When "Neighborhood Watch" Gets Out of Hand

[pointman]

Originally Posted by jms62

justice

I don't want to suggest that all prosecutors are bad, I have worked with very sensible prosecutors who try to do the right thing. Undoubtedly, the majority of those arrested for crimes are guilty of the crime or some lessor offense.

The problem generally comes from the top of the prosecutor's office and the win at all costs attidute. I have seen assistant prosecutors get fired for doing the right thing and getting rid of cases where they knew the evidence was insufficient for conviction.

Prosecutors love to pass the buck, they have no problem taking a case to trial they know they are going to lose so they can pass the blame, i.e., it was those 12 morons on the jury that let that creep go, I did everything I could, presented the evidence to convict and those idiots ignored it!

The problem gets manifested in a high profile case like this. She has now charged Zimmerman and you can pretty much bet that she is going to go full throttle against him at this point regardless of where the evidence leads. Likely, there is no turning back at this point.

I hope for everyone's sake Zimmerman gets a fair trial and that the evidence dictates the result, not uninformed notions of what people think or want to believe occurred or that that the result be based upon social or political agendas.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

"Zimmerman "profiled" Trayvon is what was said."

They can say whatever they want. Saying it doesn't prove it. They need to prove it.

Yes, exactly. We'll see what she does. She may very well drop to manslaughter. But it doesn't appear she just pulled 2nd degree manslaughter out of her azz as a charge.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by pointman

Conclusions like this are why cases should not be tried in the media and ultimately such asinine assumptions taint potential jury pools.

I've been against trying this case in the media from the start, as you well know, for precisely the reason you stated.

Yeah - it could be that the prosecutor will accept a lesser charge. It could be the prosecutor goes whole hog for a 2nd degree charge. It could be that Zimmerman is found innocent by a jury. It could be the case never gets to trial and a plea is taken.

There are careers to be made here and I am sure that the special prosecutor is chomping at the bit for her 15 minutes in the limelight.

That doesn't seem to go with what the public history about her professionalism has said.

You have the stones to criticize others for stepping into what you claim is your expertise, but have no issue stating your uniformed opinions within the expertise of others.

Get a f.u.c.k.i.n.g. grip. I'm claiming no "expertise" here, I'm talking about it like everyone else.

The more I read your nonsense (and I try to avoid it as much as possible, but since every other post in this section is yours, it is impossible to avoid), the more it becomes clear to me that hypocrites like you and those that think with your warped logic, like your god Obama, are truly the problem with this country today. People like you are trying to make us a third world country.

Oh, poor hate-filled, prejudiced you. "People like you" disgust the majority of us. "People like you" assume what other people are to give yourself justification your hate. "People like you" act like f.u.c.k.i.n.g. spoiled children, unable to tolerate anybody who doesn't think in lockstep with their narrow little minds filled with hate.

You don't like what I post, you don't like my political views, you don't like my opinions, stop throwing out ridiculous accusations about what you imagine I think, and stick your head back up your azz and put me on ignore, rocket scientist. I don't have to suffer your moronic, out-of-nowhere personal attacks. Guess what? Other people don't agree with you. Welcome to f.u.c.k.i.n.g. adulthood. Good luck, you're not dealing with it well.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Riot

Yes, exactly. We'll see what she does. She may very well drop to manslaughter. But it doesn't appear she just pulled 2nd degree manslaughter out of her azz as a charge.

Did you listen to the interview with Dershowitz? He he seems to strongly believe that she, "pulled the 2nd degree charge out of her azz", and he explains why. You should listen to the interview. It's just a 4 minute interview.

Dershowitz may be very liberal but he doesn't always tow the company line. That is what I like about him.

http://realclearpolitics.com/video/2...unethical.html

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Did you listen to the interview with Dershowitz? He he seems to strongly believe that she, "pulled the 2nd degree charge out of her azz", and he explains why. You should listen to the interview. It's just a 4 minute interview.

Dershowitz may be very liberal but he doesn't always tow the company line. That is what I like about him.

If the prosecution can't prove the 2nd degree murder charges, then Zimmerman's attorneys have nothing to fear and should be very happy with the charges: he'll be readily and easily acquitted by a jury.

If they can prove it, Zimmerman's attorneys better start plea-bargaining, no?

The prosecutor doesn't have a reputation for losing many cases, or overstepping. If she had come back with zero charges, I would have been happy that it was looked at carefully, and it's done.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by Riot

I've been against trying this case in the media from the start, as you well know, for precisely the reason you stated.

