Five New Grade I Races in 2007; Two Others Drop to Grade II

[blackthroatedwind]

I can understand the argument that preps shouldn't be Grade 1s, and all these races are preps for the TC, but it doesn't make sense for other preps to be Grade 1s and the Arkansas Derby to be left out. I am guessing there was a dearth of good horses in that race for years and only recently has it had a resurgence and perhaps if it is strong again this year they will change it.

Personally I couldn't care less....though if a turf sprint ever becomes a Grade 1 I give up. Grade 1s are at least supposed to be for good horses.

[slotdirt]

Concern won the Arkansas Derby in like 1994.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Concern ran won the Arkansas Derby in like 1994.

You can always find isolated horses. However, I may also be wrong, and perhaps there's some kind of bias. I have always found it a little odd the Oaklawn Handicap is a Grade 2. Of course that pathetic Lukas horse wiring that race a couple years ago didn't help.

Is Charlie Cella particularly disliked?

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I can understand the argument that preps shouldn't be Grade 1s, and all these races are preps for the TC, but it doesn't make sense for other preps to be Grade 1s and the Arkansas Derby to be left out. I am guessing there was a dearth of good horses in that race for years and only recently has it had a resurgence and perhaps if it is strong again this year they will change it.

Personally I couldn't care less....though if a turf sprint ever becomes a Grade 1 I give up. Grade 1s are at least supposed to be for good horses.

Well why leave out that type of race if you are going to include all the others. Personally, I think there are way too many Grade I races. 107 Grade Races it just way too many. I like your idea of Preps not being a Grade I. However, how would you know that every runner in the so called prep is acutally prepping for another race--does that make sense?

Currently there are 28 Grade I races for straight three year olds. I think this is way too many. I feel that there should be 3 Grade I races for males routing on dirt, 3 Grade I races for females routing on dirt, 2 each for males and females sprinting on dirt, 3 each for female and male turf routers. So a total of 16 Grade I races for three year olds.

Originally Posted by eurobounce

Well why leave out that type of race if you are going to include all the others. Personally, I think there are way too many Grade I races. 107 Grade Races it just way too many. I like your idea of Preps not being a Grade I. However, how would you know that every runner in the so called prep is acutally prepping for another race--does that make sense?

Currently there are 28 Grade I races for straight three year olds. I think this is way too many. I feel that there should be 3 Grade I races for males routing on dirt, 3 Grade I races for females routing on dirt, 2 each for males and females sprinting on dirt, 3 each for female and male turf routers. So a total of 16 Grade I races for three year olds.

I can think of no races as meaningless or that I would rather watch than a turf sprint. In no way should they get graded status, much less grade one status.
As far as preps not being grade ones, I couldn't disagree more.
Not every three year old is bred to go a mile and a quarter, and in many cases the "prep" is the race.
You'd have no grade ones before the DERby for three year olds in that event, and I just don't think thats proper.

[slotdirt]

I can wait to see the GI race featuring Atticus Kristy, Mighty Beau, and Sgt. Bert contesting the same race year after year after year. Throw Parker Run in there and you have a perfect super!

Originally Posted by oracle80

I can think of no races as meaningless or that I would rather watch than a turf sprint. In no way should they get graded status, much less grade one status.
As far as preps not being grade ones, I couldn't disagree more.
Not every three year old is bred to go a mile and a quarter, and in many cases the "prep" is the race.
You'd have no grade ones before the DERby for three year olds in that event, and I just don't think thats proper.

I completely agree with you on the preps if they are indeed not preps for all runner. If we could make 100% sure that every horse running in the so-called prep is actually prepping then fine--but like you pefectly said, some horses are running to get that Grade I win because they can't go 1 1/4 or whatever.

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I can wait to see the GI race featuring Atticus Kristy, Mighty Beau, and Sgt. Bert contesting the same race year after year after year. Throw Parker Run in there and you have a perfect super!

Basically these are failed horses who can't go farther than 5f, and only then on the grass, just ****ing great!!
We cannot allow the breed to be contaminated by sires who have won a "grade one" going 5f on the grass.

I love turf sprints. Just my cup of tea I suppose.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I can wait to see the GI race featuring Atticus Kristy, Mighty Beau, and Sgt. Bert contesting the same race year after year after year. Throw Parker Run in there and you have a perfect super!

I was thinking exactly the same thing! I just wasn't able to remember all their names.

Originally Posted by oracle80

Basically these are failed horses who can't go farther than 5f, and only then on the grass, just ****ing great!!
We cannot allow the breed to be contaminated by sires who have won a "grade one" going 5f on the grass.

I think the breed is already contanminated.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

I love turf sprints. Just my cup of tea I suppose.

I enjoy some of them as well, though I think we have seen WAY too many in NY the past year or so, but that doesn't mean there are Grade 1 turf sprinters around here.

The very best we get are pretty much barely even Grade 3 material to be honest.

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I enjoy some of them as well, though I think we have seen WAY too many in NY the past year or so, but that doesn't mean there are Grade 1 turf sprinters around here.

The very best we get are pretty much barely even Grade 3 material to be honest.

What exactly is a Grade I turf sprinter?

[Linny]

Almost every other major racing center on Earth has a division for sprinters. Since most nations race on grass, turf sprints of the highest caliber are run worldwide.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Linny

Almost every other major racing center on Earth has a division for sprinters. Since most nations race on grass, turf sprints of the highest caliber are run worldwide.

I'm not sure what opinion you're expressing, if in fact you are, but do you think the US has, on average, horses capable of competing on a worldwide scale in these races.

Of course, I guess Var, would validate those that say we do.

[slotdirt]

It's funny to see the exact same horses just running around the country in turf sprints. It's like the WWE circuit or something.

[SniperSB23]

If you had a G1 sprint on turf with a decent purse I have a feeling you would see turf milers and dirt sprinters dominating the race rather than the horses currently running in turf sprints.

[Linny]

I realize that most US grass sprinters are that by default. They liked grass but not routes, they liked sprinting but had sore feet. Etc. Etc.

With stallions like Elusive Quality and the like standing in the US, some breeders are unwitting breeding grass sprinters for a market that bareley exists.
If the tracks card quality grass sprints, those that specialize in it will gravitate to it. Right now, the difference between a grass sprint $20k claimer and a grass sprint G3 is very narrow. It's part of the process of the "birth" of the division. As more horses enter the fray the division gets deeper and stronger top to bottom.

At this point I don't think that the US T sprinters can compete on the world stage but they could. Many of the best T sprinters worldwide are US bred or very close to US bred. My post above was intended to respond to the person who feels that grass sprints are by definition "bad racing." The point was that much of the world doesn't think so.

Originally Posted by slotdirt

It's funny to see the exact same horses just running around the country in turf sprints. It's like the WWE circuit or something.

Well maybe if you made a couple of these races a Grade I race then we would might get some dirt sprinters to move over to the turf and we might even see some turf milers join in. Right now these is no incentive to try to sprint on the turf because there are no races. Write the races and they will come.

[Linny]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

It's funny to see the exact same horses just running around the country in turf sprints. It's like the WWE circuit or something.

At leat there are so few races that everytime they card a decent T Sprint everyone shows up! The fields are usually full.