Zenyatta assigned 129 pounds for Vanity

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

No, the BC Classic was their believing for almost the entire year that their claim that her being undefeated would be good enough to back into a win for HOY, then realizing their backs were up against the wall after Rachel did what she did and going to the Classic.

And after the reaction when they lost the award, it was pretty clear that they had a big sense of entitlement to that award. The way they're campaigning her this year just confirms that they didn't run her in the Classic to prove her greatness, it was to try to win an award they thought they would waltz into.

She's a special and very good animal for sure, but we're never going to know where she stands among the greats, because her connections are not willing to show us. She's a horse, that's not her fault, but in the end she also gets her legacy as nothing more than what she does as a horse, and her connections don't seem too eager to build that up. Good for them for doing what they want, but I don't want to see any more sour grapes and classless reactions like earlier this year when she loses another HOY vote after another campaign like this.

Not only all of that, but don't forget that LIS had a greater chance of beating Zenyatta in the race formerly known as the Distaff than GP did in the Classic.

I can't remember, who trained that winner in the distaff again?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by smartbid09

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion. But these comments about Zenyatta are so weird to me. I am looking very forward to seeing Zenyatta run. She is attempting to make racing history sunday. Only one other horse in america will ever have won more races than Zenyatta while undefeated. That's Huge.

Zenyatta is not responsible for what races she runs in. She's a horse. On Sunday she will attempt to make history and there are people here saying they're not going to watch it. They're entitled to do what they want. But in my opinion it's really dumb to miss out on a historic race because you dislike her campaign. History is history - and one way or another Sunday's race will be a race people will talk about for years to come.

Don't miss history because you hate a horse's campaign.

There is a wide chasm between truly great achievement and notable achievement. In my eyes and the eyes of others who have at least some sense of the history of the sport this streak that she has been on is a really nice accomplishment. However simply beating up on the same group of mediocre fillies in the same fairly non-descript stakes over a synthetic surface just isn't in the same league as true greatness. This and her previous campaigns were seemingly contrived with only keeping this inane streak alive by rarely venturing out of the comfort zone of the California filly division.

The fact that she is carrying a little bit of weight gives the race a little bit of intrigue but the opponents that she is beating are non-descript to be kind. What further turns me off is the idea that she will continue to race in the same rut of races in her next start. Despite the older male division being terrible save a few horses the past few years, she has avoided running against those horses with one notable exception. They run a race called the Pacific Classic at Del Mar. If they insist on staying in CA then why not take a shot in there? Instead they want to make "history" and try to become the first three time winner of the Clement Hirsh. Oh boy now that is something that we all will look back on fondly.

If there is one thing that turns off people in regards to athletics, it is when talent is seemingly wasted. By continuing to take the low road Zenyatta's connections are wasting a chance to do something really special. And if she runs 3rd or worse in the Breeders Cup then everybody will look back and say was she really all that? And that is the sad part. One bad race can tarnish her reputation because despite all the wins and accomplishments, she has only one time stepped out of the box and that race that she won looks worse and worse with each passing flop of those who ran behind her that day.

[Port Conway Lane]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

All this campaign proves is that she is a little better, female version of Lavaman.

Even Lavaman had a shot at HOY if he won the Classic that year. They're taking a calculated risk that no horse will duplicate what RA did last year.

Not only do they want to keep "the streak" alive but the less wear and tear on her gives them the best chance to win the Classic.

Personally I think she'll lose this Sunday. If she does, maybe it will change their strategy.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

There is a wide chasm between truly great achievement and notable achievement. In my eyes and the eyes of others who have at least some sense of the history of the sport this streak that she has been on is a really nice accomplishment. However simply beating up on the same group of mediocre fillies in the same fairly non-descript stakes over a synthetic surface just isn't in the same league as true greatness. This and her previous campaigns were seemingly contrived with only keeping this inane streak alive by rarely venturing out of the comfort zone of the California filly division.

The fact that she is carrying a little bit of weight gives the race a little bit of intrigue but the opponents that she is beating are non-descript to be kind. What further turns me off is the idea that she will continue to race in the same rut of races in her next start. Despite the older male division being terrible save a few horses the past few years, she has avoided running against those horses with one notable exception. They run a race called the Pacific Classic at Del Mar. If they insist on staying in CA then why not take a shot in there? Instead they want to make "history" and try to become the first three time winner of the Clement Hirsh. Oh boy now that is something that we all will look back on fondly.

If there is one thing that turns off people in regards to athletics, it is when talent is seemingly wasted. By continuing to take the low road Zenyatta's connections are wasting a chance to do something really special. And if she runs 3rd or worse in the Breeders Cup then everybody will look back and say was she really all that? And that is the sad part. One bad race can tarnish her reputation because despite all the wins and accomplishments, she has only one time stepped out of the box and that race that she won looks worse and worse with each passing flop of those who ran behind her that day.

It reminds me of the year Dave Winfield became a singles hitter to try to win the batting title....or Wilt the assist leader. Only in her case they have already done that and are going for it again. At least in their cases people understood it was the end of their careers.

[parsixfarms]

Is Sheriffs so afraid of St. Trinians that he's running Zardana as a "rabbit" for Zenyatta in this race?

[slotdirt]

I don't think enough's being made of Zardana being added to this race. Since when did Zenyatta need a rabbit?

