Gander where are you?

Timmy,
With the Cardinals on the verge of going to the World Series, do you know understand my rants for years about how screwed up baseball's playoff system is?
Baseball was the only sport in which the regular season used to mean something. Its a game where moreso than any other sport that on a given night, or short series, ANy team can beat another team. The royals swept the Tigers to end the regular season.
They play 162 because in that type of long haul the best teams emerge and earn it. Now we have a joke of a 5 game series that not only is awful unto its own devices, but screws up and impacts the next series as well, because it screws up the pitching matchups.
Noone is gonna tell me that the Mets and Yankees weren't the two best teams in their leagues this year, and it looks like neither will make the WS.
You gonna tell me that the Cardinals deserve a WS trip with that regular season play.
Might as well put baseball in with the NHL, NBA, NCAA hoops, and NFL. regular season don't mean a hell of a lot.

[skippy3481]

The regular season does matter, it's how you enter the playoffs. Its not like 75% of the teams make it and a team that lost a hundred games is going to the world series. Once your in the post-season, everything changes. The yankees lost their series on their own accord. It's an atrocity to spend so much more then everyone else and come up with that team. I don't care about injuries, they happen to everyone.The best two teams shouldn't be gifted the world series, you still have to earn it.

[Crown@club]

I haven't heard of any comparisons of this Detroit team to the Chisox last year. Both were faultering down the stretch, while one won the WS, the other one looks strong to take care of it also.

Playoff format - 5 game series! Ask the '84 Cubs how they liked that!

What makes me sick is this 17-21(I'm using the NL in my rant) game series that each division team faces each other a year, while facing interleague games a total of 15 games (6 with interleague rival). That leaves 57 to 75 games left played with the 10-11 teams in their league. Thats an average of 6 or 7 games. I don't like it. I've been preaching this ever since I started to write for a roto-service. Gone are the Great Mets-Cubs rivalries as one example.

The Cards were a pathetic 3-10 against the pitiful Cubs before they won the next 5 of 6 games against them. I'm sure they had enough at the start of the season. 12 games thats enough give me another team.

I love baseball, but its starting to get boring to see the same thing every year. YAWN! How about the Dodgers face the Mets for 12 games in a season and the Giants also. Not the 7 and 6 respectively that they've done in recent years.

I guess those days are long gone.

Originally Posted by Crown@club

I haven't heard of any comparisons of this Detroit team to the Chisox last year. Both were faultering down the stretch, while one won the WS, the other one looks strong to take care of it also.

Playoff format - 5 game series! Ask the '84 Cubs how they liked that!

What makes me sick is this 17-21(I'm using the NL in my rant) game series that each division team faces each other a year, while facing interleague games a total of 15 games (6 with interleague rival). That leaves 57 to 75 games left played with the 10-11 teams in their league. Thats an average of 6 or 7 games. I don't like it. I've been preaching this ever since I started to write for a roto-service. Gone are the Great Mets-Cubs rivalries as one example.

The Cards were a pathetic 3-10 against the pitiful Cubs before they won the next 5 of 6 games against them. I'm sure they had enough at the start of the season. 12 games thats enough give me another team.

I love baseball, but its starting to get boring to see the same thing every year. YAWN! How about the Dodgers face the Mets for 12 games in a season and the Giants also. Not the 7 and 6 respectively that they've done in recent years.

I guess those days are long gone.

that's an excellent point, JS
I'd say cut it, and leave only one regional match-up
Cubs-Sox, Mets-Yankees, LA-LA, etc.
those are the only AL-NL matchups with big draws anyway
but I would definately make round one a best of 7

