Weekend Stakes Beyers

[Kasept]

AQU Long Island H (G3): Inimitable Romanee 88 (Maria's Mon) H. Motion/C. DeCarlo
AQU Summer Secretary S: Watsdachances-IRE 85 (Diamond Green-FR) C. Brown/J. Castellano
AQU Three Coins Up S: Kharafa 95 (Kitalpha) T. Hills/J. Castellano

GP Millions Distaff Preview S: My Pal Chrisy 90 (Alex's Pal) M. Wolfson/J. Gonzales
GP Millions Classic Preview S: Mordi's Miracle 104 (Lawyer Ron) T. Pletcher/E. Prado
GP Juvenile Sprint S: Bolita Boyz 74 (Act of Duty) W. White/P. Lopez
GP Juvenile Filly Sprint S: Puddifoot 82 (Red Giant) E. Plesa/P. Lopez
GP Millions F&M Turf Preview S: Parranda 87 (English Channel) R. Garcia/J. Lezcano
GP Millions Turf Preview S: Bad Debt 98 (Grand Reward) M. Trombetta/J. Rosario
GP Juvenile Filly Turf S: Courtesan 74 (Street Sense) C. Clement/J. Bravo
GP Juvenile Turf S: Notyouraveragejoe 77 (Discreet Cat) S. DiMauro/P. Lopez

WO Frost King S: Flashy Margaritta 79 (Bold n' Flashy) R. Biamonte/P. Husbands

CD Cardinal H (G3): Abaco 92 (Giant's Causeway) C. McGaughey/R. Napravnik

BHP Hollywood Prevue S (G3): Shared Belief -- (Candy Ride-ARG) J. Hollendorfer/C. Nakatani
BHP Moccasin S: Bajan 71 (Speightstown) S. Callaghan/V. Espinoza

LRL Safely Kept S: Lady Sabelia 86 (Majestic Warrior) R. Graham/H. Karamanos
LRL Japan Racing Association S: Slip and Drive 86 (Artie Schiller) M. Robertson/C. Marquez
LRL City of Laurel S: Res Judicata 93 (Smarty Jones) J. Servis/K. Carmouche
LRL Geisha S: Access to Charlie 70 (Indian Charlie) L. Murray/J. Pimentel

RP Clever Trevor S: Smack Smack 80 (Closing Argument) D. Von Hemel/J. Barton

HAW Showtime Deb S: Sasy Ms Elizabeth 78 (Giacomo) L. Hellman/E. Cosme
HAW Sun Power S: Rambling Richie 80 (Lifestyle) L. Rivelli/E. Baird

[Kasept]

85 for debuting Coup de Grace (C. Brown/R. Porter)

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Kasept

85 for debuting Coup de Grace (C. Brown/R. Porter)

Sparkling debut

[Kasept]

BHP Hollywood Prevue S (G3): Shared Belief 99 (Candy Ride-ARG) J. Hollendorfer/C. Nakatani

AQU Three Coins Up S: Kharafa 95 (Kitalpha) T. Hills/J. Castellano

RP Clever Trevor S: Smack Smack 80 (Closing Argument) D. Von Hemel/J. Barton

[Monarchos1]

Anyone got a fig on the Golden Nugget S. winner?

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Monarchos1

Anyone got a fig on the Golden Nugget S. winner?

GG Golden Nugget S: Exit Stage Left 71 (Noonmark) J. Hollendorfer/R. Baze

Noonmark's first stakes winner by the way...

[Indian Charlie]

Interesting pedigree on Shared Belief. There is some good California blood in there, including the forgotten and unappreciated sire, Pirates Bounty.

This horse is quite interesting.

It's surprising that a horse this overwhelming in his performances would be:

1. Gelded
2. Debuted in Northern California
3. Sold after his debut (no idea for how much).

He wasn't even favored in his debut either!

I would love to find out more about what's likely wrong with this horse.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Interesting pedigree on Shared Belief. There is some good California blood in there, including the forgotten and unappreciated sire, Pirates Bounty.

This horse is quite interesting.

It's surprising that a horse this overwhelming in his performances would be:

1. Gelded
2. Debuted in Northern California
3. Sold after his debut (no idea for how much).

He wasn't even favored in his debut either!

I would love to find out more about what's likely wrong with this horse.

Reaching for Hollendorfer today and will get answers..

