horse in New York-bred races, where he can compete.

---just remember what the trainer said next time funny cide gets put in over his head...it won't be taggs idea, that's for sure.

sumitas · #12 09-04-2006, 02:51 PM

also from the times-union
"... take a look at Funny Cide's pre-Woodward workouts. He had two of them, and he trained like a champ, with two bullet works in the past three weeks. He's still a big, robust animal who looks full of himself and ready to run all day."

i'm still waiting for an evaluation as to why he stopped like he did during the Woodward.

horseofcourse · #13 09-04-2006, 03:12 PM

In essence, I think Funny Cide ran his race. If the Beyer was really 111 for Premium Tap, Funny Cide's was in the low 90s which isn't really far from his normal effort this year...mainly mid-upper 90s and one plus 100 effort in the Excelsior. And 80s in the Mr Prospector and GPH. I cant' fault the owners for running this race. They want to run in Saratoga and they did. But in his 8 races this year, 6 of them have been grade 3s, restricted or allowance races. It is not like they are stepping him up every single race.

HIs good races this year have been when he has gotten a clear lead. He does not do well when he doesn't. When he steps up like the Woodward and GPH and the horses are too good where he can't get a clear lead he struggles mightily. Not that the Woodward was a great field...which is another reason Funny Cide entered...no Invasor etc. Running against Nolan's Cat, Arch Hall, Crytpgraph, Summer Book, Gold and Roses is not the same as Premium Tap, Sun King, Second of June, Flower Alley.

And he wasn't the only one with a bad finish. If you said before the race funny Cide would finish a head back of Flower Alley and 2 lengths ahead of Suave...you would be saying that is probably a top 3 or 4 finish for sure.

But in reality, the effort was not far from his regular efforts this year...just a better field in the race which made it look worse.

Danzig · #14 09-04-2006, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sumitas

also from the times-union
"... take a look at Funny Cide's pre-Woodward workouts. He had two of them, and he trained like a champ, with two bullet works in the past three weeks. He's still a big, robust animal who looks full of himself and ready to run all day."

i'm still waiting for an evaluation as to why he stopped like he did during the Woodward.

he's always worked well....

dunno why he stopped, or the two behind him either.....probably nothing but faster horses in front. since you read the story, you know tagg said he came back ok, not lame or anything.

holiday wknd, maybe updates tomorrow. haven't seen much new stuff out yet anywhere.
maybe it's time to look again.

Danzig · #15 09-04-2006, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

In essence, I think Funny Cide ran his race. If the Beyer was really 111 for Premium Tap, Funny Cide's was in the low 90s which isn't really far from his normal effort this year...mainly mid-upper 90s and one plus 100 effort in the Excelsior. And 80s in the Mr Prospector and GPH. I cant' fault the owners for running this race. They want to run in Saratoga and they did. But in his 8 races this year, 6 of them have been grade 3s, restricted or allowance races. It is not like they are stepping him up every single race.

HIs good races this year have been when he has gotten a clear lead. He does not do well when he doesn't. When he steps up like the Woodward and GPH and the horses are too good where he can't get a clear lead he struggles mightily. Not that the Woodward was a great field...which is another reason Funny Cide entered...no Invasor etc. Running against Nolan's Cat, Arch Hall, Crytpgraph, Summer Book, Gold and Roses is not the same as Premium Tap, Sun King, Second of June, Flower Alley.

And he wasn't the only one with a bad finish. If you said before the race funny Cide would finish a head back of Flower Alley and 2 lengths ahead of Suave...you would be saying that is probably a top 3 or 4 finish for sure.

But in reality, the effort was not far from his regular efforts this year...just a better field in the race which made it look worse.

you just made a lot of peoples' point! his efforts are usually good for a win in lesser comp...a win is better than a loss against better, isn't it? having a stakes winner is everyone's dream. he's a stakes winner, and can win many more, if spotted correctly.

my miss storm cat · #16 09-13-2006, 08:49 PM

So he's going in the Brooklyn this weekend.....

Good idea? Bad? What do you all think?

From DRF...

Funny Cide in Brooklyn off short rest
By DAVID GRENING
ELMONT, N.Y. - Having gotten little out of his race in the Grade 1 Woodward at Saratoga and with nothing seemingly amiss physically, Funny Cide will wheel back on short notice in Saturday's Grade 2, $150,000 Brooklyn Breeders' Cup Handicap at Belmont Park.
Cornelio Velasquez worked Funny Cide five furlongs on Tuesday and though the final time of 1:02.36 was slower than the gelding normally works, Velasquez told trainer Barclay Tagg that everything went well.

"I had him in the Kentucky Horse Park by the time he got to the gap, but when I got back to the barn [Velasquez] he was so excited," Tagg said. "I said to him 'What's wrong with him?' He said, 'I just eased up on him, the race is on Saturday.' "

Tagg said Velasquez would ride Funny Cide in the Brooklyn, replacing Richard Migliore who had ridden Funny Cide in his last five starts.

"It has nothing to do with Migliore at all," Tagg said. "We're just trying everything different, wondering if a change would make a difference. He looks good, he's feeling good, he's acting good."

The last time Funny Cide ran back on two weeks' rest, he won the Preakness following his victory in the Kentucky Derby.

The Brooklyn doesn't figure to come up with as strong a field the Woodward. Among those being pointed to the race are Wanderin Boy, Good Reward, Awesome Twist, We Can Seek, and Reverberate.

Tagg also nominated Auguri to the Brooklyn, but the 5-year-old Argentine-bred is not Breeders' Cup- nominated, meaning he would be running for only $100,000. Since Auguri prefers distances longer than 1 1/8 miles, he will be pointed to the $100,000 Kelso Stakes at Delaware on Sept. 30. The Kelso is run at 1 3/16 miles.

sumitas · #17 09-13-2006, 09:00 PM

If he feels good, looks good, vets good, go for it. The Woodward has to be a throw out.

hoovesupsideyourhead · #18 09-13-2006, 09:28 PM

we joked on funny cide poster day at toga..'YA GOT NO SHHHOT BOY" ..ateam..

Chestnut Gal · #19 09-13-2006, 10:14 PM

I hope he does well. Funny Cide
usually does better when he doesn't
have a long lay off.Hopefully I will
get to the track to see him. Did
I miss something, why is Mig being
replaced? I thought he did well with
Funny. Most important, may all come
back safe and sound.
Go Funny Cide!!