All of a sudden the editors from Bloodhorse...

[RockHardTen1985]

IMO Big Brown being on this list is the biggest joke of all.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

IMO Big Brown being on this list is the biggest joke of all.

why is that.. he was clearly the best in his year..if he wasnt handled by people who arent liked he would have been a sensation.. and rags winning the belmont should be higher imo

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

why is that.. he was clearly the best in his year..if he wasnt handled by people who arent liked he would have been a sensation.. and rags winning the belmont should be higher imo

I dont care about Dutrow, Big Brown sucked that crop was so bad and made him look good.
Summer Bird and Quality Road are both better then Big Brown, Barbaro and Bernardini are both better. I would rather any of these 4 get on that list over Big Brown.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Look who is #20.

Words cannot describe how absolutely ludicrous....how monumentally stupid....how....



She shouldn't be in the top 1000, let alone the top 20.

[miraja2]

The "race of the decade" question is an interesting one to think about.
Off the top of my head I'd give the 2004 Woodward the nod before SI's choice of the '07 Belmont.....but I may be forgetting some other obvious ones.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

if you stretch "Top Horse" to something beyond "Fastest Horse", even #20 is acceptable.

If you stretch it to mean something other than a horse that was fast.....or won a meaningful race.....or faced a horse that ran as if it possessed 4 legs....then.....let me think............nope. There are STILL dozens of other horses more deserving.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

I dont care about Dutrow, Big Brown sucked that crop was so bad and made him look good.
Summer Bird and Quality Road are both better then Big Brown, Barbaro and Bernardini are both better. I would rather any of these 4 get on that list over Big Brown.

qr is better than big brown ok ill stop now and not waste my time i agree that bern should be in the mix

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

qr is better than big brown ok ill stop now and not waste my time i agree that bern should be in the mix

Dunkirk would have won Big Browns Florida Derby.

[Gander]

Originally Posted by miraja2

The "race of the decade" question is an interesting one to think about.
Off the top of my head I'd give the 2004 Woodward the nod before SI's choice of the '07 Belmont.....but I may be forgetting some other obvious ones.

Mine would be an easy choice...Casron Hollow and You in the 2002 Test Stakes at Saratoga. Hands down the best race I have ever seen.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by Gander

Mine would be an easy choice...Casron Hollow and You in the 2002 Test Stakes at Saratoga. Hands down the best race I have ever seen.

Great Great race, but Im not sure race of the decade....
I think to be race of the decade it has to be a bigger race on a bigger stage.
Rags-Belmont, Curlin, Street Sense-Preakness, Zenyatta-Classic

[cakes44]

That 2nd page is quite the steaming pile. Borel? The Assman had a better decade than Frankel? I'd like to see the Grade 1 tally between the two if anyone can find it.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by cakes44

That 2nd page is quite the steaming pile. Borel? The Assman had a better decade than Frankel? I'd like to see the Grade 1 tally between the two if anyone can find it.

Most Graded Stakes wins by a trainer this decade:

Todd Pletcher 307
Robert Frankel 299 (<-- his asst trainer has 3 since he died)
Bob Baffert 164
Bill Mott 143
Steve Asmussen 104
Christophe Clement 100
Kiaran McLaughlin 85
Richard Mandella 75
D. Wayne Lukas 69
Doug O'Neill 66
Richard Dutrow, Jr. 64
Claude R. McGaughey 63

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

Tough crowd here at DT. Aside from 19 & 20, I think it's a decent list. And if you stretch "Top Horse" to something beyond "Fastest Horse", even #20 is acceptable.

Any list that puts the Derby-hyped horses below non-household-name older horses like Invasor, Tiznow and Ghostzapper is fine with me, especially one that leaves Bernardini off the list.

Page 2 was also okay, IMO, though Borel's honorable mention was a big stretch, to say the least. I didn't even mind being reminded of my near miss on Closing Argument at 72-1. (it's not a redboard if you don't collect, is it?).

