vick told NO camp

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i saw yesterday where atlanta had intended to give him a four game suspension.

wooooooow. tough love that.

thank god for goodall, since many owners haven't got the intestinal fortitude (read cajones) to stand up and say NO to their star players.

altho, vick is so incredibly overrated-i don't see star stats under his name. not even top 20 last year in qb's, with a 52% pass completion. well on his way to the hall of fame! or hall of shame. more pr and hype than substance. so why put up with so much, pay so much for an average player??

what am i thinking?! he sells tickets.

money talks.

I'm pretty sure a four game suspension is the maximum punishment that any team can hand down. It is a tough situation, if they cut him they will have to cut about 10 other players to absorb the salary cap hit. Of course that's why you don't give someone that much money in signing/roster bonuses in the first place.

[Samarta]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

Kinda have mixed feelings about this one! Due Process is incomplete.....but a Federal indictment was handed down. The high profile of this case demands action....but he'll probably still get his paycheck!

The Falcons or the league can't afford the fallout of having this idiot around. Hell they were protesting at NFL HQ, Richmond Courthouse, Ga Dome, and The Falcons facility last week. Can you imagine what it would be like if he was actually at one of those places.

[timmgirvan]

Likely be out for the year, or longer!

[Mortimer]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

Likely be out for the year, or longer!

What the fucl< are you....the human headline here?

[Crown@club]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I'm pretty sure a four game suspension is the maximum punishment that any team can hand down. It is a tough situation, if they cut him they will have to cut about 10 other players to absorb the salary cap hit. Of course that's why you don't give someone that much money in signing/roster bonuses in the first place.

Actually Falcons would save 6 mil this year, but take a 15 mil hit next year, if they release Vick.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by byalip

Goodall made the right call.

NFL has reserves the right to suspend and more without the legal due process. Someone mentioned the "obscene amount of money"...so keeping your conduct squeaky clean should be enough of an enticement to behave.

Personally, I'd send Vick straight to Guantanomo and forget about him and his legal rights.

Wow. Dog killing on par with terrorism suspects. Sounds about right.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by mortyfeatherhands

What the fucl< are you....the human headline here?

Information is key to make an informed decision.....but not for you,apparently

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

That may be a stretch, but I can tell you honestly, I wouldn't be against it. It's about the person. Someone who would do this doesn't have an appreciation for life of any kind, so worse stuff isn't that far off. I do admire your continued support and I have finally figured out why.

Please, don't keep me in suspense. Let me know the reason why I support him.........even though I don't. Did I show my support for him by saying that I don't think he's a good person and would never send my kids to any football camp he was hosting? Did I show my support for him by saying he's not someone I could ever see hanging out with? Maybe I showed my support for him when I said that because there is a lot of smoke, I'd be more inclined to believe that he's guilty than innocent? Or was it when I said that if he's found guilty, he should get the same penalty as anyone else would, nothing less? I am curious as to what I've said here that makes u think I support him? The only things I've been in support of are the law, due process, and the theory that a man is innocent until proven guilty. I've said that because of where I'm from and the culture I grew up in, I don't see dog-fighting as that serious of an issue. But that doesn't mean that I don't understand that it's against the law and again, I have been in support of the law and the appropriate punishment that comes with breaking it. I'd hope that when u say that u have finally figured out why I'm in support of him, even though I'm not, that u are saying it's because I'm African American as he is and that I'm going to blindly be on his side simply for that reason. I'd really hope that isn't why u say u have figured it out.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I had no idea you were African American, so no that's not it, but nice try. It is of my opinion that you are in support of him. You have said you think he did nothing wrong, but respect the law. So if he did nothing wrong, you agree with him right? You tried to make this about a culture thing, which it surely is not. Now please don't try and make this a race thing, no one else was. This is a humanity thing.

I think the speed limit law is stupd in a lot of places. But I fully understand that the laws are in place and when I'm caught breaking them, I don't complain that I don't deserve the penalty that comes with it. I didn't say that I thought he did nothing wrong either. If he's guilty of what they are saying he is, he DID do something wrong. He broke the law. Now, if u want to ask me if I think the law is just or unjust, that's a different issue. That's where my issue lies. If it were up to me, it wouldn't be against the law because it doesn't bother me. But it's not up to me and it is against the law. I'm just disappointed that u would say it's your opinion that I am in support of him when nothing I've said has said that. If he were found guilty, I'd be perfectly fine with him going to jail, if that's the same penalty anyone else would get. If he were found guilty and kicked out of football, in accordance with Goodell's new policy, I would have absolutely no problem with that either. I do believe that I have said that I do not think that Vick is a good person overall. Yet u still say that I support him. So I guess that if I don't follow the mob and suggest before he gets a chance to be tried that he be banned from football, sent to Guantanomo and killed........that I am supporting him. Ok, if that's your opinion.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Speed limits laws and fighting and killing dogs are a bit different. I see what you are trying to say, but fail to see the relevance. I'm not going to argue this anymore. I've wasted enough time. Either you are playing dumb, are dumb or just having fun trying to be different. Either way, the facts keep coming out and while you keep squirming out of it, it's inevitable, Vick's days are numbered.

What the hell am I squirming out of? I said if he's found guilty, he should pay the price. How is that squirming out? I have never said I don't think he's guilty. What is sad is that this is America and u are saying I'm trying to be different by suggesting we use due process and then decide. Wow. I'm trying to be different by suggesting we uphold the Constitution. That's a sad indictment on our country today. The funny thing is that I agree with u that it's very likely his days are numbered. There is a good chance that he's going to be found guilty and will be banned from football and likely will do some jail time. The only thing at issue is that u want that decision made BEFORE he has a chance at trial and I'm suggesting something radical, like waiting till AFTER he has had a trial.

[ArlJim78]

one side says that what he is accused of is wrong and he should pay the prices for it once due process has run its course.

the other side says what he is accused of is no big deal but since it is against the law he should pay the price once due process has run its course.

the rest is just obfuscation.

no one is advocating a short circuit of his rights. what is appalling though is that there are still people around that would have no problem with dog-fighting being legal because it doesn't bother them.

[Mortimer]

I must chime in with yer basic eloquence.



In short...


....the "innocent until proven guilty" is a jury instruction....I believe.






If it were taken any further ...what sense would this make:





"Mr. INSERT NAME HERE...we are the police and we are arresting you as you are presumed innocent of killing Mr. VICTIM."



"Mr. INSERT NAME HERE...I am the judge and bound you over to the county jail unless you can produce a $2,000,000 cash bond,,,,as we presume you innocent until proven guilty."








So people are allowed to have opinions as to whether a charged person is gulity or not even before they are proven guity,guilty,guilty,guilty.Even the police and judges may assume that innocent person is guilty.



It jist don't git no simpler 'in 'at.

[byalip]

Any one who thinks you're a simple jokester, just along for the ride or a disruptive presence .... should remember this eloquent, logical and well-phrased post.

100 PIES. The best.

It don't git any better 'en this.

See ya later!

[Danzig]

it is a jury instruction that you make no decision one way or the other til all facts are heard, and the trial is over, and the jury has deliberated. we found one guy guilty, the other not guilty. the second guy may well have been guilty, but it was he said, she said, and certainly not shown beyond a REASONABLE doubt. not some doubt, but reasonable. very important!