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Well, the Yankees were always going to be vulnerable in the playoffs to teams with excellent pitching.I must have told Oracle that 100 times this year.He refused to pay any attention.Gee,why did the Halos beat you last year in the playoffs? P I T C H I N G ....Why did a team like the Halos beat you 6 of 10 this year?....P I T C H I N G....... You say the Yankees were the best team in the A.L. this year,but it is tripe.The best team in the A.L. woke up and simply played to their potential.The Yankees deserve credit for playing very hard during the regular season.They do keep after it better than most anybody.The problem they have in the playoffs is that the bad teams are no longer around to beat up on.You have to face teams with good starters,and you have to face those teams with your mediocre starters.It hasn't worked for the last 6 years or so.Regardless of whether your expensive hitters didn't perform,or the opposing pitchers were too good.Forget that.Look at the runs YOU gave up.That's your problem.I know this problem well.The Dodgers scored enough runs in the 1st,and 3rd games against the Mets.Dodgers got like 15 hits in game 3.....5 runs should be enough to win a playoff game.Fact is that the Dodgers and Yanks got a similiar problem.Yes,you have a much better line-up,but neither team can stop good teams from scoring,and that's why both teams went bye-bye good night now in round 1.Pitching is elusive.If it was easy to buy,you would have done it.It is not always easy to know who will pitch good next season.Buying pitchers based on the last 5-10 years of results has not worked for you guys.Look at Weaver for the Cards.A total piece of dung for both the Dodgers,and the Halos.Goes to the Cards,and something clicked.It ain't always money.The right situation.The right pitching coach.The right manager.It is damn elusive.It is not like buying good hitters.

[SentToStud]

I'm convinced having a mix of young players as well as veterans is the right formula these days. The White Sox and RedSox got away with having veteran-filled rosters, but they went nowhere this year nor did the NYY. Who's to say the Yanks wouldn't have given Detroit a tougher series if Cabrera had gotten Sheffield's ABs? Tigers remind me a lot of the Marlins a few years ago. Good young pitching along with a mix of veteran and younger players. And you cannot overstate the importance of the manager and pitching coach. And while he won't be in the top 10 in MVP voting, it's arguable that no player was more important to his team's success this year than Pudge Rodriguez. One of my all-time favorite players.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by SentToStud

I'm convinced having a mix of young players as well as veterans is the right formula these days. The White Sox and RedSox got away with having veteran-filled rosters, but they went nowhere this year nor did the NYY. Who's to say the Yanks wouldn't have given Detroit a tougher series if Cabrera had gotten Sheffield's ABs? Tigers remind me a lot of the Marlins a few years ago. Good young pitching along with a mix of veteran and younger players. And you cannot overstate the importance of the manager and pitching coach. And while he won't be in the top 10 in MVP voting, it's arguable that no player was more important to his team's success this year than Pudge Rodriguez. One of my all-time favorite players.

Yo Bruce, I met Pudge when he was a rookie with the Rangers and I was at the Rangers spring training camp, at the time, the local newspaper were calling him the next Johnny Bench. Matter of fact, Tom House was the pitching coach at the time and my dad went up to him, House taught me what is called the 'karate chop' curve ball, no stress on the elbow for youngsters, and while I was practicing the pitch, none other the Ivan Rodriguez was catching, I was 11 years old at the time.

There you go Tim, argue with me about the playoff system now.
The team you wrote thread after thread talking about their "collapse" is heading to the World Series.
This is a new low for the tragic playoff sysytem in place.
I'm no Mets fan, but I admired what they did this year, and a team the 5th or 6th best record in the league after 162 games, is heading to the World Series instead of the Mets.
They've ruined baseball, and never again will we EVER have the best team from each league facing each other in the World Series in an epic showdown.
Wild Card team goes every year, and this year two wild card teams.
This is a disgrace, and its going to start impacting attendance and ratings on regular season games when people like myself begin have already begun to realize that they don't mean a damn thing anymore and never will as long as this playoff system is in place.

[dr. fager]

Originally Posted by oracle80

There you go Tim, argue with me about the playoff system now.
The team you wrote thread after thread talking about their "collapse" is heading to the World Series.
This is a new low for the tragic playoff sysytem in place.
I'm no Mets fan, but I admired what they did this year, and a team the 5th or 6th best record in the league after 162 games, is heading to the World Series instead of the Mets.
They've ruined baseball, and never again will we EVER have the best team from each league facing each other in the World Series in an epic showdown.
Wild Card team goes every year, and this year two wild card teams.
This is a disgrace, and its going to start impacting attendance and ratings on regular season games when people like myself begin have already begun to realize that they don't mean a damn thing anymore and never will as long as this playoff system is in place.

I understand your problem with the 5 game series, I really do....but the Mets just lost it in the NLCS, I'm not sure how I get that the system screwed them?

forgive me if I am wrong but didn't the Cards have TWO 10 game losing streaks throughout the season and then another 8 game losing streak near the end? I don't know what 1st place team could have gotten away with that in the old days...I'm guessing none~they do play in the biggest of the divisions so (but that's another unfair deal in neo-ball)...and then you have the Tigers who blew their division but still made the playoffs, that's not right
so I concur with Oracle something needs changin'!

to play Brain Cashman, I'd trade Sheffield to Seattle for Ichiro, Ichiro would be huge in NY, then I'd trade Abreau for a solid #3 starter, and I'd try and trade Giambi for a solid middle reliever who could also close, and start Andy Phillips at 1B, nobody would bite on ARod, in their right mind

Originally Posted by dr. fager

I understand your problem with the 5 game series, I really do....but the Mets just lost it in the NLCS, I'm not sure how I get that the system screwed them?

