Wiphan

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

He certainly earned it but I have to imagine teams will be wary after how much he pitched for the Brewers. He managed to throw an extra 17 IP in one extra start after the All Star break than Santana did and Santana was overworked down the stretch. Ultimately it will depend who targets him. I have a feeling the Mets will stay out which means if either the Red Sox or Yankees decide not to get heavily involved he might not get as much money as he deserves.

You have to think the Yanks will be heavily involved. They are shedding alot of money from the payroll. Plus they have several question marks in that rotation.

[declansharbor]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

He'll cough it up in a pressure situation during the playoffs. Guaranteed.

What else are you getting from that crystal ball??

The guy has simply done everything asked of him, and even with an unblemished record, he gets slammed for what may or may not transpire in October.

Listen, I horselaughed (im talkin John Elway horselaugh) my brothers best friend when he suggested (proir to the season) that he would end up with 40 saves. I could not see it happening. Fast forward a few months, and I'm the guy that had no clue on what he was talking about. Surprised isnt that word when it comes to a revived Lidge.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by declansharbor

What else are you getting from that crystal ball??

The guy has simply done everything asked of him, and even with an unblemished record, he gets slammed for what may or may not transpire in October.

Listen, I horselaughed (im talkin John Elway horselaugh) my brothers best friend when he suggested (proir to the season) that he would end up with 40 saves. I could not see it happening. Fast forward a few months, and I'm the guy that had no clue on what he was talking about. Surprised isnt that word when it comes to a revived Lidge.

It's not up for debate that he's got issues with late season and postseason saves. If he navigates this postseason without any blown saves or any skin-of-the-teeth saves, I'll eat crow, but until then, he's still a gagger.

[declansharbor]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

It's not up for debate that he's got issues with late season and postseason saves. If he navigates this postseason without any blown saves or any skin-of-the-teeth saves, I'll eat crow, but until then, he's still a gagger.

Fair enough.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

It's not up for debate that he's got issues with late season and postseason saves. If he navigates this postseason without any blown saves or any skin-of-the-teeth saves, I'll eat crow, but until then, he's still a gagger.

The guy is a great closer. He gave up one awful HR to Pujols which obviously was devastating as it lingered into the 2006 season but since then he has been lights out. The famous HR game was his 4th game in a row during that seris. He saved the other 3. His stats are especially good considering he has pitched his home games at 2 of the best hitters parks in baseball. He and KRod have close to identical post season numbers. I guess you forgot the 2 games Krod lost in the 2004 playoffs before he was even closing. The Phillies dont make the playoffs without Lidge. The Mets win the division by 8 games if they had him.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

My wishlist for the offseason:

1) Pickup the option on Delgado.

2) Get one solid starter preferably in the $8 million a year range (possibly Oliver Perez).

3) Get one veteran starter you can plug in the 5 spot early while Niese works his way up by midseason (possibly Pedro).

4) Sign one solid OF that won't break the bank (Raul Ibanez?)

5) Get one of the Big 3 closers (K-Rod, Nathan, Lidge)

6) Pay Fuentes and get him to be the setup man

That would put the Mets payroll right around $130 million which includes the $10.5 million they have to pay Wagner. That is right where they were this year. For $10 million more (realistic with the new ballpark) they could add another bullpen arm and help at 2B.

Rotation would be the same as this year, bullpen would be signficantly improved. Lineup would have Ibanez at one corner OF position, Fernando Martinez and Church at the other, and would get back Schneider at C which would be head and shoulders above what they were sending out the past couple weeks.

I agree with most of these but #1. Delgado is a trap. A lot of aging power guys had one last gasp season before being totally done. Dont forget last year.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I agree with most of these but #1. Delgado is a trap. A lot of aging power guys had one last gasp season before being totally done. Dont forget last year.

It's one year $8 million essentially. The option is for $12 million and it would cost them $4 million to buy out. You gotta take one more year of Delgado at $8 million.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

It's one year $8 million essentially. The option is for $12 million and it would cost them $4 million to buy out. You gotta take one more year of Delgado at $8 million.

They need to win not save money. If Delgado reverts to form...

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

They need to win not save money. If Delgado reverts to form...

White Sox

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

They need to win not save money. If Delgado reverts to form...

The guy hasn't had less than 24 HRs or 87 RBIs since he was a backup for John Olerud in Toronto in 1995. If that's the downside then I doubt they can do much better for $8 million at first base.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The guy is a great closer. He gave up one awful HR to Pujols which obviously was devastating as it lingered into the 2006 season but since then he has been lights out. The famous HR game was his 4th game in a row during that seris. He saved the other 3. His stats are especially good considering he has pitched his home games at 2 of the best hitters parks in baseball. He and KRod have close to identical post season numbers. I guess you forgot the 2 games Krod lost in the 2004 playoffs before he was even closing. The Phillies dont make the playoffs without Lidge. The Mets win the division by 8 games if they had him.

He was bad down the stretch in '05, had a horrendous postseason that year, and was lousy to awful the next two seasons. He had a very good year this regular season, but pitching in the postseason is a whole different beast, and until he proves that he's exorcised those demons, spare me the "but he's so valuable!" speech.

If the Mets had a good closer, they would have won the division? You don't say. Thanks Bill James, everything suddenly makes sense now.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

The guy hasn't had less than 24 HRs or 87 RBIs since he was a backup for John Olerud in Toronto in 1995. If that's the downside then I doubt they can do much better for $8 million at first base.