[Gate Dancer]

Loved the offspring of Pirates Bounty................here's a nice article after he passed away.............

http://archive.ctba.com/06magazine/o...mPirteBnty.pdf

[randallscott35]

Thank God for geldings or they would all be Verrazanos and gone.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Thank God for geldings or they would all be Verrazanos and gone.

A completely mistimed squawk coming on the heels of a Breeders' Cup that featured 5yo's Mucho Macho Man, Fort Larned, Justin Phillip, Point of Entry & Pants On Fire, 7yo's Flat Out & Jeranimo... Not to mention 5yo mares Royal Delta, Authenticity, Groupie Doll, Tiz Flirtacious, Marketintg Mix, Laughing & Mizdirection.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Kasept

A completely mistimed squawk coming on the heels of a Breeders' Cup that featured 5yo's Mucho Macho Man, Fort Larned, Justin Phillip, Point of Entry & Pants On Fire, 7yo's Flat Out & Jeranimo... Not to mention 5yo mares Royal Delta, Authenticity, Groupie Doll, Tiz Flirtacious, Marketintg Mix, Laughing & Mizdirection.

Oh stop Steve. Females can't be gelded, do you need a biology lesson?

Do you think the best horse in training Wise Dan would be racing if he had balls?

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Oh stop Steve. Females can't be gelded, do you need a biology lesson?

Do you think the best horse in training Wise Dan would be racing if he had balls?

Instead of acknowledging that it seems there is a growing trend to keep horses around and expanding on the discuss. You elect to go with the inane.

you could have said the influx in additional older horses running is a direct result of the poor stallion market in 08-12 and the determination of owners that racing is more advantageous then crappy stallion deals...

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Instead of acknowledging that it seems there is a growing trend to keep horses around and expanding on the discuss. You elect to go with the inane.

you could have said the influx in additional older horses running is a direct result of the poor stallion market in 08-12 and the determination of owners that racing is more advantageous then crappy stallion deals...

MMM is 5, not 8. He also was still racing in part b/c he hadn't accomplished enough to get a better stallion deal. The idea that things have reversed in the last few years is inane. A slow trickle better....And the idea that Mizdirection's 2 start year should be embraced as a horse running when older is utterly ridiculous as well.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Oh stop Steve. Females can't be gelded, do you need a biology lesson?

Do you think the best horse in training Wise Dan would be racing if he had balls?

*yawn* A classic evasion of your completely wrong-headed original post...

Stallion-eligible colts/horses haven't been rushed off the last couple of years and we've have had a particularly nice group of older horses as a result. That's a inarguable fact. The mares were thrown in as additional evidence of owner/breeders providing extra seasons of pleasure for those that follow them.

In most cases, Wise Dan and most other top-performing geldings wouldn't be top performers had they not been gelded.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Kasept

*yawn* A classic evasion of your completely wrong-headed original post...

Stallion-eligible colts/horses haven't been rushed off the last couple of years and we've have had a particularly nice group of older horses as a result. That's a inarguable fact. The mares were thrown in as additional evidence of owner/breeders providing extra seasons of pleasure for those that follow them.

In most cases, Wise Dan and most other top-performing geldings wouldn't be top performers had they not been gelded.

A bit evasive on Wise Dan. Counter factual isn't an answer. We both know he would've been retired had he not been gelded....I'm shocked my comment has elicited that much debate. Saying Thank God for geldings is not exactly that big a deal but it's winter and I get it. Slow times.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

A bit evasive on Wise Dan. Counter factual isn't an answer. We both know he would've been retired had he not been gelded....I'm shocked my comment has elicited that much debate. Saying Thank God for geldings is not exactly that big a deal but it's winter and I get it. Slow times.

So obstinate and obtuse... Wise Dan almost certainly isn't the horse he is if he remains whole.. You can't even accept that fact? If they won't train and are studish and unfocused and constantly doing things to hurt themselves, they can't turn into the kind of horse he is. That's why they get gelded.

[randallscott35]

You left out Obfuscation...

I accept that. He would be pining the bottom level claimers at Parx with balls. Got it. Moving on.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by Kasept

So obstinate and obtuse... Wise Dan almost certainly isn't the horse he is if he remains whole.. You can't even accept that fact? If they won't train and are studish and unfocused and constantly doing things to hurt themselves, they can't turn into the kind of horse he is. That's why they get gelded.

All this is true. But it's also true what Randall was trying to get at. A non-gelded horse as good as Wise Dan most likely would have been off to the breeding shed after last year's BC.

--Dunbar

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Reaching for Hollendorfer today and will get answers..

Thanks!

This is a really intriguing 2yo.