Mel Gibson's Anti-Semetic Tirade

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

And see, I see the "Burning Times" as witches' attempts to give themselves their own Holocaust. Most of the victims of the assorted Witch Trials weren't "witches" in any relgious sense of the word; they were Christians who were unfortunate enough to be A)women with property B)women or men who annoyed someone in power C)irritating neighbors or D)any or all of the above. The numbers of those who died have been grossly inflated, and again, most of them weren't practicing witchcraft as a religion- they were using folk remedies, etc. independent of a faith. Heck, my great-aunt knew more folk magic than anyone I knew and she was a devout Christian. Didn't stop her from telling you to rub a potato on a wart on Good Friday and then bury it and as the potato rotted so would the wart (my dad STILL yammers about how that cured his wart). But I grew up in Central PA where folk magic is rife and is mostly practiced by Christians.

I'm not disputing people were burned or hanged or pressed to death as witches, but I don't think a single one of the witches practicing today is practicing anything like what was practiced in pre-Christian times or Dark Ages times. Modern witchcraft seems to me to be a blend of Christianity, Eastern thought, spiritualism and New Age thinking, with a focus on the feminine in Divinity. Which is what attracted me-- I want God to have my face, too, not just my father's and brother's and husband's.

But to each his and her own-- I figure the roots of any religion are not nearly as important as what one does with one's faith in the here and now anyway.

Which is not to say I didn't go through my phase of "It's an ancient faith" and "Burning times! Never again!" But, perhaps unfortunately, I kept reading and researching and eventually came to the belief that "witches" in history and "witches" in religion are two very different things and that's fine. The research also gave me the knowledge that Christmas trees are in fact ancient pagan symbols (and cultural ones), and that most Christian holidays are based around ancient pagan holidays (and many churches built on old pagan sites). Which is why the annual stuff in the media about a "war on Christmas" always amuses me.

AND-- all that said, I'm always astonished and a bit humbled when I come across a man who looks into the Craft, as it were. The great Western Faiths very clearly state man is primary and woman secondary, and for a man to look at a faith that says they're both equal (though different) is a man willing to give up some status. And that's an extraordinary thing, Somer, and I tip my hat to you-- I find it a very admirable thing.

Well, regarding the Burning Times, I will agree that most of the innocent victims of what amounted to church sponsored genocide were not practicing witches rather simply folks against whom someone held a grudge. Having said that, I would still contend that the purpose behind the Inquisition and other such activities was to wipe out witchcraft and other pagan religions. King James' translation of the old Hebrew word "chasaph" to the English "witch" rather than the correct translation of "poisoner", the sudden appearance of horns on the Judeo-Christian image of Satan which made it possible to claim that witches worshiped the devil....many examples.
The concept of sexual equality meets a lot of resistance in many cultures...I've never understood the fear attached to accepting the obvious. Unfortunately, in today's world, the concept of a female deity co-existing equally with a male one seems to be a huge step for many, perhaps one day......

I guess the big black pot jokes are out also.


I find it interesting that religions today still look at higher being(s) as having a sex. I mean there are some protozoans that have 13 sexes with very strict rules about sexual reproduction, quite confusing. And with as many organisms that reproduce asexually... I guess I thought stuff would be beyond that.

My bad. Using other living things in some sort of unity with humans is not a popular idea. Why cant people fit this in somehow. See this is what gets the atheists going... Man created God in his own image stuff.

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by pgardn

I guess the big black pot jokes are out also.


I find it interesting that religions today still look at higher being(s) as having a sex. I mean there are some protozoans that have 13 sexes with very strict rules about sexual reproduction, quite confusing. And with as many organisms that reproduce asexually... I guess I thought stuff would be beyond that.

My bad. Using other living things in some sort of unity with humans is not a popular idea. Why cant people fit this in somehow. See this is what gets the atheists going... Man created God in his own image stuff.

Again, many of the world's religions don't view the supreme being as either male or female! In Wicca, the supreme being is usually referred to as "The One"...mankind can't comprehend anything about this being, so...neither male or female and no claim that we are "in his/her/it's image". Very (probably overly) simply stated, the One IS the universe(s)...the One created the universe(s) and it/they are a part of the One. For us to better comprehend, it is taught that certain elements of the One (elements that we would characterize as male and female) are worshiped...they are usually referred to as the Lord and the Lady or the God and the Goddess. They are part of the One...much like the Christian "holy trinity". In addition, many Wiccans/Witches pray to additional gods and goddesses (many associated with ancient Egyptian and Greek Deities) HOWEVER they are all believed to be part of the ONE. Because certain feminine characteristics are so highly revered, many covens and individual Wiccans/Witches favor the Goddess however there are also many who pray equally to both and some who favor the God. It is recognized that this "breakdown" is done to accommodate the human limits of comprehension...in Wicca, there is one supreme being and that being is the same supreme being worshipped by all the world's religions that recognize one supreme being...they just use different names and have created different mythologies.

