A new all time low for partisan politics

[Pants II]

Originally Posted by jms62

I apologize for only reading the first sentence of your post but anyone that is justifying members of congress reaching out to foreign countries undermine the President of the United States is advocating treason in my mind. We have had many presidents in our history that many disagreed with but this is the first time I can recall something like this happening. Any bullshit propaganda you post for advocating treason doesn't change the facts.

It's a terrible deal that threatens our national security. They will be allowed to make centrifuges in an impenetrable bunker.

I grow tired of the disingenuous pandering and upholding of the constitution for a guy who has completely shat all over it.

If you want to play the 'treason' game then you're going down a dangerous path.

What happens to those of you who went on a witchhunt of these congressman if dirty bombs are detonated in multiple western cities?

That's right. Nothing. Because most traitors will never be held accountable.

I will never support an office just for the sake of it. Especially one that doesn't follow the law of the land.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Pants II

It's a terrible deal that threatens our national security. They will be allowed to make centrifuges in an impenetrable bunker.

I grow tired of the disingenuous pandering and upholding of the constitution for a guy who has completely shat all over it.

If you want to play the 'treason' game then you're going down a dangerous path.

What happens to those of you who went on a witchhunt of these congressman if dirty bombs are detonated in multiple western cities?

That's right. Nothing. Because most traitors will never be held accountable.

I will never support an office just for the sake of it. Especially one that doesn't follow the law of the land.

Then which president did you LAST support?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jms62

I apologize for only reading the first sentence of your post but anyone that is justifying members of congress reaching out to foreign countries undermine the President of the United States is advocating treason in my mind. We have had many presidents in our history that many disagreed with but this is the first time I can recall something like this happening. Any bullshit propaganda you post for advocating treason doesn't change the facts.

Yep. Even if you disagree with the man, orr hate him, you are supposed to respect the office. I think their actions completely embarrassed this country at the very least. Inviting a foreign head of state to give that speech is a new low...the letter to Iran showed they were determined to race to the bottom. That trying to produce gotcha moments is more important than this country, its standing. Its a disgrace.

[Pants II]

Originally Posted by jms62

Then which president did you LAST support?

Well I can only go back to 4 elections so that would be a big fat zero since I didn't vote for the winner at any time.

And that's me being naive and a rebel early on. Turned out I wasn't so naive and my instincts were right.

I just find it charming that the office demands respect when they can't even honor a basic ****ing oath.

But then again Americans have been conditioned to be wobbly-kneed compromising, excuse-making pansies.

We're headed towards a civil war. If only it would eliminate the paradigm idiots and spare the rest. Then maybe something could be accomplished.

[bigrun]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I can't figure out why anyone would want to undermine the President on this great plan. Why would they want to undermine a disastrous plan where the President intentionally bypasses Congress? I can't figure it out. I'm sure they're just doing it to be mean, not to try to undermine a potentially catastrophic plan (a plan which he has no right to implement unilaterally, even if it was a good plan).

Obama does whatever he wants. He obviously doesn't believe in checks and balances. It was the same thing with immigration. He decided that he didn't need congress. He would just do it on his own. It's lucky for us that Obama is a genius and he is always right. I totally trust him to do whatever he wants.

Here is a little info on his great plan. Obama is a great negotiator:

http://freebeacon.com/national-secur...omes-together/

And in case any of you were wondering whether I would want a Republican President to just do whatever he wants when it comes to immigration and foreign policy, regardless of whether congress and the majority of US citizens are against the plans, the answer is "no".

Originally Posted by jms62

Any bullshit propaganda you post for advocating treason doesn't change the facts.

jim is right on rupe and you know it..

And other country leaders are offering help.

MARCH 10, 2015
Kim Jong-un Feels Snubbed by Absence of Letter from Republicans.

The North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un said on Tuesday that he feels “snubbed” by the decision of forty-seven Republican senators to write a letter to Iran but not to him, the official North Korean news agency reported.