[jimmy the T]

Wilt,dave Winfield,zenyatta ? C'mon What About Pete Rose, Johnny Bench, Mickey Mantle Or Carl Yastrzemski?

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by Smooth Operator

these huge weight spreads are ridiculous.

Really?
http://www.spiletta.com/UTHOF/drfager.html

"Dr. Fager wired the field and romped home with eight lengths of daylight behind him in the Whitney Stakes. Despite giving away eighteen poinds, Dr. Fager went to post at 1-20, a New York state record.

Dr. Fager's last three races were considered to be his finest efforts. He took the Washington Park Handicap by ten lengths, setting a new world record of 1:32 1/5 for a mile, despite a burden of 134 pounds. The previous recordholder, Buckpasser, had been carrying 125 pounds. It is for this performance that Dr. Fager is best remembered. Hedevar was among the defeated.

The next time out, he met Advocator, a classic placed son of Round Table, as well as two time Turf Champion, future Horse of the Year, and millionaire Fort Marcy, in the United Nations Handicap. It was Dr. Fager's first and only start on the turf, but he pulled off an impressively game victory, winning by a hard gained neck.

In Dr. Fager's final start, he topped of his career by carrying 139 pounds to a new seven furlong track record at Aqueduct. It was his second victory in the seven furlong Vosburgh Handicap. The half mile, with Kissin' George forcing the pace, flew by in :43 4/5. The time at the six furlong mark was 1:07 4/5, which broke the track record. The final time was 1:20 1/5, a full second faster than the previous track record and only a fifth off the world record. Dr. Fager had cemented his position in history."

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I don't think enough's being made of Zardana being added to this race. Since when did Zenyatta need a rabbit?

Rabbit? What's a rabbit? SHE WORKED TOO FAST TO SHIP, FOOL.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Blah blah blah. She's not doing anything new, so why's it so great that she's still running? She might as well be retired. It's nice that you were there for her BC win and it's nice that she has fans in California, but the rest of us couldn't give two shts about that right now. We want to see her challenged, not do the same damn boring thing three years in a row.

Again, they want best in show, not HOY.

[slotdirt]

People who bitch about Zenyatta carrying too much weight need to take a look at a history book. How much did Phar Lap carry and give in his day? Kelso? Spectacular Bid? If she's going to be considered by her fans to be an all time great, the horse needs to be treated like one.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

I dont think that is true.

They lost focus when RA faltered and had no back up plan to get to the Breeders Cup.

what does this even mean? or how does it make sense?

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

what does this even mean? or how does it make sense?

Fair questions.
It makes no sense whatsoever.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

People who bitch about Zenyatta carrying too much weight need to take a look at a history book. How much did Phar Lap carry and give in his day? Kelso? Spectacular Bid? If she's going to be considered by her fans to be an all time great, the horse needs to be treated like one.

those were great horses..she is exceptional for her time but as ateam said
you will never be in the same page as them with the continuation of the
poly program..race vs the same ones in your back yard..peppers pride #2

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

those were great horses..she is exceptional for her time but as ateam said
you will never be in the same page as them with the continuation of the
poly program..race vs the same ones in your back yard..peppers pride #2

Because of Zenyatta's performances in the Breeders' Cup, these comparisons are really hyperbole. That being said, the manner in which her connections are campaigning her this year is truly disappointing and will tarnish her legacy if she is unable to pull off a BC Classic repeat.

[Thunder Gulch]

She is the greatest synthetic track runner in the 5 year proliferation of synthetic tracks in the US. That's about all we can feel reasonably comfortable stating. Her place among the "greats" of racing in America just can't be confirmed with the evidence we have.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Really? You weren't expecting this?

I don't see how that's possible.

Why would they change their actions after all this time? Because they said they would?

I really thought it was possible, and I don't think I'm alone in this. Others must have felt the same because the response to their staying at Del Mar this summer would have been far less if it were expected to begin with.

Honestly, I thought her first start would be in California followed by the Apple Blossom. From there, I really felt they would do something different. I expected them to run in the Hollywood Gold Cup. I thought they would find the middle ground between shipping East like they should, and staying home to race against the same fillies/mares by running there. But they did not.

When this year began, I was ready to give Zenyatta a fair shot provided they shipped around and had fun. But they aren't, and that stinks, and as a racing fan, I feel cheated.

[miraja2]

I'm no huge fan of Zenyatta, but I really wish people would stop mentioning her in the same sentence with that New Mexico rat. Yeah, it wasn't a very good BCC field, and yeah it was on a synthetic surface, and yeah the "top-tier" Cali fillies and mares she has pounded most of her career aren't great, but come on. She has at least been running in G1 races where any filly and mare in the country could show up to run against her, and twice they have ventured out of the state in search of actual competition. Sure we'd all like to see them do that with her more often, but they deserve at least some credit for doing it on those occasions.
Comparing her to that record-holding slug who plugged along her entire career against bottom-tier talent - even if it is just to make a point about beating up on the same competition - really just seems unfair.

They deserve nothing but derision. F.uck them.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

could it be that people are tired of hearing how fng great she is..if you have the tvg network you will hear at nausium ' i broke out my police album' whats the name of that one todd.. zenyatta m..they act as though she is the best horse in training..she is not..her accompishments will allways have an * next to it..period.