Originally Posted by somerfrost

Again, many of the world's religions don't view the supreme being as either male or female! In Wicca, the supreme being is usually referred to as "The One"...mankind can't comprehend anything about this being, so...neither male or female and no claim that we are "in his/her/it's image". Very (probably overly) simply stated, the One IS the universe(s)...the One created the universe(s) and it/they are a part of the One. For us to better comprehend, it is taught that certain elements of the One (elements that we would characterize as male and female) are worshiped...they are usually referred to as the Lord and the Lady or the God and the Goddess. They are part of the One...much like the Christian "holy trinity". In addition, many Wiccans/Witches pray to additional gods and goddesses (many associated with ancient Egyptian and Greek Deities) HOWEVER they are all believed to be part of the ONE. Because certain feminine characteristics are so highly revered, many covens and individual Wiccans/Witches favor the Goddess however there are also many who pray equally to both and some who favor the God. It is recognized that this "breakdown" is done to accommodate the human limits of comprehension...in Wicca, there is one supreme being and that being is the same supreme being worshipped by all the world's religions that recognize one supreme being...they just use different names and have created different mythologies.

My bad for the plural on religion(s). For Christians on the whole:
Jesus is the Lord. Jesus was male. God's son. God is clearly implied to be male.

One and supreme are very in. Are there any large religions today in which the one is not "all that"? Many religions of the past had multiple God's and had no problem with that. I guess since we "know" more, one and supreme are definitely vogue. Just curious. Times change, religions try not to.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by pgardn

I guess the big black pot jokes are out also.


I find it interesting that religions today still look at higher being(s) as having a sex. I mean there are some protozoans that have 13 sexes with very strict rules about sexual reproduction, quite confusing. And with as many organisms that reproduce asexually... I guess I thought stuff would be beyond that.

My bad. Using other living things in some sort of unity with humans is not a popular idea. Why cant people fit this in somehow. See this is what gets the atheists going... Man created God in his own image stuff.

Are you kidding me? One of my favorite bumper stickers I've seen on a practicing Witch's car said, "Don't make me get my flying monkeys!" Hee hee hee hee. No, that stuff totally cracks me up. I do try very hard not to take religion, mine or anyone else's, too seriously because really, who knows?

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

Again, many of the world's religions don't view the supreme being as either male or female! In Wicca, the supreme being is usually referred to as "The One"...mankind can't comprehend anything about this being, so...neither male or female and no claim that we are "in his/her/it's image". Very (probably overly) simply stated, the One IS the universe(s)...the One created the universe(s) and it/they are a part of the One. For us to better comprehend, it is taught that certain elements of the One (elements that we would characterize as male and female) are worshiped...they are usually referred to as the Lord and the Lady or the God and the Goddess. They are part of the One...much like the Christian "holy trinity". In addition, many Wiccans/Witches pray to additional gods and goddesses (many associated with ancient Egyptian and Greek Deities) HOWEVER they are all believed to be part of the ONE. Because certain feminine characteristics are so highly revered, many covens and individual Wiccans/Witches favor the Goddess however there are also many who pray equally to both and some who favor the God. It is recognized that this "breakdown" is done to accommodate the human limits of comprehension...in Wicca, there is one supreme being and that being is the same supreme being worshipped by all the world's religions that recognize one supreme being...they just use different names and have created different mythologies.

That is pretty much right on the money regarding the generally accepted view of Divinity in Wicca. You're a amart guy, Somer, but you know that already.

And yes, pgardn, you're correct in Christianity viewing God as male, and in Islam and Judaism for that matter-- remember, the three Western faiths all worship the EXACT SAME God, which is one reason I find it so fascinating that they fight each other all the time. But a lot of Americans have trouble wrapping their minds around that-- I have a dear friend in Florida, who, in the wake of 9/11 was flipping out at the prospect of Moslems invading and forcing her to pray to Allah, who she didn't believe in. I tried explaining to her that Allah is exactly the same entity as the Christian God-- that the main difference between Jews, Christians and Moslems is over who the prophet/messiah was, but she wouldn't buy it. Sigh.

[Danzig]

she sounds like my monster in law. i told her how holy days on the christian calendar ended up where they did, i thought she was going to have a heart attack. and then the whipped topping on the dessert--when i told her that easter is named for a goddess of springtime...i believe it's spelled oestre. but i could have that wrong.

[Danzig]

oh, and regarding the thread title...mel gibson is just another hollywood actor/nut. it just took longer for him to show it than some.