TEHRAN (The Borowitz Report)—Stating that “their continuing hostilities are a threat to world peace,” Iran has offered to mediate talks between congressional Republicans and President Obama.

Iran’s Supreme Leader, Ali Khamenei, made the offer one day after Iran received what he called a “worrisome letter” from Republican leaders, which suggested to him that “the relationship between Republicans and Obama has deteriorated dangerously.”

[Rupert Pupkin]

I wonder if you guys even know what the letter said. Obama is trying to make a deal with Iran without getting any input form congress. It's not just the republicans in congress that are against this deal. Plenty of democrats are against it including the highest ranking democrat on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

So Obama is trying to make this deal by executive action, meaning that congress has no input. Congress is totally against the deal. When something like this is done by executive action, congress can't stop it. But once Obama leaves office, the next administration can nix the deal with the strike of a pen. That is the negative about doing a deal by executive action.

Anyway, all the 47 Senators did in their letter was to explain this to Iran. They explained to Iran how the law works here. They explained to them that this deal is being done by executive action without the support of congress and that the next administration can nix the deal.

You guys believe all the hysterics written by the liberal media when in fact the letter simply explained the law to Iran. I think it is a good thing that Iran understands that. If Obama was smart, he would only make the deal with congressional approval and get them to sign off on it. Then the next administration would not be able to nix the deal. He won't do that because he can't even get support from senate democrats for the deal, because it is obviously a bad deal.

With regard to one of you that said this is like treason, if anyone is committing treason, it would be the person trying to make this deal against the wishes of both republicans and democrats in congress.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I wonder if you guys even know what the letter said. Obama is trying to make a deal with Iran without getting any input form congress. It's not just the republicans in congress that are against this deal. Plenty of democrats are against it including the highest ranking democrat on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

So Obama is trying to make this deal by executive action, meaning that congress has no input. Congress is totally against the deal. When something like this is done by executive action, congress can't stop it. But once Obama leaves office, the next administration can nix the deal with the strike of a pen. That is the negative about doing a deal by executive action.

Anyway, all the 47 Senators did in their letter was to explain this to Iran. They explained to Iran how the law works here. They explained to them that this deal is being done by executive action without the support of congress and that the next administration can nix the deal.

You guys believe all the hysterics written by the liberal media when in fact the letter simply explained the law to Iran. I think it is a good thing that Iran understands that. If Obama was smart, he would only make the deal with congressional approval and get them to sign off on it. Then the next administration would not be able to nix the deal. He won't do that because he can't even get support from senate democrats for the deal, because it is obviously a bad deal.

With regard to one of you that said this is like treason, if anyone is committing treason, it would be the person trying to make this deal against the wishes of both republicans and democrats in congress.

Doesn't matter what the letter said and it doesn't matter how awful I believe the deal is. That is just a typical Rupert smokescreen. A violation of the Logan Act occurred and if you thing that is ok than you are exactly what is the problem with this country. Party over country and blame the other guy. I bet you didnt feel so forgiving in this scenario, I can tell you I was livid in this case also.

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2...-attacks-iran/

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by jms62

Doesn't matter what the letter said and it doesn't matter how awful I believe the deal is. That is just a typical Rupert smokescreen. A violation of the Logan Act occurred and if you thing that is ok than you are exactly what is the problem with this country. Party over country and blame the other guy. I bet you didnt feel so forgiving in this scenario, I can tell you I was livid in this case also.

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2...-attacks-iran/

Another embarrassment for this country. These polieticians so intent on making a name for themselves, they don't care about the repercussions for this country. Truly, these pols are the real 'me' generation.
How can they treat with our enemy, and then stroll home with no concerns, and no answering?
I'll tell you why. Because gore Vidal was right is why.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by jms62

Doesn't matter what the letter said and it doesn't matter how awful I believe the deal is. That is just a typical Rupert smokescreen. A violation of the Logan Act occurred and if you thing that is ok than you are exactly what is the problem with this country. Party over country and blame the other guy. I bet you didnt feel so forgiving in this scenario, I can tell you I was livid in this case also.