Then you aren't getting the full implications of that 5 game series, in more ways than one.
Its no accident that wild card teams keep killing em, especially in the first round.
But the greater effect is how it affects the rotations of the 2nd round.
In the old days when they two division winners met, they each threw their regular rotations in order, just like the regular season. #1 vs #1, etc.
teams are built by Gm's and managers for a five man rotation all year long, and then we change the rules now in the postseason.
Now depending on the first round and how long it takes either team, the pitching matchups can be completely screwed, #2 vs. #4, then #3 vs. #1, etc.
The postseason doesn't resemble the regular season even a little bit in how it plays out.
The bigger farce is that after 162 games, no team with a a record like the Cards belongs in poostseason play in the first place. This aint football with 16 games. This is 162 GAME SEASON!!!! Anyone whos ever played baseball knows that the worst team in the league can win 3 of 5 against the best team on any given series. You really think the Yanks were that much better than the red Sox when they swept em 5 games this year? No way. But baseball is a hot and cold and game of inches game much more than football or basketball or hockey. In those sports no way is the better team ever gonna lose a 3 of 5.
Baseball is much different. One hot pitcher or one error can cost you a game or two, and 5 games aint enough.
Not to mention the way it affects the rotations after that in teh 2nd series.
The regular season in baseball used to be the only regular season that mattered, now you have teams like the Cardinals limping in with an awful record who make the World Series. I guess those 162 regular season games lied huh?
I just hate what the playoff system has done. And to illustrate my point about how any team can beat any team in a series, the Tigers were swept at home to end the season by the worst team in the Majors, KC.
This is just awful for baseball and after the record low ratings they are gonna get this year, they are gonna have to tweak it.

[dr. fager]

I was specifically addressing the Mets...I think the loss of two people in their starting rotation had as much to do it as anything. I get the implications of the 5 game series, unfortunatley I don't see it changing. The revenue generated in the first round makes up for any loss when it comes to ratings and the world series. Detroit and St. Louis are decent markets to boot, you really think this one will have worse ratings than the Marlins/Indians in 97? Did the system change then?

I guess if your point that the Cardinals shouldn't be in...do you suggest taking the 4 best teams in the NL...if so scheduling would have to be tweaked in order to make it fair....meaning you can't have teams playing regional series the whole year and beating up people in their own weak divisions.

Also, where was the outcry last year when the Cards held the best record in baseball and got eliminated by the wildcard Astros? It just seems like now that the NY got teams got bounced it's become an issue.

1, 3, 5, or 7 games
the Yankees didn't seem to play with a lot of passion
they were right to go after Torre
we all love Torre, fans, NY, and his players
but if you fail to properly motivate
and your team becomes complacent
it's time for a change
you don't want to become the Braves

[skippy3481]

oracle,
Attendence at most major league ballparks have increased every year for the last five years. The yankees who haven't won a title in that time, have had their attendence increase for the last 5 years. So tell me how the postseason is going to hurt baseball. Seems like fans are coming to more games. Any thoughts on why?

[SCUDSBROTHER]

This system isn't gunna change.Yankees can continue to pile up wins against bad pitching during the regular season.You can buy those wins.You can buy yourself into a playoff spot. The reason you can't progress in the playoffs is because you have to either 1)hit good pitching,or 2)produce good pitching yourself.You did neither.The Tigers did both.The Cards produced some terrific pitching performances.They did not hit good pitching.It was unfortunate that the Mets threw so many bad pitches late in the games they lost.Mediocre pitching can often be bailed out by your hitters in the regular season.It is not always the case in the post.For instance,that late rally by the Mets last night would probably have won them that game against most teams (during the regular season.)In the post, it's a loss.So,a lot of these wins in the regular season are due to a team's ability to hit themselves out of pitching trouble.You can't rely on doing that in the post...They gone.Pitch better,or lose.The regular season favors the heavy- hitting/ mediocre- pitching teams.They are quickly found out in the post.