Founding fathers liked taxed government health care

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

I think we can learn a lot from why physicians are refusing Medicare in fact it gives us a look at what a catastrophe Government involvement in the private sector would be. For starters:

Perhaps you could review the PPACA ("Obamacare") and see how it addresses problems with Medicare reimbursements, and the stability of the Medicare program, as it does make some changes:

Here's the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patient...dable_Care_Act

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

So you support and are happy about what Obama specifically asked for in his State of the Union speech this month, tort reform? Good for those liberals, huh?

GP's don't pay alot in malpractice insurance, btw (compared to OB-GYN, for example) so I don't think threat of litigation is a huge obstruction to doctors choosing to go into general practice versus ortho, ER, internal medicine, etc.

I guess now is a better time for a "are you f-ing kidding me??" moment.

oh well that is so awesome that Obama talked about tort reform in his SOTU speech in 2011 a full year after him and the other liberals shoved an unwanted bill down Americans throats (& not using any integrity in the process) that did NOT include tort reform!

Golf clap for Obama to say that after the bill has gone through. Tort reform has a chance to go through if the Repubs had the senate and White House. But we have already seen that Dems cant take their hands out of lawyers pockets... so why should we possibly think its going to happen now???

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

The Supremes will probably get it April, and life will go on. With large fines for many.

FTFY

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

How many doctors does it take to care for the 32 million newly insured?

I dunno, Dell. I tried to address the doctor shortage, and was resoundingly attacked for "knowing it all".

So you go ahead and try.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

Who are insurance companies going to lose their control over dictating the practice of medicine to?

Doctors. Right now, insurance companies control what care you get, via what they will reimburse you and your doctor for.

Your doctor is limited in his treatment options, because insurance companies say, "the standard treatment for X is Y, and that's what we will pay for". If your doctor wants to do something different, you have to pay full freight for it, and patients can't afford that.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I was being very honest when I wrote that post.

Yeah, but your facts were wrong.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I guess now is a better time for a "are you f-ing kidding me??" moment.

oh well that is so awesome that Obama talked about tort reform in his SOTU speech in 2011 a full year after him and the other liberals shoved an unwanted bill down Americans throats (& not using any integrity in the process) that did NOT include tort reform!

Golf clap for Obama to say that after the bill has gone through. Tort reform has a chance to go through if the Repubs had the senate and White House. But we have already seen that Dems cant take their hands out of lawyers pockets... so why should we possibly think its going to happen now???

Clap Clap Clap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Dems idea of Tort Reform is spend spend spend.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

FTFY

$95 for an individual that you don't have to ever pay is a really big fine.

What about the small businesses that already are getting tax credits this year, and buying insurance for their employees for the first time ?

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Riot

Clearly you are the one that needs to read the healthcare bill. Did you bother to read the link I provided that showed what you feared isn't true?

No.

Let's review: you are against healthcare because you think there's a public option in there, or single payer. A government takeover of healthcare that will force us all onto Obamacare, were your words, and you're glad you won't be forced onto Obamacare.

I pointed out there was not a public option. Or single payer. There is no "forcing you onto Obamacare".

Your argument in response is that yes there could be a public option, or single payer, buried deep inside, that nobody has noticed. And I haven't either, because I've not read the whole bill.

A giant conspiracy theory to keep something progressives really wanted, but didn't get, put into the bill but kept top secret from everyone.

Even though the bill has been in the public record in it's entirety for months now, and there is no public option/single payer for you to hate about Obamacare.

Guess what? There are no "death panels", either.

Let me ask you why should my taxpaying money go into something im not going to be using? Im probably not the only one asking this question. Im not afraid to ask it either. How is someone going to pay a fine if they can't afford the insurance? Thats right lets kick them onto the streets so they don't have a roof to live under. Your trying to tell me that the American public wanted this bill approved when it got approved? Didn't the voters give the Dem party a message in November or are your just as clueless as the Dem party? The American public didnt want this bill shoved on them ye tit was because the Dems had the numbers on the Republicans when it was shoved through. Hopefully this year the Republicans take over the Senate. Lets see how our fearless Pres likes it a little of his own medicine.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

$95 for an individual that you don't have to ever pay is a really big fine.

What about the small businesses that already are getting tax credits this year, and buying insurance for their employees for the first time ?

in 2016 - a short 5 years away.

The fine is $695 per person.

A family of 3 has to pay $2,085!!!

you must make a lot of money giving dogs rabies shots to think that 695 or 2085 is an easily payable fine


Your $95 thing is extremely misleading as that only counts for 2014 & 2015. But I dont expect anything less from you. I mean, you think Social Security is just fine because we dont run out of money until 2037 and you'll be long gone by then!

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

Let me ask you why should my taxpaying money go into something im not going to be using?.

Because you live in the United States of America, and our government funds, through our taxes, programs for the common good of all. I don't get Medicaid, but I'm very happy poor children in the town where I live get healthcare.

You are entitled, via your vote, to send to Washington those that help determine those programs. If you are on the side of that you don't want to be, it's part of the freedom of living in this republic, and we've all been on "the other side". We are all funding two wars, and I'm not the least bit happy my money going there. But I have no right to opt out of paying that. Only to vote and make my voice heard.