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2...-attacks-iran/

Well I guess you can accuse the democrats of interfering with Obama's foreign policy too. Just this week 367 bipartisan House lawmakers sent a letter to Obama warning him not to make a deal with Iran without their approval and threatening to sabotage the deal, if he makes the deal without their approval and they don't like the deal.

Is there really a big difference between what they did and what the 47 Senators did? There really isn't. Sure you can argue that the 47 Senators sent the letter directly to Iran and that makes all the difference. But that is nonsense. Don't you think Iran reads the newspaper? Even if Republicans did not send that letter to Iran, Iran would still be aware that 367 congressmen sent a letter to Obama telling him they will sabotage the deal if they don't like it. Does the Republican letter to Iran really sabotage the deal any worse than the bipartisan letter to the President which 80% of congressmen signed? Do you view those 80% of congressmen as traitors for undermining the President?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/23/politi...er-obama-iran/

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Well I guess you can accuse the democrats of interfering with Obama's foreign policy too. Just this week 367 bipartisan House lawmakers sent a letter to Obama warning him not to make a deal with Iran without their approval and threatening to sabotage the deal, if he makes the deal without their approval and they don't like the deal.

Is there really a big difference between what they did and what the 47 Senators did? There really isn't.Sure you can argue that the 47 Senators sent the letter directly to Iran and that makes all the difference. But that is nonsense. Don't you think Iran reads the newspaper? Even if Republicans did not send that letter to Iran, Iran would still be aware that 367 congressmen sent a letter to Obama telling him they will sabotage the deal if they don't like it. Does the Republican letter to Iran really sabotage the deal any worse than the bipartisan letter to the President which 80% Sure you can argue that the 47 Senators sent the letter directly to Iran and that makes all the difference. But that is nonsense.of congressmen signed? Do you view those 80% of congressmen as traitors for undermining the President?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/23/politi...er-obama-iran/

Republicans break the law so to you the law becomes "Nonsense".

Another Rupert smokescreen. Yes there is a huge difference and you know that. Your long winded steaming horseshit pontification Is just that. A steaming pile of rationalizing dung. Let me steam up a window and draw you a picture. Sending a letter to a foreign leader while in a position unauthorized to do so is a violation of the Logan act. Sending a letter to the president whether it be 47 or 4700 people is not a violation of the Logan Act. Quite simple. Nonsense is just about every thing you post.

[Danzig]

The house letter is just political grandstanding. They have nothing to do with treaty ratification. President signs, and then it goes to the senate, where 2/3s have to agree.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by jms62

Republicans break the law so to you the law becomes "Nonsense".

Another Rupert smokescreen. Yes there is a huge difference and you know that. Your long winded steaming horseshit pontification Is just that. A steaming pile of rationalizing dung. Let me steam up a window and draw you a picture. Sending a letter to a foreign leader while in a position unauthorized to do so is a violation of the Logan act. Sending a letter to the president whether it be 47 or 4700 people is not a violation of the Logan Act. Quite simple. Nonsense is just about every thing you post.

When did you start working for the Daily Kosk? You accuse me of putting up a smokescreen while you are spewing all this nonsense about the Logan Act. The only people talking about the Logan Act are left-wing nuts.

You obviously need a refresher course on the Logan Act. This is from CNN: As constitutional law professor Steve Vladeck of American University said, "Every time a member of Congress does something in the foreign policy sphere that's at odds with the president, someone trots out the Logan Act," Vladeck said.

And he doesn't believe the Logan Act would hold up in court if, say, the Justice Department decided to indict Cotton -- a move everyone agrees is practically and politically completely untenable.