I'd be interested in your own answers to the various categories on page 2, and how far down you'd put the answers in SI's list.

1 through 18 is pretty damn bad. He opted to make a complete fool of himself with #20.

People who don't follow horse racing religiously will see a list like that and trust it - after all - we are talking about America's sports authority SI.

I don't care one bit that the writer and editor don't know Johar or that they think Saint Liam was unraced at age three - when in fact he made nine starts at age 3.

The real travesty is that you have a writer who specializes in fluff pieces and human interest stories trying his hand at something that requires hardcore analytical and handicapping skills. On top of that - you have the nations most trusted sports magazine willing to publish it.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Great Great race, but Im not sure race of the decade....
I think to be race of the decade it has to be a bigger race on a bigger stage.
Rags-Belmont, Curlin, Street Sense-Preakness, Zenyatta-Classic

You're kidding with that one right?
I'll take two future HOYs battling nose to nose down the entire stretch of Belmont Park in '04 over that race any day.

[Gander]

Originally Posted by miraja2

You're kidding with that one right?
I'll take two future HOYs battling nose to nose down the entire stretch of Belmont Park in '04 over that race any day.

You cant possibly give any race run on the junk the nod over all the brilliant ones that took place on the real stuff. Thats like saying the best football games of the decade took place in a dome. Its just not real.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

1 through 18 is pretty damn bad. He opted to make a complete fool of himself with #20.

I think 1-18 is a decent list. If you and say 10 other knowledgeable posters here independently put up "Top 18" lists, I'm guessing the SI list would not stick out as the odd-list-out.

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

People who don't follow horse racing religiously will see a list like that and trust it - after all - we are talking about America's sports authority SI.

People who don't follow horseracing religiously will spend at most 10 seconds on that list, and they will immediately forget any horse whose name they don't recognize, which is all but maybe Funny Cide, Smarty Jones, Afleet Alex, Big Brown, and, possibly-but-I-doubt-it, this year's fillies.

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I don't care one bit that the writer and editor don't know Johar or that they think Saint Liam was unraced at age three - when in fact he made nine starts at age 3.

I'm willing to forgive the mis-info on St. Liam. At least he INCLUDED St. Liam, a horse whose name less than 0.1% of sports fans outside of this board would even recognize.

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

The real travesty is that you have a writer who specializes in fluff pieces and human interest stories trying his hand at something that requires hardcore analytical and handicapping skills. On top of that - you have the nations most trusted sports magazine willing to publish it.

Look, this isn't health care or climate change. "travesty" is a little strong. It's a Top 20 list. People make these lists at the end of a year or end of a decade. It gives us something to argue about. We should be delighted that SI even puts together a top 20 horse list.

--Dunbar

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by miraja2

If you stretch it to mean something other than a horse that was fast.....or won a meaningful race.....or faced a horse that ran as if it possessed 4 legs....then.....let me think............nope. There are STILL dozens of other horses more deserving.

How about I just stretch it to mean a horse that raced 19 times without ever finding an excuse to not win? How many more deserving are there then?

Pepper's Pride wouldn't be in my own "Top 20", but I'm not offended by someone putting her at #20 in his own list.

--Dunbar

[Gander]

At least they got the "worst innovation" being synthetic tracks right. That was an easy one. Ruined California racing.

[Gander]

Congaree belongs on this list as well. If he faced some of the duds Ghostzapper and Curlin did, he would have won twice as many races. He was a superior animal. These are some of some of his tidbits...

Horse of the Year runner-up; Eclipse Finalist as champion older male and champion sprinter

Fastest miler of 2002 on dirt (1:33.11)

One of the most versatile runners in history (G1 wins at 3, 4, & 5, 7f to 1 1/4 miles)

Only horse in history to win Cigar Mile-G1 back-to-back

Made 22 consecutive starts in Graded stakes

2nd fastest mile in Kentucky Derby history

Leading North American based male from the Blushing Groom line

$3.2 million earner and five-time Grade I winner

[Sightseek]

HRTV just gave their endorsement of this list.