mccain's vp

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by pgardn

I plan to off myself before this happens.

A lot of people say that, but they don't follow through with it.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by pgardn

As much as I would like to have a stronger middle class.
You cant make it happen through government.
That is really the point.

Scandanavia is probably a very bad example being so homogenous...

I don't know why being homogenous would make the difference you seem to think it does. They've made a stronger middle class through government, and they are doing fine. Maybe what you should be saying is we need to get some of our social problems taken care of(be more responsible parents, and stop breeding criminals.) Probably no economic plan is gunna work when you have men letting women raise kids alone. BTW, if Conservatives had it their way, you wouldn't be Middle Class(as a teacher.) You wouldn't have a good retirement system either. What kind of retirement system do teachers have in these private schools (the schools Conservatives got such a hard on for.) Seems government has enabled you to be middle class. So, don't tell me you can't strengthen the middle class through government. You're a perfect example of it. You'd be struggling to make it with just private school pay.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Really it is not important except in dealing with social issues that dont affect most of the country. .. When was the last really groundbreaking thing that passed through the supreme court?

I would not look forward to 20 years of strict constitutionalism that would have a good chance of changing the past 35 years.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Why do you stick to this worn out elitist myth that supply side economics actually works? Check out the relationship between production and wages from 1980 until today and you tell me that it has been fair to the working class. Inflation adjusted wages have barely moved in the last 30 years while the price of everything has gone up significantly. During the same period of time, check out the rate in which CEO wages have risen. Bottom line? American production has increased but nothing has "trickled down".

So you bring up the cliche of the overextended middle class begging for handouts and living beyond their means while not addressing how it got to be this way and why the trend has been exasperated over the last thirty years. Bring out FACTS not cliches.

If you want to bring up Obama, the FACT is that tax wise, 95% of the population will benefit from his plan.

i know i'm exasperated.

and obamas plan is to continue bushes tax cuts, essentially keep the whole tax scheme we've had in place, so i don't know what plan he's got you think is going to change things. of course once some of those tax cuts expire, he's probably going to jack them up to pay for all those new programs he's tossing out there like cheap candy to a baby. not sure how tax increases and new social programs that the middle class has to pay for won't exacerbate the whole less money from your pay check problem.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Riot

I would not look forward to 20 years of strict constitutionalism that would have a good chance of changing the past 35 years.

i don't see that happening, regardless of who wins the election. they'd never make it through the process to get on the bench. nominating isn't the same as naming a judge.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Yeah the poor American worker. Like the ones that are driving American automakers out of business because of unskilled labor making $100 an hour and retiring at 50? American companies are to blame for the plight of the poor american worker forced to use their credit cards to buy flat screen tv's. The ones who drive $50000 leased cars and were victims of the awful mortgage men who tricked them into believing they too could live in a $400k house on $38000 a year. What exactly is the % of American companies that have foreign operations?

Your solution is to elect Obama to tax the heck out of the rich to keep up with that out of control govt spending?

Real world is living within your means and stop blaming the someone else for all your problems when those means are exceeded.

remember now cannon, when you say anything 'republican', it's elitist mythical republican talking points, but if you state anything 'democratic', you're an intelligent open minded person who has seen the light.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i know i'm exasperated.

and obamas plan is to continue bushes tax cuts, essentially keep the whole tax scheme we've had in place, so i don't know what plan he's got you think is going to change things. of course once some of those tax cuts expire, he's probably going to jack them up to pay for all those new programs he's tossing out there like cheap candy to a baby. not sure how tax increases and new social programs that the middle class has to pay for won't exacerbate the whole less money from your pay check problem.

You dont know his plan.

Factcheck.org

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

You dont know his plan.

Factcheck.org

I was just looking at factcheck... Now Obama DID vote for a measure to take taxes back to the pre-2001 level. (which would have moved the 25% bracket back to 28%).

Now he's proposing tax cuts for those levels, which is a flip flop... but I'd rather him flip flop this way...

Here are both candidates plan...

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/numbe...cfm?DocID=1839

The BIGGEST differences in the two plans, IMO, is that McCain wants to lower corporate tax $ and Obama wants to raise corporate tax $$..

The question I have... is if we increase taxes on corporations will us as Employees have less opportunities to get raises and better pay because my company will have less $$?

[geeker2]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I was just looking at factcheck... Now Obama DID vote for a measure to take taxes back to the pre-2001 level. (which would have moved the 25% bracket back to 28%).

