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  #41  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:17 PM
blackthroatedwind blackthroatedwind is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS
That horse never ran a 109.

Those were Strong Performer's figs.

You're slipping.
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  #42  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:26 PM
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The Indomitable DrugS The Indomitable DrugS is offline
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Strong Contender ran a 94 Beyer in the 2nd start of his life, off like an 8 month layoff. A few weeks later, Bernardini would win with a 90 Beyer, in the 2nd start of his life, at the same distance over the same track.

Showing Up ran a 100 Beyer, at the same distance, over the same track, also in the 2nd start of his life.

Horses progress. Any horse that can run a 94, in the 2nd start of his life, going a one-turn mile, off a very long layoff, is more than likely headed for marked improvement down the line.
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  #43  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:31 PM
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The Indomitable DrugS The Indomitable DrugS is offline
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* Strong Contender: Feb 22nd, ALW race, 8f's, GP. 2nd start of career, Won by 5 lengths in 1:34 3/5ths with a 94 Beyer.

* Bernardini: March 4th, MSW race, 8f's GP. 2nd start of career, Won by 7 lengths in 1:35 with a 90 Beyer

* Showing Up: March 11th, ALW race, 8f's GP. 2nd start of career, Won by 2 lengths in 1:34 flat with a 100 Beyer.


If Bernardini can jump to a 117...and Showing Up can jump way up....why is it so hard to belive that Strong Contender could
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  #44  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS
Invasor was hooked up with Flower Alley for almost five furlongs in that race, very impressively put him away with complete authority at the 1/8th pole...
Flower Alley was not competitive at all this year, and putting him away is hardly impressive.
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  #45  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind
Those were Strong Performer's figs.

You're slipping.
I am slipping!!!

At this time tomorrow night I will be out on a date with Emily! My mind is elsewhere.

I apoligize to you sir, for my incredible showing of mediocrity and retardation...here in the 3rd page of this thread.

It won't happen again!
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  #46  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmorioles
Flower Alley was not competitive at all this year, and putting him away is hardly impressive.
Invasor was moved early into a hot pace to do so.....

Even if Flower Alley does suck---Jara still moved very prematurely simply to take it Flower Alley.
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  #47  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:43 PM
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I was reading from oldest to newest, didn't see this had been addressed already. No doubt he ran a much better race than Sun King did.
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  #48  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:45 PM
blackthroatedwind blackthroatedwind is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmorioles
I was reading from oldest to newest, didn't see this had been addressed already. No doubt he ran a much better race than Sun King did.

Like you hadn't seen it all before.

I thought it was deja vu all over again.
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  #49  
Old 12-17-2006, 11:59 PM
repent repent is offline
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1.The Tin Man Arlington Million
2.The Tin Man Dubai Duty Free
3.The Tin Man Clement Hirsch
4.The Tin Man American Invite
5.The Tin Man workout at Hollypark
6-10 Repeat any of Fleet Indian's wins
11-25 I dont know. guess anything that happened in the KEE fall meet


Repent
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  #50  
Old 12-18-2006, 01:09 AM
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mark2061mn mark2061mn is offline
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Two very overrated races and/or performances you left off drugS.

The gotham stakes. Have any of the major players in that race came back to win a graded stakes this year, other than the one win by SNS, which, leads me to the 2nd overrated race...

The Illinois derby. This is the race that created the legend of SNS, especially in the minds of the young and very impressionable. Can you believe people made him the favorite over Barbaro in the ky derby? This right there nails the illinois derby as one of the all time most overrated performances in history!
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  #51  
Old 12-18-2006, 01:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS
I am slipping!!!

At this time tomorrow night I will be out on a date with Emily! My mind is elsewhere.

Or, as I like to call her, the lobotomizer!

Keep your mind on the races tomorrow night please!
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  #52  
Old 12-18-2006, 01:15 AM
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The Indomitable DrugS The Indomitable DrugS is offline
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Like Now's win in the Gotham was circumstanical...however, it wasn't that overrated. No one ever took that horse seriously.

Sweetnorthernsaint won the Illonois Derby with a sweet trip, however, his performance was excellent in my opinion. Let's not forget, he was 2nd, with like a 108 Beyer in the Preakness, inspite of the fact he grabbed a quarter leaving the gate, and had a MUCH worse trip than Bernardini had.
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  #53  
Old 12-18-2006, 01:25 AM
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mark2061mn mark2061mn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS
Like Now's win in the Gotham was circumstanical...however, it wasn't that overrated. No one ever took that horse seriously.

Sweetnorthernsaint won the Illonois Derby with a sweet trip, however, his performance was excellent in my opinion. Let's not forget, he was 2nd, with like a 108 Beyer in the Preakness, inspite of the fact he grabbed a quarter leaving the gate, and had a MUCH worse trip than Bernardini had.