You claim that you are against trying the case in the media, yet you have jumped on snipits of media reports from one side of the story and formulated opinions calling for the arrest and prosecution of this man based upon those one sided accounts. You clearly have formulated the opinion that he is guilty. Then you question why I call you a hypocrite.

Yeah - it could be that the prosecutor will accept a lesser charge. It could be the prosecutor goes whole hog for a 2nd degree charge. It could be that Zimmerman is found innocent by a jury. It could be the case never gets to trial and a plea is taken.


That doesn't seem to go with what the public history about her professionalism has said.

The limelight makes good people do incredible things. Reputations can be deceiving and garnered from those with a bias towards one side. I'll reserve judgment and form an opinion based upon actions, not reputation.
Get a f.u.c.k.i.n.g. grip. I'm claiming no "expertise" here, I'm talking about it like everyone else.



Oh, poor hate-filled, prejudiced you. "People like you" disgust the majority of us. "People like you" assume what other people are to give yourself justification your hate. "People like you" act like f.u.c.k.i.n.g. spoiled children, unable to tolerate anybody who doesn't think in lockstep with their narrow little minds filled with hate.

You don't like what I post, you don't like my political views, you don't like my opinions, stop throwing out ridiculous accusations about what you imagine I think, and stick your head back up your azz and put me on ignore, rocket scientist. I don't have to suffer your moronic, out-of-nowhere personal attacks. Guess what? Other people don't agree with you. Welcome to f.u.c.k.i.n.g. adulthood. Good luck, you're not dealing with it well.

If you can't see that you are the worst offender of what you accuse me of, neither I or anyone can help you. No one on this board is unable to tolerate dissent from your opinion more than you. I love the accusation of personal attacks through a personal attack. There is no bigger hypocrite on this board than you. I am sorry that I find you and your moronic positions to be what is wrong with this country, but hey, I call it as I see it.

P.S. - I obviously don't know how to quote those sectionally, but my responses to Riots accusations are in red.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Did you listen to the interview with Dershowitz? He he seems to strongly believe that she, "pulled the 2nd degree charge out of her azz", and he explains why. You should listen to the interview. It's just a 4 minute interview.

Dershowitz may be very liberal but he doesn't always tow the company line. That is what I like about him.

http://realclearpolitics.com/video/2...unethical.html

Dershowitz is one of the most respected criminal attorneys in the country. But Riot is an expert in everything, who cares what a distinguished person like Dershowitz thinks.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by pointman

If you can't see that you are the worst offender of what you accuse me of, neither I or anyone can help you. No one on this board is unable to tolerate dissent from your opinion more than you. I love the accusation of personal attacks through a personal attack. There is no bigger hypocrite on this board than you. I am sorry that I find you and your moronic positions to be what is wrong with this country, but hey, I call it as I see it.

YOU are the one who started the personal attack here. You leap from me to your Obama hate to making this a third-world country. Are you prejudiced crazy much? Your little mind whirling with your vivid imaginings of what you assume I must think or mean?

Yeah - I don't take crap personal attacks from idiots like you. Please - stop whining about it when you are confronted for it.

If you can't talk here about the Zimmerman case without personally insulting and attacking other posters, I suggest you go away and sit with the children at the little table.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Riot

If the prosecution can't prove the 2nd degree murder charges, then Zimmerman's attorneys have nothing to fear and should be very happy with the charges: he'll be readily and easily acquitted by a jury.

If they can prove it, Zimmerman's attorneys better start plea-bargaining, no?

The prosecutor doesn't have a reputation for losing many cases, or overstepping. If she had come back with zero charges, I would have been happy that it was looked at carefully, and it's done.

There is probably a 50% chance that the judge will throw out the 2nd degree charge at the arraignment next month. The only reason that there is not a 95% chance is because of the public pressure that will be on the judge not to throw it out. If the judge does throw out the 2nd degree charge, there is still a good chance that the judge would allow the case to go forward on manslaughter charges.

If the judge does not throw out the 2nd degree charge and the case goes to trial, the jury will almost certainly be given a choice of charges. Zimmerman would almost certainly be found not guilty of 2nd degree murder but he could still be found guilty of manslaughter.

There is also the possibility of a plea deal before the case gets to trial.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by Riot

If the prosecution can't prove the 2nd degree murder charges, then Zimmerman's attorneys have nothing to fear and should be very happy with the charges: he'll be readily and easily acquitted by a jury.

If they can prove it, Zimmerman's attorneys better start plea-bargaining, no?

The prosecutor doesn't have a reputation for losing many cases, or overstepping. If she had come back with zero charges, I would have been happy that it was looked at carefully, and it's done.