[Danzig]

http://www.tmz.com/2006/07/28/gibson...eged-cover-up/

http://www.tmz.com/2006/07/31/exclus...-times-before/


mel gibsons career may be over. no one to blame but himself. he even tried to escape, and now the sheriffs dept is in hot water for trying to cover up his behavior that night.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Is this on tape? I don't know what anybody can do to fix this. Pretty much like trying to get somebody to walk after they have been paralyzed.I don't think alcohol makes you say stuff you don't believe.That is what he is trying to sell?

Originally Posted by Danzig188

http://www.tmz.com/2006/07/28/gibson...eged-cover-up/

http://www.tmz.com/2006/07/31/exclus...-times-before/


mel gibsons career may be over. no one to blame but himself. he even tried to escape, and now the sheriffs dept is in hot water for trying to cover up his behavior that night.

Mel Gibson is an idiot, but his career is far from over. He is one of the few people that has his own cash and can do anything. He made a few hundred million for himself with his Passion of the Christ movie, which he owned.

I really doubt these religious wackos really believe what they say anyway. They are just brilliant people that know how to tap into a way to make money. Mel Gibson, Michael Moore, Ann Coulter, etc., are all full of it, but they laugh all the way to the bank.

I laugh when people make fun of Tom Cruise, he is no crazier than any other religious wacko, be it Christian, Jew, or Muslim.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by boldruler

Mel Gibson is an idiot, but his career is far from over. He is one of the few people that has his own cash and can do anything. He made a few hundred million for himself with his Passion of the Christ movie, which he owned.

I really doubt these religious wackos really believe what they say anyway. They are just brilliant people that know how to tap into a way to make money. Mel Gibson, Michael Moore, Ann Coulter, etc., are all full of it, but they laugh all the way to the bank.

I laugh when people make fun of Tom Cruise, he is no crazier than any other religious wacko, be it Christian, Jew, or Muslim.

The craziest of all are the atheist whackos.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Is this on tape? I don't know what anybody can do to fix this. Pretty much like trying to get somebody to walk after they have been paralyzed.I don't think alcohol makes you say stuff you don't believe.That is what he is trying to sell?

there was a link to an adobe of the actual report written by the arresting officer. supposedly there is audio even of him in his cell--and most police now have dashboard cameras. just a matter of time before the tape is shown.

.12 and he loses his control so completely??

in vino veritas. many will say drunk what would NEVER pass their lips sober--yet they're thinking it...they just remain in control til the booze starts to work and inhibitions melt away.

as for his career, funny tom cruise would also be mentioned...that guy started all his crazy actions on talk shows and such, remember his rant on psychology?? his mission impossible that was in the pipeline absolutely tanked.
mel is DONE. and it's his own fault.

[Downthestretch55]

I heard he's headed to rehab.
Might be best for him until people "forget".
If I might ask, how come he didn't call a cab? He can definitely afford it.
What did he make on "The Passion of Christ"? 200 Million?
He needs to take time out.
Thsi is very stupid.

(and everytime I looked at this thread, I bit my fingers so that I wouldn't type anything). Now I've said it.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

The craziest of all are the atheist whackos.

how so? don't see too many atheist crusades in the history books...

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Gibson is hardly a great spokesman for Christians, not after those shameful comments. His anti-semetic comments are disgraceful. The comments are incredibly ignorant too. As a Christian, I am ashamed of his comments. I guess his comments are not that shocking though considering that his father thinks that the Holocaust never happened.
If there's one thing that I can't figure out, it's Christians that don't like Jews. If you are a Christian, then your religion is based on the Bible. In the Bible, God says that Jews are his people. So how could a Christian dislike Jews? That would basically be going against your own religion. How would a Christian expect to have God's favor if they dislike God's people?
One thing funny about Gibson's commnets is that his agent of 20 years is Jewish.

I agree with this statement, 100%. The Jews are God's people and any Christian who dislikes the Jews is in the wrong.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Are you kidding me? One of my favorite bumper stickers I've seen on a practicing Witch's car said, "Don't make me get my flying monkeys!" Hee hee hee hee. No, that stuff totally cracks me up. I do try very hard not to take religion, mine or anyone else's, too seriously because really, who knows?

I understand your logic on this, but I tend to take it MORE seriously because really, who knows? What happens if I slack off and then the world ends... then it's too late.

I follow Christianity for my own reasons, but mainly because I've seen things that have made me believe the way I do. (I won't go into details because I don't want to freak people out. LOL)

[whorstman]

If most people followed the "Golden Rule", that would pretty much cover it.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

how so? don't see too many atheist crusades in the history books...

I was half-way kidding. But in all seriousness, how could there have been any atheist crusades? Were there any parts of the world where the atheists had enough power or enough people to go on a crusade?

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I was half-way kidding. But in all seriousness, how could there have been any atheist crusades? Were there any parts of the world where the atheists had enough power or enough people to go on a crusade?

Most leaders of these religious groups are atheists. They are just con artists.