[Antitrust32]

actually, just saying $95 is even more misleading than I originally thought!!

in 2014 & 2015, an adult who does not have health insurance will be fined $95 or 1% of their income, whichever is GREATER.

aka

only if you make $9,500 per year will you only have to pay a $95 fine.



Say you make 25k per year... thats a $250 fine for 2014 and 2015

than after 2016 and beyond (which will encompass a lot more than the two years you decided to make an uneducated comment on)

it is $695 per adult... or 2.5% of their income... whichever is GREATER

or $2085 for a family, or 2.5% of their income... whichever is GREATER


So if a family makes 50k per year combined... you will be shelling out 4% of your income to the government. that is so easy to do!

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

in 2016 - a short 5 years away.

The fine is $695 per person.

A family of 3 has to pay $2,085!!!

you must make a lot of money giving dogs rabies shots to think that 695 or 2085 is an easily payable fine


Your $95 thing is extremely misleading as that only counts for 2014 & 2015. But I dont expect anything less from you. I mean, you think Social Security is just fine because we dont run out of money until 2037 and you'll be long gone by then!

First, yes, I started with the beginning of the program - 2014 and 2015 - because that will be the fines people first will be assessed. Hopefully, during those two years, they will be able to purchase health insurance. That is the whole point - to make health insurance affordable so they will have healthcare.

Secondly, there is no penalty, no collection of unpaid fines.

So let's not be both misleading and rude and insulting to other posters. Right? Let's keep the personal insults out of it, because you're classy, right? I've highlighted all the non-insult stuff in your post, just so we can keep focused. Your insults are just extraneous personal bullshit from you.

And it is a false statement that we "run out of money" in 2037 regarding Social Security. We do not. At that point, if nothing at all is done, Social Security will still pay out, but at only 78% of what it should. That will be easily fixed, as it has in the past. There is no fear of Social Security "going broke"

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Riot

Because you live in the United States of America, and our government funds, through our taxes, programs for the common good of all. I don't get Medicaid, but I'm very happy poor children in the town where I live get healthcare.

You are entitled, via your vote, to send to Washington those that help determine those programs. If you are on the side of that you don't want to be, it's part of the freedom of living in this republic, and we've all been on "the other side". We are all funding two wars, and I'm not the least bit happy my money going there. But I have no right to opt out of paying that. Only to vote and make my voice heard.

We are in agreement about the two wars this country has no business being in. Don't know about you but im still waiting on the so-called WMD to be found. Cmon Mr Bush where are these WMD at? Maybe if some of these families wouldn't have 4 or 5 kids and just had two kids they wouldn't be poor and living off of our taxpaying money. Obviously they don't believe in birth control.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

only if you make $9,500 per year will you only have to pay a $95 fine.

But you won't pay any fine, because you will be on Medicaid or have a voucher, so you will have health insurance.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

So let's not be both misleading and rude and insulting to other posters. Right? Let's keep the personal insults out of it, because you're classy, right? I've highlighted all the non-insult stuff in your post, just so we can keep focused. Your insults are just extraneous personal bullshit from you.

yeah cause you are the world leader in classiness and being respectful.

You are probably the rudest person on this whole site, that is why people have such a problem with you. Because you pretend that you are better than everyone and are just so high class and knowledgable. You act like you've read every page of every book in the library of congress.

Well you dish it better than anyone, so man up and take it... i know you are good at that.

& I'm not being mean... I'm just being intellectually honest.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

And it is a false statement that we "run out of money" in 2037 regarding Social Security. We do not. At that point, if nothing at all is done, Social Security will still pay out, but at only 78% of what it should. That will be easily fixed, as it has in the past. There is no fear of Social Security "going broke"

maybe for people older than 65 cause they will be dead... but the rest of the country fears SS.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

yeah cause you are the world leader in classiness and being respectful.

You are probably the rudest person on this whole site, that is why people have such a problem with you. Because you pretend that you are better than everyone and are just so high class and knowledgable. You act like you've read every page of every book in the library of congress.

Well you dish it better than anyone, so man up and take it... i know you are good at that.

& I'm not being mean... I'm just being intellectually honest.

When someone points out your personal attacks and calls them classless, yet ignores your personal attacks and responds to the content of your post anyway, always best to double down and prove beyond a doubt you didn't deserve that respect

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

When someone points out your personal attacks and calls them classless, yet ignores your personal attacks and responds to the content of your post anyway, always best to double down and prove beyond a doubt you didn't deserve that respect

oooooooohhhhkaaaaay

what ever makes your brain happy.

Riot, you should move to a state that has medical marijuana. It will help your knee and your mind!

^^ see I'm giving out positive advice that is in your best interest

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

oooooooohhhhkaaaaay

what ever makes your brain happy.

Riot, you should move to a state that has medical marijuana. It will help your knee and your mind!

^^ see I'm giving out positive advice that is in your best interest

Your a nice person. Im sure Riot can tell us where all the money is going to come from to pay for this BS insurance. My guess is our brain dead and clueless Pres will take it from the military, retired military, and Social Security. Instead of of a %1.4 raise next year will be a %.5 raise. Yet alot of items a person has to have the price of it goes up.