There is nothing I fear more than overcharged or false charges filed against a client. It is a trap. There is no slam dunk criminal case and people can (and often do) get convicted of crimes they are not guilty of. They only thing that can go wrong in defending a person in this situation is that a grave injustice can occur.

I am not impressed that she does not lose many cases. That is probably more of a sign of a person who wins at all costs as opposed to one who seeks justice.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

There is probably a 50% chance that the judge will throw out the 2nd degree charge at the arraignment next month. The only reason that there is not a 95% chance is because of the public pressure that will be on the judge not to throw it out. If the judge does throw out the 2nd degree charge, there is still a good chance that the judge would allow the case to go forward on manslaughter charges.

If the judge does not throw out the 2nd degree charge and the case goes to trial, the jury will almost certainly be given a choice of charges. Zimmerman would almost certainly be found not guilty of 2nd degree murder but he could still be found guilty of manslaughter.

There is also the possibility of a plea deal before the case gets to trial.

I think that, with the keeping the case sealed as they've done, they are trying to let the public simmer down and get out of it. Meanwhile they work out a plea, and the case never becomes the circus a public trial. Zimmerman's attorney now seems pretty sharp, compared to the two previous ringmasters.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by Riot

YOU are the one who started the personal attack here. You leap from me to your Obama hate to making this a third-world country. Are you prejudiced crazy much? Your little mind whirling with your vivid imaginings of what you assume I must think or mean?

Yeah - I don't take crap personal attacks from idiots like you. Please - stop whining about it when you are confronted for it.

If you can't talk here about the Zimmerman case without personally insulting and attacking other posters, I suggest you go away and sit with the children at the little table.

No one levels more personal attacks on this website than you. Why are you constantly fighting with and belitting numerous posters who disagree wit you while I am not? In this thread alone you have gone after at least 4 or 5 posters who disagreed with you. Get a grip, you are the problem not me.

You do not set the parameters as to when and what I post on here.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by pointman

I don't want to suggest that all prosecutors are bad, I have worked with very sensible prosecutors who try to do the right thing. Undoubtedly, the majority of those arrested for crimes are guilty of the crime or some lessor offense.

The problem generally comes from the top of the prosecutor's office and the win at all costs attidute. I have seen assistant prosecutors get fired for doing the right thing and getting rid of cases where they knew the evidence was insufficient for conviction.

Prosecutors love to pass the buck, they have no problem taking a case to trial they know they are going to lose so they can pass the blame, i.e., it was those 12 morons on the jury that let that creep go, I did everything I could, presented the evidence to convict and those idiots ignored it!

The problem gets manifested in a high profile case like this. She has now charged Zimmerman and you can pretty much bet that she is going to go full throttle against him at this point regardless of where the evidence leads. Likely, there is no turning back at this point.

I hope for everyone's sake Zimmerman gets a fair trial and that the evidence dictates the result, not uninformed notions of what people think or want to believe occurred or that that the result be based upon social or political agendas.

Prosecutors win cases , get promoted and receive more money.
Detectives solve cases, get promoted and receive more money.

See the incentives here? Scary.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by pointman

No one levels more personal attacks on this website than you. Why are you constantly fighting with and belitting numerous posters while I am not? In this thread alone you have gone after at least 4 or 5 posters who disagreed with you. Get a grip, you are the problem not me.

You do not set the parameters as to when and what I post on here.

Once again: YOU are the one who started this personal attack here. No, I don't take crap personal attacks from idiots like you.

Stomping your feet and screaming, "You are not the boss of me!" just makes you look even more ridiculous. Just stop it.

[Rudeboyelvis]

Riot in full on Psychotic Meltdown Mode!! BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Take your meds, sweetie

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Riot in full on Psychotic Meltdown Mode!! BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Take your meds, sweetie

Click.

Treat.

ROFLMAO.

[DaTruth]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

Riot in full on Psychotic Meltdown Mode!! BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Take your meds, sweetie

That is her default setting. Pointman must have written something to trigger her persecution complex.

[Rupert Pupkin]

The bail hearing is this Friday. It will be interesting to see whether the judge grants Zimmerman bail.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

The bail hearing is this Friday. It will be interesting to see whether the judge grants Zimmerman bail.

There is little chance that Zimmerman will be granted bail unless the Judge has a wish to destroy his or her career.

Would the bail hearing be the appropriate time for Z's lawyer to move that the case be dismissed under the "Stand Your Ground" law, or is that off the table at this time?

I would not rule out the possibility of bail in this case, but the question of Z's safety looms large, so it might be better for him to be in protective custody. I am sure he is totally sequestered wherever he is being held now.