You (and the rest of the hysterical left) bring up an obscure law that hasn't been used since 1803 and then you accuse me of a smokescreen. Ok, whatever you say.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/10/politi...ter-logan-act/

With regard to the difference of sending a letter to Iran as compared to sending the letter to the President, yes it is technically different but the result is the same. Either way the Iranian understand that the President cannot really do this unilaterally as he wants to. If he does it unilaterally, congress may refuse to lift the sanctions. In addition, the next administration can undo the order. Explain to me how the result is any different under the two scenarios (sending the letter directly to the Iranians versus publicly sending it to Obama). Either way the Iranians learn that the deal can basically be revoked.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Danzig

The house letter is just political grandstanding. They have nothing to do with treaty ratification. President signs, and then it goes to the senate, where 2/3s have to agree.

This is not political grandstanding at all. The President is trying to make this deal by executive action without getting congressional approval (from either the House or Senate). There are sanctions that are in place right now against Iran. These sanctions were put in place by Congress. This deal would involve lifting the sanctions. The President does not have the authority to lift the sanctions. That is what the letter to the President was explaining to him. He wants to make this deal without their input. They are explaining to him that he can't do that because they will not lift the sanctions if they don't like the deal. So he better get their approval before making the deal.

How is that grandstanding and why would democrats grandstand against the President? If the President makes this deal and congress does not like the deal, do you think that congress will agree to lift the sanctions against Iran? Of course not. They will refuse to lift the sanctions. So the letter is not grandstanding. They are telling the President what is going to happen if he makes a deal that they don't like without their approval. They're not bluffing either. So it is definitely not grandstanding.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

When did you start working for the Daily Kosk? You accuse me of putting up a smokescreen while you are spewing all this nonsense about the Logan Act. The only people talking about the Logan Act are left-wing nuts.

You obviously need a refresher course on the Logan Act. This is from CNN: As constitutional law professor Steve Vladeck of American University said, "Every time a member of Congress does something in the foreign policy sphere that's at odds with the president, someone trots out the Logan Act," Vladeck said.

And he doesn't believe the Logan Act would hold up in court if, say, the Justice Department decided to indict Cotton -- a move everyone agrees is practically and politically completely untenable.

You (and the rest of the hysterical left) bring up an obscure law that hasn't been used since 1803 and then you accuse me of a smokescreen. Ok, whatever you say.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/10/politi...ter-logan-act/

With regard to the difference of sending a letter to Iran as compared to sending the letter to the President, yes it is technically different but the result is the same. Either way the Iranian understand that the President cannot really do this unilaterally as he wants to. If he does it unilaterally, congress may refuse to lift the sanctions. In addition, the next administration can undo the order. Explain to me how the result is any different under the two scenarios (sending the letter directly to the Iranians versus publicly sending it to Obama). Either way the Iranians learn that the deal can basically be revoked.

Bye Rupert

[bigrun]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

When did you start working for the Daily Kosk? You accuse me of putting up a smokescreen while you are spewing all this nonsense about the Logan Act. The only people talking about the Logan Act are left-wing nuts.

You obviously need a refresher course on the Logan Act. This is from CNN: As constitutional law professor Steve Vladeck of American University said, "Every time a member of Congress does something in the foreign policy sphere that's at odds with the president, someone trots out the Logan Act," Vladeck said.

And he doesn't believe the Logan Act would hold up in court if, say, the Justice Department decided to indict Cotton -- a move everyone agrees is practically and politically completely untenable.

You (and the rest of the hysterical left) bring up an obscure law that hasn't been used since 1803 and then you accuse me of a smokescreen. Ok, whatever you say.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/10/politi...ter-logan-act/

With regard to the difference of sending a letter to Iran as compared to sending the letter to the President, yes it is technically different but the result is the same. Either way the Iranian understand that the President cannot really do this unilaterally as he wants to. If he does it unilaterally, congress may refuse to lift the sanctions. In addition, the next administration can undo the order. Explain to me how the result is any different under the two scenarios (sending the letter directly to the Iranians versus publicly sending it to Obama). Either way the Iranians learn that the deal can basically be revoked.

There ya go again rupe, sounding like a ...