Thank you sal!

that reminds me of yet another seriously overhyped race. The preakness! Half the contenders get hurt and he walks around the track unmolested.

his performance was impressive, yes, but his figure was a fraud, in my eyes.

you know how i feel about bernardini too. someone should start a thread, the most overhyped really really good horses of the last 20 years.
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  #54  
Old 12-18-2006, 01:27 AM
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Quote:
Sweetnorthernsaint won the Illonois Derby with a sweet trip, however, his performance was excellent in my opinion. Let's not forget, he was 2nd, with like a 108 Beyer in the Preakness, inspite of the fact he grabbed a quarter leaving the gate, and had a MUCH worse trip than Bernardini had.
By the way, speaking of SNS, is it true that they are shopping for another optional claiming race for him?

Last edited by mark2061mn : 12-18-2006 at 01:51 AM.
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  #55  
Old 12-18-2006, 01:40 AM
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The Indomitable DrugS The Indomitable DrugS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indian Charlie
his performance was impressive, yes, but his figure was a fraud, in my eyes.
Guess again,

His figure was originally a 118 and later reduced to a 113. The day before, Invasor was originally given a 113 for his Pimlico Special win...and ended up getting a 108.

I believe the reasoning behind the 5 point shave of both figures was because, races run at the 1 3/16th mile distance at Pimlico have historically came back faster than expected.

FWIW, these same two horses ran 1-2 in the Breeders Cup Classic in November. The 3rd place finisher in that race won a Grade 1 by a city block in his next start. They are good horses.

If anything, the Preakness figure was a bit low, and, since when have speed figures meant anything to you? This is a new development tonight.
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  #56  
Old 12-18-2006, 01:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indian Charlie
By the way, speaking of SNS, is it true that they are shopping for another optional claiming race for him?

Yeah---maybe they can work out a match race with him and Bright One.

SNS's winter goal is the $1 million Sunshine Million Classic, he is preping for it in a Graded Stake at GP on opening weekend---where, I believe he will meet John Ward's Strong Contender.

Last edited by The Indomitable DrugS : 12-18-2006 at 02:02 AM.
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  #57  
Old 12-18-2006, 02:22 AM
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all races involving Lava Man

Tin Man Million

Henny Hughes races
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  #58  
Old 12-18-2006, 02:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattleallstar
all races involving Lava Man

Tin Man Million

Henny Hughes races
All races involving Discreet Cat.
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  #59  
Old 12-18-2006, 02:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS
Yeah---maybe they can work out a match race with him and Bright One.

SNS's winter goal is the $1 million Sunshine Million Classic, he is preping for it in a Graded Stake at GP on opening weekend---where, I believe he will meet John Ward's Strong Contender.

He should take on Ward's best 3yo, Dr. Pleasure instead!
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  #60  
Old 12-18-2006, 02:54 AM
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The Indomitable DrugS The Indomitable DrugS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmorioles
All races involving Discreet Cat.
You brought it on yourself CJ......

More rehasing of old DrugS posts from elsewhere.....the 2nd "copy-paste" special of mine in this thread...

Discreet Cat VS Ghostzapper through their 3-year-old seasons

Career debut:

Discreet Cat: 1st by 3.5 lengths, 106 Beyer, 0 on Thoro-Graph
Ghostzapper: 1st by 9 lengths, 99 Beyer, 2 on Thoro-Graph


Record through 3yo season:

Discreet Cat: 6-6-0-0
Ghostzapper: 6-4-0-1


Top Career Beyer Through 3yo season:

Discreet Cat: 116
Ghostzapper 116

Worst Beyer of career:

Discreet Cat: 106
Ghostzapper: (3 times under 100)

Top Career Thoro-Graph figure through 3yo season:

Discreet Cat: -4.5 in Spa ALW, -4.75 in Jerome, ? for Cigar Mile
Ghostzapper: -4.5 in Vosburgh. By far his top

Grade 1 wins:

Discreet Cat: 1
Ghostzapper: 1

Number of starts around two-turns:

Discreet Cat: 0
Ghostzapper: 0

Why have the connections been shy to route these horses at a Classic distance:

Discreet Cat: Sire throws milers, dam was a speed mudder
Ghostzapper: Dam dropped confirmed sprinter City Zip

Both have falsly diagnosed pedigrees, and are absolutely bred to be speed routers.

The big difference: Connections:

Discreet Cat: Fools who think it's best to keep a horse in Dubai all winter
Ghostzapper: The magical Bobby Frankel

Conclusion: These horses are VERY similar through there 3-year-old season. Discreet Cat obviously holds the edge to this point----however, even being lightly raced, it's VERY unlikely he will make a big jump in form during his 4yo season like GZ did.

Discreet Cat is about to spend his 2ND entire winter in Dubai.
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