Borel off Bird for Rachel in Preakness - Page 9

Riot · #**161** 05-07-2009, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSC

In all honesty folks, Calvin Borel was and is a very ordinary rider right up until last weekend. .

What's Borel's ROI for straight win bets?

MaTH716 · #**162** 05-07-2009, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom

Well they sell the horse out from under him, he has a shot to win triple crown(yes i said a shot not sure thing). MTB people trusted in him and he got another Derby under his belt, A triple Crown Bid and he sells out the Bird people, i'm disappointed he didn't stick by his guns and stay on Bird. The filly is great but it's a matter of principle. Has any jockey in history come off a horse by choice who was alive for TC? Borel will live to regret this no matter how many he wins with RA. Cheap shot by him, but i know it's a business, but TC try means more to me than riding a Super Filly. He may never get another shot @ TC and besides, those two derby rides he won i think he's no better than many other jockeys. Calvin Borel no class and a sell-out imo.

Come on Stan, it's not like he's jumping off a horse that was even considered a contender for the Kentucky Derby, let alone the triple crown. Reguardless of whichever horse Borel ends up on, the Mine that Bord people should be indebted to Calvin for the rest of his life. Calvin gave that horse the ideal trip and put him in a spot where he could win. If it wasn't for Calvin they would probably be on the way back to Sunland park.
As far as his kentucky Derby wins, I disagree with you. Those were two money rides he gave both times he's won the derby. One with a favorite and one with a bomb. He proved that he's a big game jock and he should have mounts in that race for years to come. He will have another chance at TC down the road. But right now he has a chance to go into the books with a filly that might eventually be considered a legend one day.

2Hot4TV · #**163** 05-07-2009, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom

If you can't see my point he has more to lose giving up aTC bid than riding RA, what happens if MTB pulls it off? Borel will be a laughing stock, if he loses on MTB then people will say he keeps his word and can be counted on, imo it's a matter of principle.

Mind the Bird isn't going to pull it off and lightning doesnt strike in the same place twice. Borel made a money making choice.............

King Glorious · #**164** 05-07-2009, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IrishofNDMan

This may sound stupid because the value of the preakness, but what are the chances that someone says screw JJ for buying RA and does whatever they can do to ensure that RA has a hell of a time winning the preakness, kind of what they did to Smarty Jones.

Sort of like what Woody Stephens had Pat Day do to Winning Colors back in 1988. She still finished a respectable third. Forty Niner was nowhere to be found.

sdjcom · #**165** 05-07-2009, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

Mind the Bird isn't going to pull it off and lightning doesnt strike in the same place twice. Borel made a money making choice.............

After what happened last Saturday at Churchill, anything is possible, and i believe MTB just might moved up again off that effort, and not bounce. not saying he will win just he will give a good account of himself, it wasn't just the inside ride, the horse has some talent.

mark2061mn · #**166** 05-07-2009, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gales0678

da hoss when was the last time the derby winner didn't have his winning jock on him in the preakness?

From the DRF:

No jockey has ever taken off a Derby winner to ride a different horse in the Preakness. The last time a jockey abandoned a Derby winner for his next race was in 1985, when Angel Cordero Jr. gave up a mount on Spend a Buck in the Jersey Derby in order to ride Track Barron in the Metropolitan Handicap the same day. In 1945, Eddie Arcaro won the Derby on Hoop Jr., but Al Snider rode Hoop Jr. one week later in the Preakness, when Arcaro opted to ride that day at Belmont Park.

blackthroatedwind · #**167** 05-07-2009, 08:11 PM

I don't have the patience ( or interest ) to read this entire thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating what has already been said, but I think it is a big mistake if they run Rachel Alexandra in the Preakness. To run her in a race she wasn't pointing for, so quickly after purchasing her, is a recipe for disaster. What's the hurry? If they really want to run in the TC then wait for the Belmont. Or else, run her in the Acorn or Mother Goose......and then the Whitney. Who exactly are the tigers she should be so worried about in there? Plus, it's four weeks before the Travers if they want to go there as well.

sdjcom · #**168** 05-07-2009, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaTH716

Come on Stan, it's not like he's jumping off a horse that was even considered a contender for the Kentucky Derby, let alone the triple crown. Reguardless of whichever horse Borel ends up on, the Mine that Bord people should be indebted to Calvin for the rest of his life. Calvin gave that horse the ideal trip and put him in a spot where he could win. If it wasn't for Calvin they would probably be on the way back to Sunland park.
As far as his kentucky Derby wins, I disagree with you. Those were two money rides he gave both times he's won the derby. One with a favorite and one with a bomb. He proved that he's a big game jock and he should have mounts in that race for years to come. He will have another chance at TC down the road. But right now he has a chance to go into the books with a filly that might eventually be considered a legend one day.

let's all not forget, Calvin had no mount in the derby, and would have had no ride if not for them. look at the money,prestige of 2nd derby they gave him.

sdjcom · #**169** 05-07-2009, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I don't have the patience ( or interest ) to read this entire thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating what has already been said, but I think it is a big mistake if they run Rachel Alexandra in the Preakness. To run her in a race she wasn't pointing for, so quickly after purchasing her, is a recipe for disaster. What's the hurry? If they really want to run in the TC then wait for the Belmont. Or else, run her in the Acorn or Mother Goose......and then the Whitney. Who exactly are the tigers she should be so worried about in there? Plus, it's four weeks before the Travers if they want to go there as well.

