Best Maiden Race of the meet so far...

[jms62]

2.3 million piece of deuce.. As I said what kind of moron would buy a horse for 2.3 million

[Betsy]

Obviously I don't know how good the race will turn out to be, but I'm certainly happy with Bernardini's 5th winner. The time was a lot slower than Bulldogger's, but I don't need to see a 2 year old by Bernardini running that fast. He's speedy - not sure how far he'd want to go, but we'll find out.

[JerseyJ]

I can't wait to bet against this horse next time...he practically crawled on the lead and beat a bunch of horses who are going to be bet againsts next time out. A McPeek no hoper who was 31-1 was 2nd in this group. Hell, 15K NW2L Filly and Mare Claimers set a quicker pace than him...I think this ends up being a big time negative key race.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by JerseyJ

I can't wait to bet against this horse next time...he practically crawled on the lead and beat a bunch of horses who are going to be bet againsts next time out. A McPeek no hoper who was 31-1 was 2nd in this group. Hell, 15K NW2L Filly and Mare Claimers set a quicker pace than him...I think this ends up being a big time negative key race.

I played a whacky tri and was sick of my bad ticket structure
11/5,8,9/all/... Anyway the point is, I think the 8 ran well. I also think the 9 will be ok.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by JerseyJ

I can't wait to bet against this horse next time...he practically crawled on the lead and beat a bunch of horses who are going to be bet againsts next time out. A McPeek no hoper who was 31-1 was 2nd in this group. Hell, 15K NW2L Filly and Mare Claimers set a quicker pace than him...I think this ends up being a big time negative key race.

That filly claiming race was at 6 1/2 furlongs though and you know the times are screwy at that distance at Saratoga. Seems like the track got slow as the day went on.

I think there are going to be a few next out winners out of the race. Orsonian ran well with some trouble. Was slammed at the start then rank early as he seemed to not like dirt in his face. When he finally got running he closed well and while he might not have beaten the winner, he was probably second best. He's going to win next out.

Magnet Cove got hit pretty hard on both sides coming out of the gate and flew home. Should be dangerous going two turns next time. Brock ran too bad to be true. Fair Whit battled, at least a little down the lane and seeing an improved run out of him next time should be expected. The same could be said for Eltheeb who ran like a horse that wants to go farther.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

That filly claiming race was at 6 1/2 furlongs though and you know the times are screwy at that distance at Saratoga. Seems like the track got slow as the day went on.

I think there are going to be a few next out winners out of the race. Orsonian ran well with some trouble. Was slammed at the start then rank early as he seemed to not like dirt in his face. When he finally got running he closed well and while he might not have beaten the winner, he was probably second best. He's going to win next out.

Magnet Cove got hit pretty hard out on both sides coming out of the gate and flew home. Should be dangerous going two turns next time. Brock ran too bad to be true. Fair Whit battled, at least a little down the lane and seeing an improved run out of him next time should be expected. The same could be said for Eltheeb who ran like a horse that wants to go farther.

Can you please use numbers, so I dont have to go back and check out who your talking about. Numbers would be easier, already in mind from seeing the race 4x.

[hockey2315]

Dude just go to the first page of this thread. The 5 is Orsonian - I agree w/ Hoss about him.

[Dahoss]

If you saw the race 4x, then I imagine you saw everything that I'm talking about already.

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by jms62

2.3 million piece of deuce.. As I said what kind of moron would buy a horse for 2.3 million

I have X and I buy a horse for Y...Dude has xxxx he will buy a horse for YYYY..It's all about the action

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

The only winner he has in a graded stake with a 2YO over the last five years is Worstcasescenario's win in the Adirondack last year. He also seems to have really stupid things happen in these races like Cribnote losing his mind, BUlls and BEars getting left, Bail Out the Cat being unprepared for the start, etc.

