Cash for Clunkers Success

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Okay, I'll try one more time:

"I am seriously clueless as to what you guys (Cannon, Dell, Zig) want done fiscally by any administration in power now. How about this:

No healthcare reform at all, no new programs at all.

Ignore the recession/depression, zero government interference.

That leaves us with the massive debt we were saddled with by Bush. How shall we pay for it? Income tax increases?"

Do you guys agree with no new programs at all? Yes or no?

Do you agree with zero government interference with the economy? Yes or no?

How do you want to pay for the massive debt we already have today, leftover from the past? Tax raises, or cutting current services? Which services should be cut?

To use the words of your man Barney Frank, "arguing with you is like arguing with a kitchen table."

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Riot

Okay, I'll try one more time:

"I am seriously clueless as to what you guys (Cannon, Dell, Zig) want done fiscally by any administration in power now. How about this:

No healthcare reform at all, no new programs at all.
we need reform badly, but what the Democrats are pushing for we do not need. Republicans have offered several reasonable alternatives that nobody is paying any attention to.

Ignore the recession/depression, zero government interference.
Much less interference in the private sector. no more bailouts and propping up of dead zombie companies and banks.

That leaves us with the massive debt we were saddled with by Bush. How shall we pay for it? Income tax increases?"
quit trying to blame everything on Bush, except for a few years in the nineties with a Republican majority,congress has been on a spending spree for decades. We have to CUT! and I mean government, all departments, all benefits. we CANNOT pay this bill with tax increases. It will be cuts and/or inflation to pay the debt.

Do you guys agree with no new programs at all? Yes! no new programs. In fact there are programs that should be eliminated or no?

Do you agree with zero government interference with the economy? Yes or no? government should leave as small a footprint as possible.

How do you want to pay for the massive debt we already have today, leftover from the past? Tax raises, or cutting current services? Which services should be cut?
Like I said, we must cut, government has been growing unabated in good times and bad. how long can that happen before it chokes all the oxygen out of the system? we're seeing it now.

for a lifelong Republican you ask some pretty strange questions.

what are your ideas? let me guess, no cuts, more government programs and higher taxes will balance the budget?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

for a lifelong Republican you ask some pretty strange questions.

what are your ideas? let me guess, no cuts, more government programs and higher taxes will balance the budget?

No, those are not my ideas. You might consider that not all Republicans are as far-right ultra-conservative as you. The party of inclusion, don'tcha know

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

To use the words of your man Barney Frank, "arguing with you is like arguing with a kitchen table."

Do you think it's more difficult than trying to debate with someone who thinks the President of the United States is secretly an illegal alien?

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Do you think it's more difficult than trying to debate with someone who thinks the President of the United States is secretly an illegal alien?

I don't think he is illegal but do think it's suspicious he's spent millions in legal fees to fight the release of it. If a little leaguer has to produce his (not someone who says he saw it) why not a President? Race? Father Name? America wants to know or at least I do.

And you were all in when Obama was going to use wasted medicaid money to finance a chunk of BS Health Care and now he plans to expand it?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

I don't think he is illegal but do think it's suspicious he's spent millions in legal fees to fight the release of it. If a little leaguer has to produce his (not someone who says he saw it) why not a President? Race? Father Name? America wants to know or at least I do.

And you were all in when Obama was going to use wasted medicaid money to finance a chunk of BS Health Care and now he plans to expand it?

Did you know that a poll last week showed that 75% of FoxNews viewers really believe there will be government death panels killing grandma?

PS - and you might read up on what that "expansion" thing really involves.

PPS - "millions in legal fees" ??? LOL!

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

PS - and you might read up on what that "expansion" thing really involves.

!

Did that 4 days ago unless we're back to plan A or is it B or ????

PS I know the Wall Street Journal (Neocon, racist, biggoted, heartless, biased rag)

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125072573848144647.html

and to think part of the logic why we're supposed to accept this is because the Post Office doesn't suck that bad!

Get served slow at the post office you may get a late charge, get served slow by government health care and you may be dead. Get that logic?

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Did you know that a poll last week showed that 75% of FoxNews viewers really believe there will be government death panels killing grandma?!

Really? Do you just arbitrarily make up numbers or add numbers together to get to a number you like?