What's your opinion on Calvin Borel's choice to ride RA instead of MTB ?

freddymo · #**170** 05-07-2009, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I don't have the patience ( or interest ) to read this entire thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating what has already been said, but I think it is a big mistake if they run Rachel Alexandra in the Preakness. To run her in a race she wasn't pointing for, so quickly after purchasing her, is a recipe for disaster. What's the hurry? If they really want to run in the TC then wait for the Belmont. Or else, run her in the Acorn or Mother Goose......and then the Whitney. Who exactly are the tigers she should be so worried about in there? Plus, it's four weeks before the Travers if they want to go there as well.

What a NYRA homer...

freddymo · #**171** 05-07-2009, 08:31 PM

Oh courses its a mistake to race her in the Preakness.. I still think its likely she wins

PatCummings · #**172** 05-07-2009, 09:00 PM

Calvin Borel is THE reason Mine That Bird won the Derby.

Nothing says anywhere that Rachel Alexandra is a confirmed starter for the Preakness, nor that Calvin Borel WILL DEFINITELY be the named rider.

Conjecture, conjecture.

I don't comprehend the reasons earlier in this thread why people have a gross distaste for Jess Jackson.

blackthroatedwind · #**173** 05-07-2009, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdjcom

What's your opinion on Calvin Borel's choice to ride RA instead of MTB ?

I couldn't possibly care less.

blackthroatedwind · #**174** 05-07-2009, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddymo

What a NYRA homer...

I assumed that was a given.

the_fat_man · #**175** 05-07-2009, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I assumed that was a given.

Any chance they're on the turf tomorrow?

JDank34 · #**176** 05-07-2009, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasept

You never know Freddy.. It can take a ride or two to work out communication between horse and rider. Pat Kelly has told me a lot about difficult to ride horses with Naughty New Yorker as the specific horse on the topic. He isn't a horse you can throw any rider on...

During the Street Sense campaign, not that it necessarily applies the same way here, but Carl Nafzger also was very specific that Borel was his rider of choice for the Juvy/Derby/Travers winner because he was a guy that would communicate to the trainer the nuances he was experiencing on board. Nafzger wanted that so he could make adjustments in the training of the horse.

Don't disagree that they may be Ferraris and Cameros, but few of them have automatic transmissions.

Great Point Steve....It is way to assumptive to figure any jockey can/would win on RA.

philcski · #**177** 05-07-2009, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I don't have the patience ( or interest ) to read this entire thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating what has already been said, but I think it is a big mistake if they run Rachel Alexandra in the Preakness. To run her in a race she wasn't pointing for, so quickly after purchasing her, is a recipe for disaster. What's the hurry? If they really want to run in the TC then wait for the Belmont. Or else, run her in the Acorn or Mother Goose......and then the Whitney. Who exactly are the tigers she should be so worried about in there? Plus, it's four weeks before the Travers if they want to go there as well.

Has a 3yo filly ever run in the Whitney (at least in recent memory?)

PeteMugg · #**178** 05-07-2009, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Sort of like what Woody Stephens had Pat Day do to Winning Colors back in 1988. She still finished a respectable third. Forty Niner was nowhere to be found.

Exactly what I was thinking KG. Talk about riding with a purpose, and I don't mean winning the race. I could see it happening to RA.

Summer Colony a pole! · #**179** 05-07-2009, 09:59 PM

I would have loved to see Calvin stay on Mine That Bird. However, any rider will do as long as they win the Preakness.

PEOPLE, DO WE WANT A TRIPLE CROWN WINNER THIS YEAR????????

How about we give the mount back Chantal Sutherland. She won on Mine That Bird 3 times!!!! She deserves the chance. She knows the horse. Let's go Chantal, Let's go...

MaTH716 · #**180** 05-07-2009, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Summer Colony a pole!

I would have loved to see Calvin stay on Mine That Bird. However, any rider will do as long as they win the Preakness.

PEOPLE, DO WE WANT A TRIPLE CROWN WINNER THIS YEAR????????

How about we give the mount back Chantal Sutherland. She won on Mine That Bird 3 times!!!! She deserves the chance. She knows the horse. Let's go Chantal, Let's go...

I still say, if Chantal was on him in the derby, he would have been 90-1.