NT

Another brilliant training job by Violette with Bail Out the Cat today, who apparently still doesn't know how to break correctly.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

On top of these numbers:

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Rick Violette with 2yo's on dirt at Saratoga since '98:

24-for-88 (27.3%) $3.86 ROI

In 2yo dirt races at Saratoga that are 5.5fs or shorter:

15-for-41 (36.6% wins) $4.45 ROI

Here's Violette's stats with 2-year-olds at Belmont's Spring meet:

2010: 3-for-5 ($3.34 ROI)
2009: 3-for-5 ($4.62 ROI)
2008: 1-for-3 ($3.53 ROI)
2007: 2-for-6 ($4.20 ROI)
2006: 0-for-4
2005: 2-for-6 ($4.79 ROI)
2004: 2-for-6 ($4.32 ROI)

Since '04: 13-for-35 (37.1% wins)

He's also got a very good record with older turf horses at Saratoga going back a long way .. and juiced up his numbers some more with a 17/1 shot winner in yesterdays first race.

I wish all trainers were as consistant as he is in regard to the form patterns of their stable.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

On top of these numbers:



Here's Violette's stats with 2-year-olds at Belmont's Spring meet:

2010: 3-for-5 ($3.34 ROI)
2009: 3-for-5 ($4.62 ROI)
2008: 1-for-3 ($3.53 ROI)
2007: 2-for-6 ($4.20 ROI)
2006: 0-for-4
2005: 2-for-6 ($4.79 ROI)
2004: 2-for-6 ($4.32 ROI)

Since '04: 13-for-35 (37.1% wins)

He's also got a very good record with older turf horses at Saratoga going back a long way .. and juiced up his numbers some more with a 17/1 shot winner in yesterdays first race.

I wish all trainers were as consistant as he is in regard to the form patterns of their stable.

Doug, what happens to all of his first out winners though? I know Im getting really frustrated with them.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Doug, what happens to all of his first out winners though? I know Im getting really frustrated with them.

They don't develop much most of the time.

If they did - he'd be a training genius.

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

They don't develop much most of the time.

If they did - he'd be a training genius.

I really don't understand how Klarman (Klaravich stables) and William Lawrence, who are big-time finance guy who run hedge funds, think their current game plan is effective.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by hockey2315

I really don't understand how Klarman (Klaravich stables) and William Lawrence, who are big-time finance guy who run hedge funds, think their current game plan is effective.

If they sold all of these horses after their debut race - it would be a more effective game plan.

Though, after time, it would be harder to sell them I suppose.

Freddy had one who was pretty fast and could carry it well for a total cheapie - and the horse could barely even train. How does something like that develop over time? The longer you wait - the faster the sounder ones catch up. I realize the Violette/Klaravich's cost 15 to 20 times more money, but I doubt things are a lot more rosy for the durability of those horses.

[hockey2315]

Exactly. . . they could do the same thing with the type of cheap horses Wesley Ward has (I question his strategy too, though). Either spend less and continue to try to win early (with few readily apparent benefits) or spend the type of money you're spending now and try to produce an actual stakes horse or two. Either way, for the sake of RHT's bankroll, change something.

[Sightseek]

Valiant Passion was bought by Team Valor and given to Pletcher for training.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

Valiant Passion was bought by Team Valor and given to Pletcher for training.

Why not? Just another step towards every horse in the country being in one of four different barns.

NT

[ateamstupid]

Another example of why trying to 'read' workouts is useless: RudyRod's $27 winner Saltamontes in today's 2nd race at Saratoga. This filly had all of THREE printed works, a slow 4f breeze 7/21 at AQU, a middling 4f breeze 8/2 at SAR and a faster 5f gate breeze 8/12 at SAR. Based on what you saw in the works, the horse was a total pitch, but Rudy the Magic Man finds yet another way to put one over in NY.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by hockey2315

I really don't understand how Klarman (Klaravich stables) and William Lawrence, who are big-time finance guy who run hedge funds, think their current game plan is effective.

It's one of racing's great mysteries. Klarman did begin spreading horses to other barns in the last year or so which seems to indicate his frustration with that long-running game plan which produced Read the Footnotes and little else. Hell, he had as much or more success with Sciacca early on in the game on a tighter budget including with Subordination (Hollywood Derby, Eddie Read, Brooklyn, et al).