They should ante up and sign Teixeira. Delgado is on the otherside of his career and tex is a much better player and will be for the next 5 years. Would you rather have the 2nd best 1st baseman in the lague for the next 5 or 6 years or Delgado? The difference in money shouldnt make much difference with the money mint coming online next year. What do you do with Delgado after next year? There is no guarantee he will show up to play for $8 million anyway. You know he will want an extention and you may wind up with a Manny situation. They have Wright signed to a good contract and there is no other position player that they will have to pay in the near future.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

He was bad down the stretch in '05, had a horrendous postseason that year, and was lousy to awful the next two seasons. He had a very good year this regular season, but pitching in the postseason is a whole different beast, and until he proves that he's exorcised those demons, spare me the "but he's so valuable!" speech.

If the Mets had a good closer, they would have won the division? You don't say. Thanks Bill James, I feel such a sense of closure now.

Stick to football. He was hurt in the begining of 07 and was very good the 2nd half of the season. He did not have a horrendous postseason in 05. Maybe if you had watched him save three games in a row BEFORE the Pujols HR you would have realized this. Saying that KRod and Nathan are way better than him is silly. Especially after this season. I suppose Eckersley was a post season choker and should be booted out of the hall of fame because he gave up a HR to Gibson. At least Lidge got beat by the best hiter since Ted Williams.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

They should ante up and sign Teixeira. Delgado is on the otherside of his career and tex is a much better player and will be for the next 5 years. Would you rather have the 2nd best 1st baseman in the lague for the next 5 or 6 years or Delgado? The difference in money shouldnt make much difference with the money mint coming online next year. What do you do with Delgado after next year? There is no guarantee he will show up to play for $8 million anyway. You know he will want an extention and you may wind up with a Manny situation. They have Wright signed to a good contract and there is no other position player that they will have to pay in the near future.

Obviously if they can get Tex that is a different story, but that added money could be the difference between having Fuentes and a top closer or having neither. And won't the Yanks break the bank for Tex?

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Stick to football. He was hurt in the begining of 07 and was very good the 2nd half of the season. He did not have a horrendous postseason in 05. Maybe if you had watched him save three games in a row BEFORE the Pujols HR you would have realized this. Saying that KRod and Nathan are way better than him is silly. Especially after this season. I suppose Eckersley was a post season choker and should be booted out of the hall of fame because he gave up a HR to Gibson. At least Lidge got beat by the best hiter since Ted Williams.

OK. And giving up Game 2 to the White Sox would be downplayed by you too I'm sure.

We'll see what happens this year. If he's as good in the playoffs as he was during the regular season, I'll shut up. If he blows a save or two, your ass is grass Chuckles.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Obviously if they can get Tex that is a different story, but that added money could be the difference between having Fuentes and a top closer or having neither. And won't the Yanks break the bank for Tex?

Honestly there should be no limit to what they spend after the way the last 2 seasons ended. Fuentes is not a lights out guy. He lost the closers job in Colorado where no one cares about baseball. He may not be a NY guy and for the money he will want, who knows. Why is it that some teams always come up with solid relief guys that come from nowhere like Minnesota and San Diego and even oakland? The Yankees are supposedly thinking of breaking the bank for CC and signing Giambi to a cut rate deal, which he would do presumably. How many giant deals can they do with the Arod deal and Jeter coming due soon.

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Obviously if they can get Tex that is a different story, but that added money could be the difference between having Fuentes and a top closer or having neither. And won't the Yanks break the bank for Tex?

You would think that there would be several suitors for Tex. The Halo's, Yanks, BoSox just to name a few. I don't think the Mets should bring back Delgado. As good as he was in the 2nd half was as awful as he was in the 1st half. There was talk (or maybe it was just the fans saying it) that they should release him. Not to mention the failures of the past 2 seasons. Changes have to be made to the roster and this is one of them. If they can't land Tex maybe they can transform Murphy into a first baseman.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

OK. And giving up Game 2 to the White Sox would be downplayed by you too I'm sure.

We'll see what happens this year. If he's as good in the playoffs as he was during the regular season, I'll shut up. If he blows a save or two, your ass is grass Chuckles.

He may not even get a chance...

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Honestly there should be no limit to what they spend after the way the last 2 seasons ended. Fuentes is not a lights out guy. He lost the closers job in Colorado where no one cares about baseball. He may not be a NY guy and for the money he will want, who knows. Why is it that some teams always come up with solid relief guys that come from nowhere like Minnesota and San Diego and even oakland? The Yankees are supposedly thinking of breaking the bank for CC and signing Giambi to a cut rate deal, which he would do presumably. How many giant deals can they do with the Arod deal and Jeter coming due soon.

Even with the new ballpark the Mets still don't have unlimited resources. And once they hit that luxury tax then every extra dollar is multiplied. If you told me for $24 million next year they could have Delgado, Nathan, and Fuentes or have Teixeira and buyout Delgado I'd take the former in a heartbeat. They can always plug someone in at first if Delgado goes bad. They proved this year that you can't plug someone in as closer and setup man.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

You would think that there would be several suitors for Tex. The Halo's, Yanks, BoSox just to name a few. I don't think the Mets should bring back Delgado. As good as he was in the 2nd half was as awful as he was in the 1st half. There was talk (or maybe it was just the fans saying it) that they should release him. Not to mention the failures of the past 2 seasons. Changes have to be made to the roster and this is one of them. If they can't land Tex maybe they can transform Murphy into a first baseman.

There is no place in Boston for him. They signed lowell last year, Youlkilis really cant play OF on a regular basis and Ortiz is a DH only now. The Angels may resign him but they havent been doing mega deals. They got Vlad at a discount because he was having back issues and even Hunter wasnt a real big money contract. The yankees will be rumored because the agents make sure of it but There has to be a limit on what they can do considering they are already paying a ton to Arod, have a bunch of guys to resign, need to address the rotation and bullpen, may have to find a catcher and move posada to DH, have Jeter to sign, i think next year...

The Mets are a great fit, not to mention with him being a switch hitter, he adds a lot of flexability to the lineup.