Denis of Cork

[King Glorious]

While it's pretty obvious that there is a strong debate over who is that arguable best horse along with Big Brown and the candidates (Denis of Cork, Casino Drive, and Giant Moon) are all worthy.......getting a little serious, it's kind of a shame that Colonel John is being overlooked. If he were able to win the Classic, it would give him a strong hand for the award. In many other years, a horse that would have wins in the SA Derby, Travers, and BC Classic would get serious consideration. It's just too bad for him that the BC and SA Derby are both on synthetics and also that both are in California. He would be 1-1 with Big Brown and although he would trail him 4-3 in grade ones, and 2-0 in classic wins, the Travers is often considered a fourth classic race and the BC would be over a world-class field of older horses. Just a thought.

[Linny]

Obviously BB is the current leader but the Classic is being run on Colonel John's home tarck and over the type of surface over which he made his pre-Derby reputation. He's trained will since the Travers and though I hate the pattern of Travers-BCC, he has a decent chance to win and if he does the argument could be made that KY Derby notwithstanding, he's better or at least as good.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Linny

Obviously BB is the current leader but the Classic is being run on Colonel John's home tarck and over the type of surface over which he made his pre-Derby reputation. He's trained will since the Travers and though I hate the pattern of Travers-BCC, he has a decent chance to win and if he does the argument could be made that KY Derby notwithstanding, he's better or at least as good.

i absolutely disagree. this track surface is not the equalizer some claim it is. whatever everyone may think of big brown, he has been a picture of consistency compared to his opponents throughout his career. should big brown lose, imo there is no way you can suddenly elevate the winner, especially if it's an AWT specialist.

[Cannon Shell]

I find it hard to believe that the winner of the FL derby, KY Derby, Preakness, and Haskell while dominating three of those and throwing in a turf win over older runners isnt a lock regardless of what happens at SA. Maybe if Col John were to dominate iat SA and follow up with a win in the Clark but really what is the chance of that happening?

[Bobby Fischer]

colonel john really hasn't shown me anything special.

clearly, he was the leader of the west coast 3yo since very early and maintained that lead.
Then he added some legitimacy by winning the Travers on dirt, in a contest that was about a grade 3 older horse level.

He doesn't have the talent to win the Breeders Cup even with it being on a synthetic surface and the possibility of a few of the better horses not liking the synthetic.

I think you should reward a "solid" allowance/grade3 type in some way when they show a long career, but I would rather see talent be rewarded in hoy type honors.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I find it hard to believe that the winner of the FL derby, KY Derby, Preakness, and Haskell while dominating three of those and throwing in a turf win over older runners isnt a lock regardless of what happens at SA. Maybe if Col John were to dominate iat SA and follow up with a win in the Clark but really what is the chance of that happening?

I'd think that the Florida Derby and SA Derby would cancel each other out. The Travers and Haskell could cancel each other out. For me, considering what he'd have to beat in the BC Classic against what Big Brown faced in the TC races, Colonel John will have had to do more. I can't even remember who hit the board in the Derby and especially not in the Preakness. I think that if you take the names off of the races and just look at who they would have had to compete against to win the races they have, Colonel John with a win in the BC Classic would have a better resume than Big Brown. I'm not saying this would prove he's better but his accomplishments would be more impressive for me.