Now he's proposing tax cuts for those levels, which is a flip flop... but I'd rather him flip flop this way...

Here are both candidates plan...

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/numbe...cfm?DocID=1839

The BIGGEST differences in the two plans, IMO, is that McCain wants to lower corporate tax $ and Obama wants to higher corporate tax $$..

The question I have... is if we increase taxes on corporations will us as Employees have less opportunities to get raises and better pay because my company will have less $$?

good research! one other question

the corporate tax also hits the small business people...that are not typically thought of when you talk of Corporate Tax. How would this effect them and their employment plans and their ability to provide good salaries and raises?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i don't see that happening, regardless of who wins the election. they'd never make it through the process to get on the bench. nominating isn't the same as naming a judge.

I do. As a lifelong registered Republican who has never voted for a Democratic president or senator in my life, I'm done with the uberconservative bullshit. The GOP screwed McCain, and insulted my intelligence, forcing that useless VP choice on him. Over the past many years, although I've liked the guy, I have never seen McCain as presidential material. And he still isn't.

I can't wait to cast my vote for Obama this go round.

[Mortimer]

Originally Posted by Riot

I do. As a lifelong registered Republican who has never voted for a Democratic president or senator in my life, I'm done with the uberconservative bullshit. The GOP screwed McCain, and insulted my intelligence, forcing that useless VP choice on him. Over the past many years, although I've liked the guy, I have never seen McCain as presidential material. And he still isn't.

I can't wait to cast my vote for Obama this go round.

Spoken like a true jumping bean.....or do you prefer setting yourself on fire and jumping through hoops?

[dalakhani]

[quote=Antitrust32]I was just looking at factcheck... Now Obama DID vote for a measure to take taxes back to the pre-2001 level. (which would have moved the 25% bracket back to 28%).

Now he's proposing tax cuts for those levels, which is a flip flop... but I'd rather him flip flop this way...

Here are both candidates plan...

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/numbe...cfm?DocID=1839

The BIGGEST differences in the two plans, IMO, is that McCain wants to lower corporate tax $ and Obama wants to raise corporate tax $$..

The question I have... is if we increase taxes on corporations will us as Employees have less opportunities to get raises and better pay because my company will have less $$?[/QUOTE]

Raises and better pay? Again, inflation adjusted, the only wages that have gone up in relationship to production over the last 30 years are CEO wages. Average wages adjusted for inflation have remained flat.

As far as far as tax policy, it is proven that Obama's plan IS NOT the same as McCain's. I will post the differences in a second.

[Mortimer]

You couldn't post the same in a second.

[geeker2]

Originally Posted by Mortimer

Spoken like a true jumping bean.....or do you prefer setting yourself on fire and jumping through hoops?

Despite our differences, much more unites us than divides us. We are fellow Americans, an association that means more to me than any other .

How can you argue with that

[geeker2]

Originally Posted by Mortimer

You couldn't post the same in a second.

I wish someone would post the recipe for success...

[Mortimer]

Originally Posted by geeker2

Despite our differences, much more unites us than divides us. We are fellow Americans, an association that means more to me than any other .

How can you argue with that

I can say that vomit inducing posts do not become you.

[Mortimer]

Originally Posted by geeker2

I wish someone would post the recipe for success...

How?

Commercials have taught us to spell Relief.....R-O-L-A-I-D-S.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Raises and better pay? Again, inflation adjusted, the only wages that have gone up in relationship to production over the last 30 years are CEO wages. Average wages adjusted for inflation have remained flat.

As far as far as tax policy, it is proven that Obama's plan IS NOT the same as McCain's. I will post the differences in a second.

I never ever said they were the same plan... and I posted both of the two plans with the link. I said IMO the biggest difference was the Corporate taxes.

If I got a 6% raise this year.. and next year my corporate company will have less $$ because they are paying more taxes.. Will I only get a 3% raise next year?

If that is the case I'd much rather have the higher raise than the $502 I'll save with Obamas tax plan.

I really have no clue how it will effect that.

[geeker2]

Originally Posted by Mortimer

I can say that vomit inducing posts do not become you.

Must have been the excitement that you have returned...but I digest.

[Mortimer]

Originally Posted by geeker2

Must have been the excitement that you have returned...but I digest.

Good one...thank you so much.

I return only to leave...I want one last shot at all the fucl< faces here.