Pletcher ... Same Old Story

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

To each his own. I would rather do great all the time rather than be mediocre most of the time and have one big moment.

I wouldn't call Gomez's riding "great all the time." That's for sure...

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

To each his own. I would rather do great all the time rather than be mediocre most of the time and have one big moment.

Would you rather be Jeter or A-Rod?

Calvin is far from a mediocre jockey. Take away the woman problems he's had throughout his career and you could make a case that he's one of the top 20 jocks in the game.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

I wouldn't call Gomez's riding "great all the time." That's for sure...

He's the leading rider in the country for the second year in a row. If he's not a great rider, I'd like to know who is. He is doing great all the time. He's winning millions in purses every single month. I bet he doesn't have a single month where his mounts earn less than $1 million.

You guys are a tough crowd. You guys are very hard to please. Even being the best in the country is not good enough for you. I hope you're not that hard on yourself. If you got an "A" on a test, would you be upset if you got 98% but not 100%?

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Would you rather be Jeter or A-Rod?

I used to be a huge baseball fan years ago but I'm really not any more. I know both of those guys are great players but I really don't know enough about their numbers to give an opinion. From what I do know, I would have to think that's it's a pretty close call.

I don't really think comparing those two guys is like comparing Pletcher to Shirreffs. Pletcher's horses are making over $20 million a year. Shireffs' horses probably make closer to $3 million a year. I think there is a much bigger gap between Pletcher and the other trainers than there is between Jeter and A-Rod.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

Calvin is far from a mediocre jockey. Take away the woman problems he's had throughout his career and you could make a case that he's one of the top 20 jocks in the game.

If he's Top 20, that is certainly very good. But there is still a huge difference between being #20 and being #1.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

He's the leading rider in the country for the second year in a row. If he's not a great rider, I'd like to know who is. He is doing great all the time. He's winning millions in purses every single month. I bet he doesn't have a single month where his mounts earn less than $1 million.

You guys are a tough crowd. You guys are very hard to please. Even being the best in the country is not good enough for you. I hope you're not that hard on yourself. If you got an "A" on a test, would you be upset if you got 98% but not 100%?

Yes.

With that said, not knocking Gomez, but he has had his fair share of questionable rides.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Yes.

With that said, not knocking Gomez, but he has had his fair share of questionable rides.

Nobody is perfect. Tiger Woods has bad tournaments sometimes. But overall, these guys are the best. Over the course of the year, they are consistently the best. That's what it means to be the best. It doesn't mean that they are perfect. It doesn't mean that they don't make mistakes. It just means that over the course of the entire year, they are better than everyone else.

By the way, I find it hard to believe that you would be upset if you got 98% on a test in college.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Nobody is perfect. Tiger Woods has bad tournaments sometimes. But overall, these guys are the best. Over the course of the year, they are consistently the best. That's what it means to be the best. It doesn't mean that they are perfect. It doesn't mean that they don't make mistakes. It just means that over the course of the entire year, they are better than everyone else.

By the way, I find it hard to believe that you would be upset if you got 98% on a test in college.

If I got a 98% on a test, the red sea usually parted at the exact same time and that meant I could take the next month off of school

[Scurlogue Champ]

Originally Posted by philcski

Won a Derby.
End of story.

I would rather never have a Derby starter and have a stable half as good as Pletcher/Frankel.

And I would rather be in Gomez's shoes on a bad day than Calvin's on a good one.

Originally Posted by moodwalker

I would rather never have a Derby starter and have a stable half as good as Pletcher/Frankel.

And I would rather be in Gomez's shoes on a bad day than Calvin's on a good one.

It's tough to choose between being in Gomez or Borel's shoes. One taste of the yay and Gomez is broke again. If you choose to be in Borel's shoes you get that Cajun drawl and love your mama a little more than most would.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by moodwalker

I would rather never have a Derby starter and have a stable half as good as Pletcher/Frankel.

And I would rather be in Gomez's shoes on a bad day than Calvin's on a good one.

I agree 100%.

[Bigsmc]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Charlie Whittingham finally won a Derby towards the end of his career with Ferdinand. What if the rail didn't open for Shoemaker and Ferdinand in that race? Then Whittingham would have never won a Derby. That wouldn't make him any less of a trainer.

I don't know the numbers off hand, but how many Derby starters did Whittingham have? What is his win percentage in the Derby vs. Pletcher?

My memory is not good, but The Bald Eagle did not ship East unless he knew he had a big shot.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by moodwalker

I would rather never have a Derby starter and have a stable half as good as Pletcher/Frankel.

And I would rather be in Gomez's shoes on a bad day than Calvin's on a good one.

And run 6th, 8th, 9th, 16th, and 20th? No thanks.

Why?? Money isn't everything. The guy was one of the leading riders in Kentucky, and has been for quite a while. He does QUITE well for himself. He also has something that Gomez (and all other jockeys) would kill for, a win in the Kentucky Derby.

Ask John Velazquez whether he'd rather have his riding title from Saratoga or a win in the Kentucky Derby, and I guarantee the answer would be the Derby.

[Danzig]

i bet pletcher would give up a lot of those millions and riding titles to have derby win next to his name. history is kind to those who win the big ones. and as the years go by, the pressure will only mount.
is it fair? maybe not. but it's the way it is. even those who know nothing, care nothing, about horse racing have heard of the derby. it's the race. and the longer todd goes without, the more he'll want it. those who win all, set records, have legions of fans, admit that the big one is the one that means the most. the superbowl for football, the world series, the daytona 500, and the kentucky derby....

[timmgirvan]

and the July 4th Nathans World Championship Hot Dog eating Contest

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i bet pletcher would give up a lot of those millions and riding titles to have derby win next to his name. history is kind to those who win the big ones. and as the years go by, the pressure will only mount.
is it fair? maybe not. but it's the way it is. even those who know nothing, care nothing, about horse racing have heard of the derby. it's the race. and the longer todd goes without, the more he'll want it. those who win all, set records, have legions of fans, admit that the big one is the one that means the most. the superbowl for football, the world series, the daytona 500, and the kentucky derby....

I don't understand this. You are acting as though Todd has been training for 28 years and has never won a BC race or a Triple Crown race. Believe me, I am not carrying pom poms for him, and find the size of his stable troubling, but make no mistake.....he will win probably more than one Kentucky Derby, as well as Triple Crown races, and most likely sooner than later. History will most likely remember him as a trainer who won pretty much every Grade 1 race in America...including the ones in the Triple Crown.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

If he's Top 20, that is certainly very good. But there is still a huge difference between being #20 and being #1.

I remember when Gomez was riding at Sunland Park a few years ago---right before he went to jail infact---his dominance for the short time he was there was off-the-charts.

He was by far the most underrated jockey in Southern California earlier this decade...when he always struggled to make the top 10...and people would argue with you that Jose Valdiva is "far better" than him.

I haven't seen any improvement in his riding throughout this decade....funny what happens when you consistantly get better stock. Going into 2005, VERY few people would have rated him a top 20 jockey.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I don't understand this. You are acting as though Todd has been training for 28 years and has never won a BC race or a Triple Crown race. Believe me, I am not carrying pom poms for him, and find the size of his stable troubling, but make no mistake.....he will win probably more than one Kentucky Derby, as well as Triple Crown races, and most likely sooner than later. History will most likely remember him as a trainer who won pretty much every Grade 1 race in America...including the ones in the Triple Crown.

Exactly right, he's been training what, 6-7 years now? And still no derby winner? He sure is held to a high standard.

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

Exactly right, he's been training what, 6-7 years now? And still no derby winner? He sure is held to a high standard.

December 1995.