[dalakhani]

Interesting article on cash for clunkers. A decided libertarian bent to the column but still interesting reading and I thought it was pretty fair:

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/08...y5262084.shtml

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Interesting article on cash for clunkers. A decided libertarian bent to the column but still interesting reading and I thought it was pretty fair:

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/08...y5262084.shtml

It was a good article and when numbers are broken down so is Riot & Co.'s euphoria.

For 3 Billion Dollars we save a little under a half's day fuel allotment and a little more than 2hrs out of a year in greenhouse gases? And the saving of the 2hrs per YEAR in greenhouse gas reduction will start 2 1/2 years after delivery of the auto to compensate for gases created in its production?

Heck it would have been to stupid to fall for the con of buying air but would have cost only $32 million to buy the carbon credits or $320 million for 10yrs the average life of the cars of this programme. We could have put the almost 90% of the $3 billon back in the bank to offset the $29.4 million we lose per year in gasoline tax revenue presuming it remains at 18.4 cents/gallon.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

It was a good article and when numbers are broken down so is Riot & Co.'s euphoria.

For 3 Billion Dollars we save a little under a half's day fuel allotment and a little more than 2hrs out of a year in greenhouse gases? And the saving of the 2hrs per YEAR in greenhouse gas reduction will start 2 1/2 years after delivery of the auto to compensate for gases created in its production?

Heck it would have been to stupid to fall for the con of buying air but would have cost only $32 million to buy the carbon credits or $320 million for 10yrs the average life of the cars of this programme. We could have put the almost 90% of the $3 billon back in the bank to offset the $29.4 million we lose per year in gasoline tax revenue presuming it remains at 18.4 cents/gallon.

The article does concede that it is a successful program on some levels. I don't think that can be argued. The degree of that success obviously can.

My take? Its stimulus. It helped get some people off of the sideline at a time when the auto industry needed a jump start (no pun intended). I could post another article with a greener bent to it and it would provide stats that show the ecological benefits of the program ad nauseum. Any way you look at it, its something.

There is no silver bullet. This is one of many programs that will be thrown out there to help the economy recover. I applaud the efforts of the government.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

There is no silver bullet. This is one of many programs that will be thrown out there to help the economy recover. I applaud the efforts of the government.

The success is modest at best and the amount of economic recovery is that is created by similar (right now imaginary) programs will also be modest at best. This program is the Eugenio Velez of govt programs. Looks great briefly but in the end doesnt really do much.

Hooray Beer!

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Really? Do you just arbitrarily make up numbers or add numbers together to get to a number you like?

NBC News poll, go look it up

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

NBC News poll, go look it up

You don't think I already did?

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

Did you know that a poll last week showed that 75% of FoxNews viewers really believe there will be government death panels killing grandma? LOL!

"The poll, which surveyed 1,003 adults August 14-17, found that 50% of Americans do not believe that the "death panels" claim is true, while 30% do. The number of people who believe the claim jumps to 45% among regular viewers of Fox News, while the number who don't believe the claim drops to 30%."

Like I said your numbers are a little off as usual.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

You don't think I already did?

No, you obviously didn't, or you wouldn't have accused me of making it up.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

No, you obviously didn't, or you wouldn't have accused me of making it up.

See above and get back to me LMAO

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

No, you obviously didn't, or you wouldn't have accused me of making it up.

You know the part where I quoted the poll. This

"The poll, which surveyed 1,003 adults August 14-17, found that 50% of Americans do not believe that the "death panels" claim is true, while 30% do. The number of people who believe the claim jumps to 45% among regular viewers of Fox News, while the number who don't believe the claim drops to 30%."

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Did that 4 days ago unless we're back to plan A or is it B or ????

PS I know the Wall Street Journal (Neocon, racist, biggoted, heartless, biased rag)

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125072573848144647.html

and to think part of the logic why we're supposed to accept this is because the Post Office doesn't suck that bad!

Get served slow at the post office you may get a late charge, get served slow by government health care and you may be dead. Get that logic?

The above makes perfect sense

Try again: you said Obama was expanding the healthcare plan. I asked you what you meant. You posted the above as response. The article you quote from WSJ has nothing about expanding the healthcare plan in it, it discusses the various aspects of the various bills, how they might split it to get it through, etc.

So what do you mean by "expanding the healthcare plan" ?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

See above and get back to me LMAO

You are right, the correct phrase is 75% of those that believe in death panels get their news from Fox News.

Thanks